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Boy punished for air soft guns in yard

Re: Boy expelled for air soft guns in yard

MaggieD said:
If you're complaining about the reason, I'm with you there. If I were that student's parents, I would fight to get that changed. Right after I threw his "replica firearm" in the garbage.
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Why are you so anti-gun? How do you overcome the inability to drive a car.......driver's school. How do you overcome the inability to handle a firearm.......firearms training. You don't solve the problem by throwing the gun into the garbage.
 
Re: Boy expelled for air soft guns in yard

tererun said:
You are absolutely correct. Airsoft guns are often considered much more toy like because they fire plastic BBs. Eye protection should be worn at all times. I have seen the results first hand. One of the refs at the PB field i worked at was shot in the face without protection by one of these guns on FA and had to get stitches in his cheek. I do not know what others around here may be thinking, but had that been an inch or two up he would have lost his eye. What is worse is the field owner was the one who accidentally shot him because of a light trigger pull.

You can do a lot of things with medicine, but replacing an eye is not one of them. Plus, wtf are they doing shooting it up around people? It is one thing if everyone is playing a game and is part of it, but the projectiles do not stop simply because you miss. I have seen some dumb ass renegade player who pick some of the stupidest places right in the middle of regular people to play. What the hell are those stupid parents thinking? I do not buy they were not at the bus stop. If you are in the middle of nowhere with no one around playing, how the hell is someone going to see you and report you to the school? No, these kids are lying like any other kid who did something stupid, and I do not buy it. Oh, and you can bet your ass if they were shooting at unprotected people the pets in the area have gotten a few shots too. I have spent way too much time with stupid people and "toy" guns to think these kids were playing safely and do not deserve a good punishment. Unfortunately since the parents are dumbasses they will have to deal with a long suspension from school. I wish the parents got punished along with them for being stupid enough to let kids run around their neighborhood shooting unprotected people with something that could blind someone.

Oh, and before someone says something stupid about they might not aim for the face, I spent many years as a ref, and it doesn't matter if a person is not aiming for the face, sometimes you get hit there.
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Calm down, we get the safety violation, dude. But that doesn't mean the kid needs to be expelled from school. You send him to a training class or make him work at an airsoft range so he learns safe use of the equipment. What are you trying to do, create a high school dropout?
 
Re: Boy expelled for air soft guns in yard

American said:
Calm down, we get the safety violation, dude. But that doesn't mean the kid needs to be expelled from school. You send him to a training class or make him work at an airsoft range so he learns safe use of the equipment. What are you trying to do, create a high school dropout?
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That seems to be the thing to do now. If there's a kid that might be troubled, don't bother trying to help him, just expel him from school. The schools claim they don't have the time nor the energy to spend on those who are "unwilling" to learn and follow the rules, but it seems as if they have plenty of time and energy to expend on incidents that happen away from school, and want to suspend kids because of such incidents.

Really, expulsion is NOT even a punishment for most kids. It's like the school determines that "this kid" is not worth it. I think a real problem is that we have a bunch of people working for the school systems who just don't really CARE about kids, and making their jobs easier seems to take the front seat.

Edit: Actually, I should probably restate the above to say that children don't SEE expulsion as a punishment, but it really is. They NEED an education to get anywhere in life.
 
Re: Boy expelled for air soft guns in yard

ChrisL said:
That seems to be the thing to do now. If there's a kid that might be troubled, don't bother trying to help him, just expel him from school. The schools claim they don't have the time nor the energy to spend on those who are "unwilling" to learn and follow the rules, but it seems as if they have plenty of time and energy to expend on incidents that happen away from school, and want to suspend kids because of such incidents.

Really, expulsion is NOT even a punishment for most kids. It's like the school determines that "this kid" is not worth it. I think a real problem is that we have a bunch of people working for the school systems who just don't really CARE about kids, and making their jobs easier seems to take the front seat.

Edit: Actually, I should probably restate the above to say that children don't SEE expulsion as a punishment, but it really is. They NEED an education to get anywhere in life.
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I'd just love to see this stuff happen to the principals and school board officials, watch how policies change in seconds.
 
Re: Boy expelled for air soft guns in yard

American said:
I'd just love to see this stuff happen to the principals and school board officials, watch how policies change in seconds.
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See what happen? Them get shot with an air gun? :lol:
 
Re: Boy expelled for air soft guns in yard

ChrisL said:
See what happen? Them get shot with an air gun? :lol:
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That's a fun thought, but it would illustrate to the ignorant officials how real life works. There are a lot of PhD types or politicians hanging around these boards, who I think live in Lala-land when it comes to school policy and academics.
 
