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Thread: Can President Obama Unilaterally Raise the Debt Ceiling?

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    Can President Obama Unilaterally Raise the Debt Ceiling?

    http://www.nytimes.com/2013/10/03/bu...n.html?hp&_r=0

    If the debt ceiling is not raised by [Oct 17], the Treasury estimates it will be left with about only $30 billion in cash, which would be used up in a matter of days.

    As a result, economists and investors have quietly begun to explore the options the White House might have in the event Congress fails to act.

    The most widely discussed strategy would be for President Obama to invoke authority under the 14th Amendment and essentially order the federal government to keep borrowing, an option that was endorsed by former President Bill Clinton during an earlier debt standoff in 2011.

    And in recent days, prominent Democrats like Senator Max Baucus, chairman of the Senate Finance Committee, and Representative Nancy Pelosi, the House minority leader, have urged the White House to seriously consider such a route, even if it might provoke a threat of impeachment from House Republicans and ultimately require the Supreme Court to rule on its legitimacy.

    Other potential October surprises range from the logistically forbidding, like prioritizing payments, issuing i.o.u.’s or selling off gold and other assets, to more fanciful ideas, like minting a trillion-dollar platinum coin.


    The trillion dollar coin idea, reminiscent of Mr. Burns, is based on a law that says that the US can mint a coin of pure platinum in any denomination, essentially giving us $1T extra to use in case of a looming default.

    If the effects of a debt default would be so grievous to the economy, would Obama see it necessary to use his authority to raise the debt ceiling himself?

    And where would it go from there?
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    Re: Can President Obama Unilaterally Raise the Debt Ceiling?

    This is like watching the Jersey shore in terms of stupidity. Now i never watched the jersey shore therefore i don't know who the hell would stand for this sort of crap.

    The debt limit needs to be raised. there is no ****ing alternative around it. And I shutter to think that due to congressional incompetence, the president would have to absorb more powers. Can you not see that this is the path to a less democratic society? A less free society? This is the path to tyranny.

    And no, it's not just republicans. All of congress is to blame for this idiocy because neither part cares about the country, all they care about is how they look. It's like they are playing a miss america contest. ****s.

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    Re: Can President Obama Unilaterally Raise the Debt Ceiling?

    Quote Originally Posted by Rainman05 View Post
    This is like watching the Jersey shore in terms of stupidity. Now i never watched the jersey shore therefore i don't know who the hell would stand for this sort of crap.

    The debt limit needs to be raised. there is no ****ing alternative around it. And I shutter to think that due to congressional incompetence, the president would have to absorb more powers. Can you not see that this is the path to a less democratic society? A less free society? This is the path to tyranny.

    And no, it's not just republicans. All of congress is to blame for this idiocy because neither part cares about the country, all they care about is how they look. It's like they are playing a miss america contest. ****s.
    A good example of this is when they passed a bill to exclusively restore funding to the TSA during the sequester because it directly effected them. Of course Obama let them do that without saying "That's cool that you want your flights to go more smoothly, but I'm vetoing unless you return funding to a program my constituency wants funded". I wish Obama understood the concept of "two can play that game".
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    Re: Can President Obama Unilaterally Raise the Debt Ceiling?

    Quote Originally Posted by aberrant85 View Post
    The most widely discussed strategy would be for President Obama to invoke authority under the 14th Amendment and essentially order the federal government to keep borrowing, an option that was endorsed by former President Bill Clinton during an earlier debt standoff in 2011.
    I think that, if in the meantime, there is no resolution regarding the shutdown, and if there's nothing promising sketched out for resolving the debt deal, he'll definitely do something like this. He'll be able to point to the measure as necessity in the face of Congress not functioning. It's no different than any other authority or power the executive branch has claimed for itself over the past few years, anyway. If Congress can't do its job and pay for the spending they've already legislated, then it's their fault if they cede more power to the executive.

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    Re: Can President Obama Unilaterally Raise the Debt Ceiling?

    Quote Originally Posted by sbrettt View Post
    A good example of this is when they passed a bill to exclusively restore funding to the TSA during the sequester because it directly effected them. Of course Obama let them do that without saying "That's cool that you want your flights to go more smoothly, but I'm vetoing unless you return funding to a program my constituency wants funded". I wish Obama understood the concept of "two can play that game".
    Obama is too stupid to know how to play any game except the "blame bush" game. I'm sorry, but it's the truth. he can't manage his job. He doesn't have the charm Reagan had, he doesn't have the balls Bush had, he doesn't have the know-how that Clinton had.
    And that would be ok if Congress would be filled with competent people who actually cared about their country. But that's not the case either.

