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Thread: CNN Poll: GOP would bear the brunt of shutdown blame [W:176:468]

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    Re: CNN Poll: GOP would bear the brunt of shutdown blame [W:176:468]

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post
    And you missed the point that the taxpayers pay debt service on a cash basis and debt service is the fourth largest budget item. What purpose does it serve to post a totally worthless chart like you just posted? When you give your money to the govt. it is owed back to you due to promises made, when it is replaced with an IOU it is an obligation thus a long term liability.

    Again, please read the article and see if that light bulb will go off. I keep wondering what it is about liberals like you who cannot accept reality. Further what exact purpose does it serve other than to divert from Obama to continue to debate the so called Clinton surplus which really didn't exist?

    The Myth of the Clinton Surplus |
    How about a non-biased link like the factcheck one I gave? Your link is to a rightwing blog....that is written by an equally blind zealot.. The blind leading the blind is not a rebuttal, sorry.

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    Re: CNN Poll: GOP would bear the brunt of shutdown blame [W:176:468]

    Quote Originally Posted by iguanaman View Post
    How about a non-biased link like the factcheck one I gave? Your link is to a rightwing blog....that is written by an equally blind zealot.. The blind leading the blind is not a rebuttal, sorry.
    The link references the Treasury data link that I post over and over again. It is obvious that there is no link that will satisfy your ignorance. The facts are quite evident, debt went up each year and if there was as surplus that debt wouldn't go up each year. Debt service is part of the budget so any so called surplus pays for the debt service so I know this is hard for you to understand, liberals lie for personal gain and all this shows is how little credibility liberals have. What you don't seem to understand is that the blog reports Treasury Dept Data so you want to refute the Treasury data based upon the person who reported it is typical liberal excuses.

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    Re: CNN Poll: GOP would bear the brunt of shutdown blame [W:176:468]

    Quote Originally Posted by iguanaman View Post
    And you are so typical of a desperate Righty. You cannot face the truth because it conflicts with you twisted world view. Like a religous zealot defending creation to a scientist,. all you have is "faith" which is another way of saying you only see what you want to see. Because of that the rest of this post will look blank to you. The rest of us will see the truth though.




    The Budget and Deficit Under Clinton
    This chart claims a "surplus" of 236.2B. Once again, the CBO followed the instructions from the Dems to produce some number they wanted produced. But where's the money? They show some number's representing money but where did that money go if it was a "surplus"? As a taxpayer, I didn't get a rebate. As a taxpayer, my taxes were not reduced by my share of this phony "surplus". The federal debt kept right on increasing those years and that would be impossible if there was a "surplus".

    Once again, show me this "surplus". Where is that money?
    "“If we don’t deepen our ports all along the Gulf — places like Charleston, South Carolina; or Savannah, Georgia; or Jacksonville, Florida…” -Obama

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    Re: CNN Poll: GOP would bear the brunt of shutdown blame [W:176:468]

    Quote Originally Posted by ItAin'tFree View Post
    This chart claims a "surplus" of 236.2B. Once again, the CBO followed the instructions from the Dems to produce some number they wanted produced. But where's the money? They show some number's representing money but where did that money go if it was a "surplus"? As a taxpayer, I didn't get a rebate. As a taxpayer, my taxes were not reduced by my share of this phony "surplus". The federal debt kept right on increasing those years and that would be impossible if there was a "surplus".

    Once again, show me this "surplus". Where is that money?
    Makes you wonder what it is about liberalism that creates this kind of loyalty that ignores actual verifiable data and buys what a agency that takes Congressional data and assumptions and puts them into analysis based upon that data. If the data is wrong the output is wrong. The one thing that will never change is Treasury Data and that Treasury Data is what the Taxpayers pay debt service on. Clinton took office with a 4.4 trillion debt and left it at 5.7 trillion. I don't see the surpluses in any Treasury Data numbers but in the liberal world that is irrelevant. In the real world however we paid debt service on an apparent liberal reported surplus. I want my money back for that debt service.

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    Re: CNN Poll: GOP would bear the brunt of shutdown blame [W:176]

    Quote Originally Posted by calamity View Post
    Unlike you, I can read a graph.
    Why is that graph 4 years old?