Re: Boy expelled for air soft guns in yard

American said:
That's a fun thought, but it would illustrate to the ignorant officials how real life works. There are a lot of PhD types or politicians hanging around these boards, who I think live in Lala-land when it comes to school policy and academics.
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There are? Where? Let me at em! :2razz:
 
Re: Boy expelled for air soft guns in yard

I don't know why the school is involved if this didn't happen on school property. And I always feel like there are better answer than expulsion. But here are some quotes about airgun safety from the manufacturers of the things:

AIRGUNS ARE NOT TOYS. RESPONSIBLE ADULT SUPERVISION IS REQUIRED. MISUSE OR CARELESS USE MAY CAUSE SERIOUS INJURY OR DEATH.

NEVER PLAY with your airgun. It is a potentially dangerous weapon that can cause serious harm or death.

Store airgun, airsoft or paintball guns. and pellets separately beyond the reach of children. Make sure the airgun and pellets are locked and secured so children and untrained individuals will be denied access.

NEVER ALLOW THE MUZZLE TO POINT IN THE DIRECTION OF A PERSON.


IMO, kids should not be using airguns except under the supervision of adults. It's the parents who should be punished.
 
Re: Boy expelled for air soft guns in yard

Krhazy said:
I don't know why the school is involved if this didn't happen on school property. And I always feel like there are better answer than expulsion. But here are some quotes about airgun safety from the manufacturers of the things:

AIRGUNS ARE NOT TOYS. RESPONSIBLE ADULT SUPERVISION IS REQUIRED. MISUSE OR CARELESS USE MAY CAUSE SERIOUS INJURY OR DEATH.

NEVER PLAY with your airgun. It is a potentially dangerous weapon that can cause serious harm or death.

Store airgun, airsoft or paintball guns. and pellets separately beyond the reach of children. Make sure the airgun and pellets are locked and secured so children and untrained individuals will be denied access.

NEVER ALLOW THE MUZZLE TO POINT IN THE DIRECTION OF A PERSON.


IMO, kids should not be using airguns except under the supervision of adults. It's the parents who should be punished.
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Yeah, in some peoples minds kids should use 'water wings', and stay in the shallow end of the pool until age 18 as well, but thank goodness those people don't have a say in the raising of other peoples children....It is up to the parents to determine what they think is safe for their own children on their own property, whether it is stupid or not is not up to you, or me.
 
Montecresto said:
I can't wait to see this defended. It seems zero tolerance should be for the real thing. Boys have been known to show up with real guns in back packs. No tolerance for that is appropriate.


VIRGINIA BEACH, Va. (WAVY) - A seventh grade Virginia Beach student previously suspended for shooting an airsoft gun has been expelled, WAVY.com has learned.

During a hearing Tuesday morning, Aidan Clark was expelled in a unanimous vote. The fate of Khalid Caraballo remains unknown at this time.

Like thousands of others in Hampton Roads, Khalid Caraballo plays with airsoft guns. Caraballo and his friend Aidan were suspended because they shot two other friends who were with them while playing with the guns as they waited for the school bus.

The two seventh graders say they never went to the bus stop; they fired the airsoft guns while on Caraballo's private property.

Aidan’s father, Tim Clark, told WAVY.com what happened next lacks commons sense. The children were suspended for possession, handling and use of a firearm.


WAVY - Has zero tolerance gone too far | WAVY.com | Virginia Beach
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A airgun is not a firearm,a firearm launches a projectile by the means of an explosive. A airgun does not do this. This did not happen on school property.So the school has absolutely no business punishing students for things that happen off of school grounds.What a child does off school property is none of the school's business.
 
Re: Boy expelled for air soft guns in yard

American said:
Why are you so anti-gun? How do you overcome the inability to drive a car.......driver's school. How do you overcome the inability to handle a firearm.......firearms training. You don't solve the problem by throwing the gun into the garbage.
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Well, this was the second time the kid got in trouble with it. I do, though, like your approach of firearms training. There's only one problem with that. The whole family needs it. ;)

I'm also one of those old-fashioned gals who believes that perks, like airsoft guns, are earned.
 
