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CNN: some of the Kenya mall attackers are from the US

shrubnose said:
Any human being, no matter what their citizenship is, committing terrorist acts anywhere on this planet is a problem for the rest of us who live here.
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YEa duh, but that was not what the discussion was about :) It was, in my opinion, a vain attempt by certain people to say if the OP was true, that these people were not "real Americans" because they were not born there and only naturalized.
 
PeteEU said:
YEa duh, but that was not what the discussion was about :) It was, in my opinion, a vain attempt by certain people to say if the OP was true, that these people were not "real Americans" because they were not born there and only naturalized.
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Hey Pete, that wasn't my point for posting the op.
 
Deuce said:
I don't see why this would make it any more of a problem than it already is.
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because it wouldn't to homegrown radicals among our population? Something many people find an ideological benefit in denying as an actual issue, or one that could ever possibly occur. With discussion of such often being met with various ad hom attacks about being anti-muslim ...
 
the_recruit said:
Homegrown terrorists are nothing new. American culture is as varied as it is vast. We produce violent extremist nutjobs just as all countries do. That fact doesn't speak to our culture as a whole.
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I haven't read any research on the topic in a few years, but wasn't concern for radicalism and fundamentalism among our islamic population limited mostly to refugee communities that tended to be be poor, uneducated, and reared in less than ideal security situations? For me, it would seem rather disconcerting if there was a significant movement away from that trend.
 
Goshin said:
Born here means they are actual Americans, who grew up in our culture and society and under our laws, who nonetheless decided to go to Africa, take up an extremist cause, and commit mass murder of innocent citizens of another country. That's bad.
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It is religious media influence on the weakest of minds Goshin. It happens to the best of us!
 
Al Shabaabs retribution has been blamed on a US backed Kenyan invasion in 2011. There continues to be provocations.
 
the_recruit said:
Homegrown terrorists are nothing new. American culture is as varied as it is vast. We produce violent extremist nutjobs just as all countries do. That fact doesn't speak to our culture as a whole.
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Yes generalizations are dangerous!
 
lizzie said:
Imo, it's a huge difference. It's the difference between a home-grown terrorist killing Americans, and being tried in our courts of law, and justice being served in whichever way is decided by our legal system. Our producing terrorists who go abroad and commit terroristic actions against innocents in other countries will be handled however that country handles terrorists. That in and of itself doesn't bother me, but it sure as hell bothers me if Americans are now becoming international jihadists.
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There are other levels of complications to this. How about instead of being tried by the laws of the foreign lands the USA demands the would be captured terrorists back to USA for prosecution in your own way instead?
 
There was also reportedly (same CNN as the op) one from each, Canada, Britain and Finland involved in the attack!
 
the_recruit said:
Our legal system currently offers no framework to deal with US citizens who go abroad to commit acts of terror (or I should say no reasonable framework). This isn't the first time we've had to deal with such a case. So far we've treated them as the terrorists they are and exterminated with extreme prejudice. Personally, I'm fine with that approach and drone striking these ****ers, but it's probably time we actually developed a system for dealing with such cases that's codified in law.
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Any ideas to codify USA born and raised, influenced to be terrorists, that committed murder abroad?
 
the_recruit said:
I guess I'm not following you as to why that's disturbing. We have serial killers, cannibals, pedophiles, and more recently wannabe-martyrs. I don't think that's any indicator of American society degrading or anything like that. It's more a reflection of the growing appeal of Al-Qaeda-ism to a certain segment of the population (think angry, psychologically unstable, sexually frustrated young men who desire to feel purposeful and have an enemy to lash out at - Al-Qaeda's romanticized resistance against the "Great Satan" offers them this. There's some very interesting literature on the psychological profiles of the types who AQ recruits to engage in suicidal killings).
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Yes that is a good statement! It is religious media influencing the weakest as I said before.
 
Montecresto said:
I see! Good find. Not a good thing there.
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Not at all! The traitor Gadahn has insight to his previous culture. Hence now he rewards and punishes the right kind of people so as to suit his "new" purpose. He addresses the bounty hunters whom may not care politics, religion, etc, and might do the kill for the bounty regardless.

Hopefully though an agent penetrates the system posing as a "bounty hunter." Could communicate a lot if the traitor Gadahn is captured.
 
Hatuey said:
You make it sound as if it'd be the first time people born in the US actually took up arms against our government. I don't mean to sound cynical, but their nationality is not the biggest problem. It's a person's ability to infiltrate everyday American life without being noticed by any security agency.
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There are fMRI and PET scan related neuroimages that could screen the murderers amongst us. Perhaps the security agency might benefit from that while allowing people in.
 
shrubnose said:
Any human being, no matter what their citizenship is, committing terrorist acts anywhere on this planet is a problem for the rest of us who live here.
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How is terrorism conducted to Indians in India becomes a problem for you who live there?
 
Montecresto said:
At least three of the attackers responsible for a reign of terror on an upscale Kenyan mall, killing at least 68, are from the United States, CNN reports.