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    Re: CNN Poll: GOP would bear the brunt of shutdown blame [W:176:468]

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post
    The link references the Treasury data link that I post over and over again. It is obvious that there is no link that will satisfy your ignorance. The facts are quite evident, debt went up each year and if there was as surplus that debt wouldn't go up each year. Debt service is part of the budget so any so called surplus pays for the debt service so I know this is hard for you to understand, liberals lie for personal gain and all this shows is how little credibility liberals have. What you don't seem to understand is that the blog reports Treasury Dept Data so you want to refute the Treasury data based upon the person who reported it is typical liberal excuses.
    You have been duped by your own partisanship. The reason the treasury shows debt going up is because it is money the govt. owes trust funds.
    Here's a post that explains your mistake. Don''t feel bad it is easy to believe what you MUST to keep your fantasy alive. It's a bitch to live in a dream world. Don't you at least find yourself wondering why you have to get all your info from right wing blogs?

    You and Craig Steiner need a refresher course in government accounting. Receipts into any federal trust fund INCREASE the public debt, they do not reduce it. This is because the funds are immediately invested in Treasury securities so as to earn interest until obligated and expended, and any issuance of Treasury securities increases the public debt. When expended, Treasury securities are redeemed by the trust funds and the cash is used to fund the outlays authorized. This causes public debt to go down. Thus, an increase in debt associated with these trust funds is evidence of a SURPLUS of taxes and other receipts over expenditures made. You are trying to use one surplus to argue that another one didn't exist.
    You and Steiner are hardly the only ones who are "confused" as to the actual relationship between debt and deficit. Many bogus right-wing articles try to pull the very same hoax. Just because the numbers they use are taken from valid sources does not mean that the numbers are being used correctly, and in these cases, they most definitely are not.
    Bottom line is that the Clinton surpluses were quite real and there is nothing that can magically go back and erase them. Just as real were the ten-year budget projections of surplus upon surplus that Bushie walked in and destroyed in favor of his tax cuts for the rich programs that have served us so well since. Real and projected surpluses to god-awful real and projected deficits. This is the path that the right-wingers have walked us down. Nice going, guys.
    Read more: Surplus Myth exposed again (generations, economic, national debt, money) - Democrats, Republicans, Libertarians, Conservatives, Liberals, Third Parties, Left-Wing, Right-Wing, Congress, President - Page 2 - City-Data Forum
    Last edited by iguanaman; 10-04-13 at 01:37 PM.

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    Re: CNN Poll: GOP would bear the brunt of shutdown blame [W:176]

    Quote Originally Posted by Lord of Planar View Post
    Why is that graph 4 years old?
    Because that was the fist one to pop up.

    Here's a current one...as if it matters.



    Notice how the recession was much deeper than the one in 2001, but seems to be following along the same change-rate path.

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    Re: CNN Poll: GOP would bear the brunt of shutdown blame [W:176:468]

    Quote Originally Posted by iguanaman View Post
    You really do yourself a disservice by mentioning how Obama saved the Bush tax cuts but not how he ended them. It shows your narrow minded partisanship.The deficit is HALF of what it was when Obama took office. Bush took a surplus and turned it into record deficits. That is how to judge the financial prudence of a President. By which direction he moves the deficit. Bush fails miserably as do every Republican before him since Reagan.

    I challenge you to prove that chart correct.

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    Re: CNN Poll: GOP would bear the brunt of shutdown blame [W:176:468]

    Quote Originally Posted by JMak00 View Post
    The deficit is meaningless...it's the national debt held by the fed govt that matters. Obama, if Presidents are to be held responsible,has increased that by 90%, despite deficits being smaller. Quite a feat, no?

    So, take your head out of the sand.
    Yep.

    As long as there is a deficit, the debt is increasing. Not decreasing.

    Do liberals not understand this concept?

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    Re: CNN Poll: GOP would bear the brunt of shutdown blame [W:176:468]

    Quote Originally Posted by iguanaman View Post
    And you are so typical of a desperate Righty. You cannot face the truth because it conflicts with you twisted world view. Like a religous zealot defending creation to a scientist,. all you have is "faith" which is another way of saying you only see what you want to see. Because of that the rest of this post will look blank to you. The rest of us will see the truth though.




    The Budget and Deficit Under Clinton

    That image is an intellectual lie.

    Riddle me this.

    If Clinton had a surplus, why did the debt increase all of those years?

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