Re: Boy expelled for air soft guns in yard

MaggieD said:
Well, this was the second time the kid got in trouble with it. I do, though, like your approach of firearms training. There's only one problem with that. The whole family needs it. ;)

I'm also one of those old-fashioned gals who believes that perks, like airsoft guns, are earned.
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Well if this boy has a history of causing trouble, then maybe I could understand the actions of the school more. Of course we never know the WHOLE story, just what the media decides to tell us.
 
Re: Boy expelled for air soft guns in yard

ChrisL said:
Well if this boy has a history of causing trouble, then maybe I could understand the actions of the school more. Of course we never know the WHOLE story, just what the media decides to tell us.
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Yes, you're right. We often don't know the rest of the story. I did just re-read the entire article. And three of the boys are suspended until a hearing in January. Now that seems excessive. And I would be furious. A public education is a child's right. I don't think anyone can deny that the school's pushing its boundaries by getting involved in the first place.

Scheduling a hearing at least 90 days after this incident that results in that long a suspension is beyond the pale.
 
Re: Boy expelled for air soft guns in yard

ChrisL said:
Well if this boy has a history of causing trouble, then maybe I could understand the actions of the school more. Of course we never know the WHOLE story, just what the media decides to tell us.
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Does the school know the whole story? We don't know, but too often you get knee jerk reactions from school administrators.
 
Re: Boy expelled for air soft guns in yard

Maybe the school overstepped their boundaries, however don't you all realize - if the cops were called ( and if my child was hit by an airsoft gun waiting for her bus you bet your ass I would call the cops) the kids would have been taken down to the youth detention ( juvie) and most likely be given about 3-6 months detention for assault charges. Then they would have missed school during that time and would be released from the school and then probably would have to go to an alternative school anyway at that point. So they either have assault charges on their record or the expulsion from school. Either way, they are going to be out of school all the same and they need some kind of consequence for shooting innocent bystanders.
 
Re: Boy expelled for air soft guns in yard

The school bus stop is school property. I learned this in my CHL class last Saturday. The boys shot their airsoft guns at students that were standing on school property. That is not for debate.

I had a Daisy BB gun at about the same age. You never point a gun at another person. That and treat all guns as loaded is all you really need to know about gun safety. Them boys got in trouble. If I had done similar with my BB gun, I would have been suspended, had my BB gun taken away, and been grounded for months.

No sympathy from me.
 
jamesrage said:
A airgun is not a firearm,a firearm launches a projectile by the means of an explosive. A airgun does not do this. This did not happen on school property.So the school has absolutely no business punishing students for things that happen off of school grounds.What a child does off school property is none of the school's business.
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Semantics. They aren't being treated as though they shot someone with a gun. (that tends to involve prison time)

Bus stop counts as school grounds during the pickup and dropoff process.

And it's the second time these kids have proven themselves irresponsible with a dangerous device.
 
Re: Boy expelled for air soft guns in yard

d0gbreath said:
The school bus stop is school property. I learned this in my CHL class last Saturday. The boys shot their airsoft guns at students that were standing on school property. That is not for debate.
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It's not? Quote me where in the story it says the other boys being shot at were standing at the bus stop. I must've missed that because I don't remember that being stated.
 
Re: Boy expelled for air soft guns in yard

Zyphlin said:
It's not? Quote me where in the story it says the other boys being shot at were standing at the bus stop. I must've missed that because I don't remember that being stated.
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The boys were suspended because they shot two other friends who were with them while playing with the guns as they waited for the school bus September 12.
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If they are waiting for the school bus, they are on school grounds, no matter where they are standing at the time. Yes, even in someone's yard.
 
Re: Boy expelled for air soft guns in yard

d0gbreath said:
If they are waiting for the school bus, they are on school grounds, no matter where they are standing at the time. Yes, even in someone's yard.
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That says they were waiting for the school bus, that does not say they were at the bus stop.

My bus stop was very near my home while growing up. It wasn't uncommon for me and the neighbor kids to play around in the yard prior to the bus coming as we were waiting; heading down to the stop a minute before it typically came or just as we saw it pulling to the stop.

Notice to the left of your bolded comment where it says "other friends who were with them while playing", and notice in the story where it notes that the location of WHERE they were playing...in their yard, not at the bus stop.

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Just re-read yourp ost and realized you weren't claiming he was at the bus stop but rather that the bus stop (and school property) is just literally anywhere a child is if someone claims the child is "waiting for the bus". Okay, now you have to explain something else. How does MY property that I own and pay taxes on become the Schools Property. I need something more than just you claiming it to back that outrageous claim up.
 
