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Thread: Obama Address the Nation on the government shutdown.

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    Re: Obama Address the Nation on the government shutdown.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kal'Stang View Post
    Umm...you have a warped definition of "terrorist" if you are equating the government shut down and tea baggers as being terroristic.
    Clearly I am not saying that the teabaggers are "terrorists" in the same sense of the word as violent terrorists. However, the ploy involved is exactly the same type of ploy used by terrorists/kidnappers....in any attempt to force negotiations over something that there is nothing to negotiate about. The ACA passed both houses of congress, it was signed into law....it was upheld by the Supreme Court. Now...because the teabaggers don't like it, they essentially want to put a gun to America's head and say, unless you negotiate we are going to shut down the government? That is not the way congressmen should act...it is irresponsible, childish and gamesmanship at its worst.
    <font size=5><b>Its been several weeks since the Vegas shooting.  Its it still "Too Early" or can we start having the conversation about finally doing something about these mass shootings???​</b></font>

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    Re: Obama Address the Nation on the government shutdown.

    Quote Originally Posted by disneydude View Post
    LOL.....nice attempt at spin...but sorry Conservative....the American people aren't buying it. BTW....there is nothing to negotiate. The ACA passed Congress and was signed into law.....it was upheld by the Supreme Court of the United States. The teabaggers who have the Republican party by the balls are attempting to do the same thing to America...but unfortunately for them, America isn't going to wimp out the way that the GOP has to the teabaggers. America sees the GOP for what it has become....a complete and utter joke.
    The low information voter which apparently you are will always buy the propaganda from the source that you want to believe. There is nothing to ever negotiate with this President, he can exempt whoever he wants and the rest of us sit back and take it. How liberal of you. Love being part of that joke you claim us "teabaggers" are as we can all see exactly what kind of person you are with everyone of your posts. Unlike you I understand what the T.E.A. Party stands for, I understand what the original TEA Party did, and unlike you, I understand the role of the Federal Govt.

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    Re: Obama Address the Nation on the government shutdown.

    Finally, Obama calls it like it is: a bunch of rightwing lunatics trying to undertake a coup by imposing their discredited policies on an electorate that rejected their weirdness.

    Republicans, you lost. Get used to it. There's more of it coming!

  4. #174
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    Re: Obama Address the Nation on the government shutdown.

    Quote Originally Posted by disneydude View Post
    Clearly I am not saying that the teabaggers are "terrorists" in the same sense of the word as violent terrorists. However, the ploy involved is exactly the same type of ploy used by terrorists/kidnappers....in any attempt to force negotiations over something that there is nothing to negotiate about. The ACA passed both houses of congress, it was signed into law....it was upheld by the Supreme Court. Now...because the teabaggers don't like it, they essentially want to put a gun to America's head and say, unless you negotiate we are going to shut down the government? That is not the way congressmen should act...it is irresponsible, childish and gamesmanship at its worst.
    If you don't mean "terrorist" then don't use the word. Hyperbole only degrades your arguement. It does not add to it.

    And yes, it did pass both houses of Congress and Senate. But then so did a lot of other F'd up laws through out history. It being passed by them is certainly not indictitive that it was a good law to pass. As far as SCOTUS goes, at best it was passed on a technicality of the mandate being linked to the IRS and therefore a "tax". Despite what Roberts (I believe it was him...correct me if I'm wrong) said in the mandate being a "tax" that was BS and everyone knows it. Even Obama stated that it was not a tax. But again, it wouldn't be the first time that SCOTUS also upheld some F'd up laws. Sure it won't be the last either.

    Now, despite both houses and SCOTUS upholding it does not mean that the opposing side (in this case republicans) does not have the right to try and get it tossed in any way possible. Democrats have used the system in dispicable ways in order to not only get things passed but to stall things that they didn't want also. Indeed this tactic is hardly new and has been used multiple times on both sides of the fence. Yet if people are partisan enough they will always ignore that fact and only claim that only the "opposing side" does it...or at the very least they will just flat out ignore any statement showing that...and other times just deflect or claim "its apples and oranges!".
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    Re: Obama Address the Nation on the government shutdown.

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post
    The low information voter which apparently you are will always buy the propaganda from the source that you want to believe. There is nothing to ever negotiate with this President, he can exempt whoever he wants and the rest of us sit back and take it. How liberal of you. Love being part of that joke you claim us "teabaggers" are as we can all see exactly what kind of person you are with everyone of your posts. Unlike you I understand what the T.E.A. Party stands for, I understand what the original TEA Party did, and unlike you, I understand the role of the Federal Govt.
    Sorry Charlie....but America should not...and will never negotiate with people who engage in "terroristic-type" strategies. The American people are by overwhelming numbers aware of the gamesmanship and aren't buying into the ploys any more than I am.
    <font size=5><b>Its been several weeks since the Vegas shooting.  Its it still "Too Early" or can we start having the conversation about finally doing something about these mass shootings???​</b></font>

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    Re: Obama Address the Nation on the government shutdown.

    Quote Originally Posted by disneydude View Post
    Sorry Charlie....but America should not...and will never negotiate with people who engage in "terroristic-type" strategies. The American people are by overwhelming numbers aware of the gamesmanship and aren't buying into the ploys any more than I am.
    You really have a sickness, seek help. You have no idea of what is going on in govt. or what the GOP actually proposed or is doing. "Your" President is a fraud and you continue to buy the rhetoric. All this has to be for attention.

