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Thread: Lower Health Insurance Premiums to Come at Cost of Fewer Choices

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    Re: Lower Health Insurance Premiums to Come at Cost of Fewer Choices

    Quote Originally Posted by trfjr View Post
    it called expansion of the topic that is related to the topic it isn't called moving the goal post. And I did refer to it with my statement of being lied to about how you can keep your doctor and you health plan
    Except you made a claim based on your source, which is what I am talking about, and which is in fact 100 % false. Trying to hide behind "oh, I was not talking about the OP in the OP" is not going to work.
    We became a great nation not because we are a nation of cynics. We became a great nation because we are a nation of believers - Lindsey Graham

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    Uh oh Megyn...your vagina witchcraft is about ready to be exposed.

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    Re: Lower Health Insurance Premiums to Come at Cost of Fewer Choices

    Quote Originally Posted by Redress View Post
    Why do you assume I do not have insurance?
    are you so sure you will be able to keep your plan or will you be one of the millions that will be getting a letter saying your current plan is being cancelled because it doesn't meet the new requirement and need to be forced into the exchanges

    what you fail to realize a lot of people have what is know as catastrophic plans they are very cheap and what most young healthy Americans only need for protection for something major to happen to their health. a lot of small business and businesses that employee a lot of part time workers offer those plans. all of them who have those plans will have them cancelled because they don't meet the Obama care requirement. so they will be forced to buy a plan they don't want at a much higher cost.
    this is also one reason the very few states that will see a decrease in coverage price is because state law didn't allow those catastrophic plans to begin with. some actually had higher requirements then what Obama care requires
    Last edited by trfjr; 09-23-13 at 05:14 PM.

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    Re: Lower Health Insurance Premiums to Come at Cost of Fewer Choices

    Quote Originally Posted by Redress View Post
    Why do you assume I do not have insurance?
    I'm not assuming anything. I'm asking.

    If your employer drops you from coverage, (which is happening for lots of people which is why the Unions now oppose it), would you

    A) Buy HI

    B) Pay the fine

    Congress and Obama have exempted many of their political cronies and themselves from this law. If they can exempt themselves from the law, why shouldn't I be able to do the same thing? Remember paying the fine = NO HEALTH CARE

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    Re: Lower Health Insurance Premiums to Come at Cost of Fewer Choices

    Quote Originally Posted by Redress View Post
    Except you made a claim based on your source, which is what I am talking about, and which is in fact 100 % false. Trying to hide behind "oh, I was not talking about the OP in the OP" is not going to work.
    and what claim was that? and did I refer to that original source when I made that claim? or are you just making an assumption

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    Re: Lower Health Insurance Premiums to Come at Cost of Fewer Choices

    Look it up, all public employee union members are exempt from the tax element on "cadillac" plans until 2018.
    Congress is not subject to obamacare nor are their employees - well except the volunteers (poor)

    Quote Originally Posted by American View Post
    You have proof of these exemptions?

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    Re: Lower Health Insurance Premiums to Come at Cost of Fewer Choices

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    Well, I think you are either just plain wrong about that, or intentionally misleading about what is going on...If businesses are dropping their benefits for employees, or dropping their hours down below 30 to deny benefits as a result of the law, then yes, they are being forced to change doctors.
    First the low end minumum wage jobs have had businesses playing the part time reduced benefit game for a long time. I am not sure when it started but ever since i got into the work force it has been a reality that when you start someplace in minimum wage positions they kept you part time because one of the things they offered to full time people was health coverage. There is also other reasons for tax payment purposes that have been around that have resulted in businesses using part time help over full time. That is nothing new, and really most companies were already playing that game, they just blame it on Obamacare now.

    I can agree that because obama put off the employer mandate that companies will probably take the opportunity while they can to push their costs off onto the employees. Still, since that is just delayed they will eventually need to offer the health care plans in the future. I actually agree it was a pretty crappy thing for Obama to do to make some stupid excuse to let the employers off the hook for a year. Still, I cannot totally blame him considering how the republicans have done everything possible to derail implementation and there may be some truth to the claim they are behind schedule because of the open interference. It is convenient for the contributors to both the reps and the dems that it was pushed back, but not to regular people.