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Re: Boy expelled for air soft guns in yard

Zyphlin said:
That says they were waiting for the school bus, that does not say they were at the bus stop.

My bus stop was very near my home while growing up. It wasn't uncommon for me and the neighbor kids to play around in the yard prior to the bus coming as we were waiting; heading down to the stop a minute before it typically came or just as we saw it pulling to the stop.

Notice to the left of your bolded comment where it says "other friends who were with them while playing", and notice in the story where it notes that the location of WHERE they were playing...in their yard, not at the bus stop.

-edit-

Just re-read yourp ost and realized you weren't claiming he was at the bus stop but rather that the bus stop (and school property) is just literally anywhere a child is if someone claims the child is "waiting for the bus". Okay, now you have to explain something else. How does MY property that I own and pay taxes on become the Schools Property. I need something more than just you claiming it to back that outrageous claim up.
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My claim is not outrageous. If a teacher was to bring students to a public park for whatever activities, the park area becomes school grounds while the students are there.

If I was in the same park area, carrying a concealed weapon, I could be arrested for carrying concealed on school grounds. Of course, no one would know and everything would be alright.

The front yard is in proximity with the bus stop and students are known to play there while waiting for the bus. That front yard is therefore considered school grounds during the hours of the day that the students will be there.
 
Re: Boy expelled for air soft guns in yard

d0gbreath said:
My claim is not outrageous. If a teacher was to bring students to a public park for whatever activities, the park area becomes school grounds while the students are there.

If I was in the same park area, carrying a concealed weapon, I could be arrested for carrying concealed on school grounds. Of course, no one would know and everything would be alright.

The front yard is in proximity with the bus stop and students are known to play there while waiting for the bus. That front yard is therefore considered school grounds during the hours of the day that the students will be there.
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Can you post a legal ruling of some kind of this property conversión? The presence of students does not change other peoples rights or take them away.

Thanks
 
Montecresto said:
I can't wait to see this defended. It seems zero tolerance should be for the real thing. Boys have been known to show up with real guns in back packs. No tolerance for that is appropriate.


VIRGINIA BEACH, Va. (WAVY) - A seventh grade Virginia Beach student previously suspended for shooting an airsoft gun has been expelled, WAVY.com has learned.

During a hearing Tuesday morning, Aidan Clark was expelled in a unanimous vote. The fate of Khalid Caraballo remains unknown at this time.

Like thousands of others in Hampton Roads, Khalid Caraballo plays with airsoft guns. Caraballo and his friend Aidan were suspended because they shot two other friends who were with them while playing with the guns as they waited for the school bus.

The two seventh graders say they never went to the bus stop; they fired the airsoft guns while on Caraballo's private property.

Aidan’s father, Tim Clark, told WAVY.com what happened next lacks commons sense. The children were suspended for possession, handling and use of a firearm.


WAVY - Has zero tolerance gone too far | WAVY.com | Virginia Beach
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He wasn't even AT SCHOOL - and he was expelled? Goddamn - how is that even LEGAL?

Apparently we need to pass legislation that defines the limit of school authorities. . . and they did this without having to give legal justification? The suspension was bad enough.
 
Re: Boy expelled for air soft guns in yard

d0gbreath said:
My claim is not outrageous. If a teacher was to bring students to a public park for whatever activities, the park area becomes school grounds while the students are there.

If I was in the same park area, carrying a concealed weapon, I could be arrested for carrying concealed on school grounds. Of course, no one would know and everything would be alright.

The front yard is in proximity with the bus stop and students are known to play there while waiting for the bus. That front yard is therefore considered school grounds during the hours of the day that the students will be there.
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Again, provide my some link or evidence that verifies your statement other than just you saying it if you expect me to buy that. Because on the surface it doesn't make sense. For example, if smoking in a public park is legal in a state but illegal to do "on school grounds", what you're saying is someone smoking in a park would be violating hte law if a teacher brought kids to the park because it suddenly officially becomes "School grounds". This makes zero sense. Without something to substantiate your claim other than "I was told this in a class" why should anyone believe it?

As to the link you posted...yes, the SCHOOL states they feel their zero tolerance policy expands to private property. Note, that's not them saying that private property becomes "school grounds", but that they simply feel their zero tolerance policy extends anywhere. Beyond that, of COURSE the school is going to state they feel that their policy allows them to do what they did...they're not going to come out and claim they COULDN'T do what they did.

For something you say there's "no debate" about, there's a hell of a lot of debate.
 
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