CNN’s Sara Pratley, senior director of coverage at the news network, broke the news on Twitter Sunday afternoon. CNN also reported the news on television.

If this proves to be so, this could be a major problem.

Kenya mall attack: Death toll rises to 68 - CNN.com
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Why believe anything they report these days? They were blatantly busted reporting that the shooter at the Navy yard used an AR15 too, they were wrong.
 
DDD said:
Not at all! The traitor Gadahn has insight to his previous culture. Hence now he rewards and punishes the right kind of people so as to suit his "new" purpose. He addresses the bounty hunters whom may not care politics, religion, etc, and might do the kill for the bounty regardless.

Hopefully though an agent penetrates the system posing as a "bounty hunter." Could communicate a lot if the traitor Gadahn is captured.
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Gadahn is dead.
 
the_recruit said:
I guess I'm not following you as to why that's disturbing. We have serial killers, cannibals, pedophiles.......
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Who all work alone and are not motivated by ideology rather than being part of an organized group that is.

You may not see any difference, but I sure do.
 
Gardener said:
Who all work alone and are not motivated by ideology rather than being part of an organized group that is.

You may not see any difference, but I sure do.
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While terrorism is more damaging to society than lone crazies, they are fundamentally the same people. Some join "causes", they are all psychos.
 
Montecresto said:
There was also reportedly (same CNN as the op) one from each, Canada, Britain and Finland involved in the attack!
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CNN is not reporting that as fact, but as claims by Al Shabaab. You believe it. Why? You claim that the US secretary of state is a liar but you believe Al Shabaab tweets. You've demonstrated no standard of evidence whatsoever.



Before its Twitter account was suspended, Al-Shabaab issued a list of nine names it said were among the attackers. It said three were from the United States, two from Somalia and one each from Canada, Finland, Kenya and the United Kingdom.

A senior State Department official said that the United States was trying to determine whether any of the attackers were American. While they were still working to verify the claims, authorities said they were becoming more confident that American citizens may be involved.
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More gunfire after Kenyan forces assault Nairobi's Westgate mall - CNN.com
 
Today's pop culture Liberal America embraces nut cases and America haters. It is important to realize that a little piece of Obama paper that says you're an American citizen does not make you an American. The differences between Americans and the world's sewage that reside here have become increasingly obvious in recent years.
 
DDD said:
There are other levels of complications to this. How about instead of being tried by the laws of the foreign lands the USA demands the would be captured terrorists back to USA for prosecution in your own way instead?
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Heya DDD. :2wave: I could see that for any Americans that got involved. Not for others. Let whatever country they belong to.....decide their fate if using the LAW.
 
MMC said:
Heya Jmac. :2wave: Is there anything on that? I haven't heard we or any others took out Gadahn.
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Reports of death[edit source | editbeta]
In February 2008, Pakistani news sources reported rumors that Gadahn was killed by a missile fired by a MQ-1 Predator drone in the strike that killed al-Qaeda leader Abu Laith al-Libi.[41][42][43][44][45] On March 2, an al-Qaeda spokesperson claimed that Gadahn was alive,[46][47] but the rumor was fueled by a considerable drop in quality of recent al-Qaeda videos from As-Sahab.[14][15][48]
On May 18, 2008, Counterterrorism Blog surmised that Adam Gadahn was dead based on the latest al-Qaeda missive.[48] Mansfield wrote: "Normally important messages from Zawahiri contain linguistic indications that they were translated by Adam Gadahn. Gadahn’s translation style is noticeably absent from this video, giving more credence to open source reports from Pakistan regarding the possible death of Gadahn in an American air strike. (There are other plausible explanations for Gadahn’s absence from the scene—including his quip in his January video tape that ripping up his passport would not hinder his ability to travel.)"[49]
On September 7, 2008, the Sunday Telegraph reported that Gadahn may have been killed by a Predator attack in January 2008 in Waziristan.[50] This was reported by The Orange County Register,[51] KABC TV in Los Angeles,[52] and other news agencies.
On Saturday October 4, 2008, a video appeared on the internet by the As-Sahab Foundation for Media Production by Gadahn[53] entitled The Believer isn't Stung from the Same Hole Twice.[54] Mansfield posted a video of Gadahn speaking about current affairs including the economic crisis in the US and the resignation of the President of Pakistan Pervez Musharraf.
In 2009, As-Sahab released a video entitled, Gaza, Not Again and in the same year, another video where Gahdan is speaking Arabic in an As-Sahab release entitled Let's continue our Jihad and Sacrifice[55] this is his first video speaking only in Arabic.

Adam Yahiye Gadahn - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
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It is a little sketchy, so I'll just say I believe he is dead.
 
j-mac said:
It is a little sketchy, so I'll just say I believe he is dead.
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Yeah.....thanks for that. As that CNN piece is from Sept of 2013. Yet is he singled out our Yemen Ambassador.....which there would be no way he could have know who that would be back in 2008.

Something aint Right.....as I don't think that AQ could have the tech to constantly doctor videos wherein our computer geeks wouldn't be able to tell.
 
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