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    Re: Obama Address the Nation on the government shutdown.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kal'Stang View Post
    Umm...you have a warped definition of "terrorist" if you are equating the government shut down and tea baggers as being terroristic.
    Actually in this case I think the hyperbole is justified. There really is no difference between this and a hostage negotiation.

    The Tea Party wants to get rid of the ACA even though they have no legislative means to do so. In a hostage situation the hostage takers want money even though they've done nothing to earn it.

    In order to gain leverage the Tea Party is threatening a prolonged shutdown and possible default. The Tea Party don't gain anything from a government shutdown and will be hurt badly by a default. However, they are betting that the country will suffer from a prolonged shut-down or default enough that the Democrats would be unwilling to risk it. In a hostage situation, the hostage is the leverage. Killing the hostage does the hostage takers no good, and will likely result in their deaths. But, the hostage takers are betting that the pain of losing the hostages is enough to warrant giving into their demands.

    Finally, just as in a hostage situation, one should never negotiate. Yes, this time the hostage takers may give the hostage back safely, but what about the next time? Or the time after that?

    The Republicans aren't offering to give up something they want. They're offering to not do something that will harm them some, but will harm the country more. They're not negotiating, they're threatening because they can't achieve their goals through the legislative process. That's exactly what a terrorist does and why they do it.

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    Re: Obama Address the Nation on the government shutdown.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kal'Stang View Post
    If you don't mean "terrorist" then don't use the word. Hyperbole only degrades your arguement. It does not add to it.

    And yes, it did pass both houses of Congress and Senate. But then so did a lot of other F'd up laws through out history. It being passed by them is certainly not indictitive that it was a good law to pass. As far as SCOTUS goes, at best it was passed on a technicality of the mandate being linked to the IRS and therefore a "tax". Despite what Roberts (I believe it was him...correct me if I'm wrong) said in the mandate being a "tax" that was BS and everyone knows it. Even Obama stated that it was not a tax. But again, it wouldn't be the first time that SCOTUS also upheld some F'd up laws. Sure it won't be the last either.

    Now, despite both houses and SCOTUS upholding it does not mean that the opposing side (in this case republicans) does not have the right to try and get it tossed in any way possible. Democrats have used the system in dispicable ways in order to not only get things passed but to stall things that they didn't want also. Indeed this tactic is hardly new and has been used multiple times on both sides of the fence. Yet if people are partisan enough they will always ignore that fact and only claim that only the "opposing side" does it...or at the very least they will just flat out ignore any statement showing that...and other times just deflect or claim "its apples and oranges!".


    You do so by acting professional and through the legislative process....not by throwing tantrums and holding the American people hostage. You are absolutely wrong about one thing. You don't accomplish it "by any means necessary". You do so by the standards of decorum and processes that our legislative government is established on. Gamesmanship and terroristic-type ploys to try to force negotiations are not the way to do it...and fortunately, the American people overwhelmingly knows who is engaging in childish behavior here.
    <font size=5><b>Its been several weeks since the Vegas shooting.  Its it still "Too Early" or can we start having the conversation about finally doing something about these mass shootings???​</b></font>

  9. #179
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    Re: Obama Address the Nation on the government shutdown.

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post
    You really have a sickness, seek help. You have no idea of what is going on in govt. or what the GOP actually proposed or is doing. "Your" President is a fraud and you continue to buy the rhetoric. All this has to be for attention.
    LOL....says the man who actually believes that 911 occurred on Clinton's watch.....GWB captured and killed Bin Laden and then led America down the road to economic utopia. The fact that you still believe your own fictions show all too clear that it is You sir who hasn't a clue on the realities or the workings of Government. Turn off your right-wing radio.....and perhaps trying picking up a newspaper or doing a little research of your own some time.
    <font size=5><b>Its been several weeks since the Vegas shooting.  Its it still "Too Early" or can we start having the conversation about finally doing something about these mass shootings???​</b></font>

  10. #180
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    Re: Obama Address the Nation on the government shutdown.

    Quote Originally Posted by disneydude View Post
    You do so by acting professional and through the legislative process....not by throwing tantrums and holding the American people hostage. You are absolutely wrong about one thing. You don't accomplish it "by any means necessary". You do so by the standards of decorum and processes that our legislative government is established on. Gamesmanship and terroristic-type ploys to try to force negotiations are not the way to do it...and fortunately, the American people overwhelmingly knows who is engaging in childish behavior here.
    I agree, it should be done with decorum and professionalism. But that is not the way reality is. As I said before, both democrats and republicans have used the same exact tactic lots of times and found it acceptable behavior. Yet this time its "wrong" its "terrorist type behavior"? It is either wrong all the time no matter the party or it is not wrong and acceptable no matter the party. You cannot have it both ways.
    I have an answer for everything...you may not like the answer or it may not satisfy your curiosity..but it will still be an answer. ~ Kal'Stang

    My mind and my heart are saying I'm in my twenties. My body is pointing at my mind and heart and laughing its ass off. ~ Kal'Stang

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