    Also, it does not seem like they are being forced to change doctors unless they are worried about costs. That has always been the way of insurance. Maybe if you have a more expensive insurance plan then you do not have to deal with it, and you could always pay for it yourself, but when you are bargain hunting you may not get who you want to do service for you. That is how bargain hunting works. Sometimes when you cut costs you have to go somewhere else.

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    Re: Lower Health Insurance Premiums to Come at Cost of Fewer Choices

    Quote Originally Posted by trfjr View Post
    Can you say Rationed Care boys and girls
    Avik Roy over at Forbes (and the Manhattan Institute) has made a name for himself attacking Obamacare day after day. Today he actually gets one right!

    Yes, Obamacare's Exchanges Will Narrow Your Choice Of Doctors -- And That's A Good Thing
    Yesterday, Robert Pear of the New York Times discussed an emerging concern with Obamacare’s soon-to-be-online health insurance exchanges. “Many insurers,” he writes, “are significantly limiting the choices of doctors and hospitals available to consumers” in the market. Many critics of the health law made note of the news, holding President Obama to account for his repeated promise that “if you like your doctor, you can keep your doctor.” But here’s the twist: it’s actually a good thing that insurers are forcing hospitals and doctors to compete on price. Indeed, these “narrow networks” may be one of Obamacare’s best features.
    But hospitals and doctors will have to compete on price

    Every major insurer has conducted substantial market research into consumers’ attitudes about shopping for coverage. And consistently, what insurers find is that consumers’ highest priority is price. Just as most travelers shop for airline tickets based on price, rather than the brand or the in-flight amenities, most exchange participants will shop on the basis of premiums.

    So insurers will compete to offer the lowest price, by contracting with the doctors and hospitals who charge them the lowest fees for treating you. “The networks will be narrower than the networks typically offered to large groups of employees in the commercial market,” said a spokesman for Cigna.

    This is, in general, a good thing. Unlike government-imposed price controls, these contracts are voluntary. If doctors don’t like the fees that insurers are talking about, they don’t have to participate. If insurers think doctors are asking too much, they can take their business elsewhere. This is the essence of market-based transactions.

    Prestigious but costly academic hospitals will lose business

    In particular, this phenomenon means that exchange-based insurance plans will avoid the expensive big-name academic hospitals associated with prestigious medical schools like Harvard. Those hospitals are usually the ones that charge higher prices because they know that they can.

    People who really want to keep their doctor, at any price, will often have to pay higher premiums for the privilege. And people who prefer lower premiums, above all, might need to choose a different doctor. But the overall effect of this dynamic will be that hospitals and doctors will have to compete on price, just like people do in every other sector of the economy.

    There are a lot of things about Obamacare that will take our health-care system in the wrong direction. But there are a few good things that we should learn from. One of them is that competition works.

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    Re: Lower Health Insurance Premiums to Come at Cost of Fewer Choices

    Quote Originally Posted by American View Post
    You have proof of these exemptions?
    If you currently get a stipend or cash payment from your employer to purchase insurance, and you get it on the exchange, you are no longer allowed to get the stipend. ACA Section 1512 - a(3)

    OMB issued a rule this year that states that the FEHB, which Congress gets to purchase health insurance, will be made available no matter what.

    Since the ACA states that Congress must buy insurance from the exchange, they would under the section 1512 - a(3) rule lose their FEHB contribution, but the OMB rule overrode that.

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    Re: Lower Health Insurance Premiums to Come at Cost of Fewer Choices

    Its either affordable health care or its not...
    We, the masses, the great unwashed, cannot have the wealthy design things for us...
    It would be un-affordable..
    think!
    Eventually, we will have a great society, and the wealthy class will be a thing of the past.
    think!
    There are 24 hours in a day and 7 days in a week.
    Of those 168 hours, a man is good for 30 to 50 depending..
    So for good complete medical care, one needs to have FIVE personnal doctors....
    I, for one, have no interest in this absurd situation, and I damn sure cannot carry five doctors !
    Even if I were wealthy, I could not do this !
    I think the conservatives know this, its simple enough.

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    Re: Lower Health Insurance Premiums to Come at Cost of Fewer Choices

    Quote Originally Posted by trfjr View Post
    what you have is called an MMO plan that most who have it hate it
    And why ?

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