    Anyway. It's not obama's fault this is the situation. Obama can't pass a budget and then still call himself the leader of a free and democratic country. He has to just act on the budget that is passed by Congress. He can submit a budget but that can be thrown out. The point is that the democrats in Congress are running a popularity contest and are lazy politically... they just want to get a free ride to the next election because they're too stupid to work with the current situation.. and the republicans are spiteful and angry and they're on autopilot: anything obama does, we need to attack it. If obama hugs a cat, we need to kill the cat. Morons.

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    Re: Can President Obama Unilaterally Raise the Debt Ceiling?

    I've pondered the constitutionality of a debt ceiling in the first place. We're constitutionally barred from defaulting, but when spending is mandated by law and a borrowing limit exists, that leaves a situation in which default is necessary. Which is exactly what Congress has done, they've passed legislation throughout our nations history that has created this spending problem. You can't just stop paying for things your own laws say you're going to pay for.
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    Re: Can President Obama Unilaterally Raise the Debt Ceiling?

    Quote Originally Posted by aberrant85 View Post
    http://www.nytimes.com/2013/10/03/bu...n.html?hp&_r=0

    If the debt ceiling is not raised by [Oct 17], the Treasury estimates it will be left with about only $30 billion in cash, which would be used up in a matter of days.

    As a result, economists and investors have quietly begun to explore the options the White House might have in the event Congress fails to act.

    The most widely discussed strategy would be for President Obama to invoke authority under the 14th Amendment and essentially order the federal government to keep borrowing, an option that was endorsed by former President Bill Clinton during an earlier debt standoff in 2011.

    And in recent days, prominent Democrats like Senator Max Baucus, chairman of the Senate Finance Committee, and Representative Nancy Pelosi, the House minority leader, have urged the White House to seriously consider such a route, even if it might provoke a threat of impeachment from House Republicans and ultimately require the Supreme Court to rule on its legitimacy.

    Other potential October surprises range from the logistically forbidding, like prioritizing payments, issuing i.o.u.’s or selling off gold and other assets, to more fanciful ideas, like minting a trillion-dollar platinum coin.


    The trillion dollar coin idea, reminiscent of Mr. Burns, is based on a law that says that the US can mint a coin of pure platinum in any denomination, essentially giving us $1T extra to use in case of a looming default.

    If the effects of a debt default would be so grievous to the economy, would Obama see it necessary to use his authority to raise the debt ceiling himself?

    And where would it go from there?
    Exactly what do they think in the 14th amendment gives him such authority?

    The fed is claiming that if we fail to borrow more money, then we will default upon loans already made. If we are borrowing money to pay loans, then whether we nose dive today or 10 years from now, we are still in a death spiral of debt. If raising interest rates is going to have such a detrimental affect upon the economy, then that is a clear sign that the economy is based upon credit not reality. In other words, we're ****ed. It's going to crash, Obama and the Dems are just trying to not have it crash while they are hold the White House. In other words, they want to keep borrowing to hide the problem until an opportunity arises to blame it on a Rep.

    The government doesn't need to borrow more money. They need to tighten spending to end this credit death spiral. They also need a thorough review of laws affecting business, chunk out totally or reduce any that are driving business away from America. Americans need tighten their own budgets and reduce then eliminate unnecessary debt from the overuse of credit. Americans also need to start finding representatives that will work to end this death spiral today, not those who promise to not spend increases in tax revenue in some future congress which most of them won't even be members of and who can override anything they promise now anyway. Time to stop passing it on and do something about it NOW!
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    Re: Can President Obama Unilaterally Raise the Debt Ceiling?

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    Re: Can President Obama Unilaterally Raise the Debt Ceiling?

    Good lord, the silly "14th Amendment" thing again. That is an absurd reading of it made up on the spot to try to give the President a power he absolutely does not have.
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    Re: Can President Obama Unilaterally Raise the Debt Ceiling?

    I most definitely believe Pres Obama will do this. Then the Supreme Court will get it, rule on it in like 4 years, say it was unconstitutional, and Pres Obama will be sitting back with this look on his face:
    images (1).jpg
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