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Thread: House Bill Defunds Health Care

  1. #311
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    Re: House Bill Defunds Health Care

    Quote Originally Posted by EdwinWillers View Post
    Oh stop with the sappy emotionalism for a minute and think about what you're asking, seriously.

    Tell me where that argument fit when government-run health care made its first appearance on the political stage? It didn't exist. In fact, it won't exist for decades - that argument is just one of the latest excuses marched forth as "cause" for... for giving the federal government power over 1/6th of this nation's economy.u

    People are SO AFRAID of what might happen, they're ready to pee their pants at the very thought of not having insurance should they ever need it. Well, fine - I agree in principle that if we have the ability to curtail reasonable fears about "what might happen if" that we do so. Fair enough?

    But answer me this - what makes you think the federal government is the proper entity to do that? What? Or, why MUST we accept the Democrat premise that government-run health care is the ONLY way to "fix" ____________?


    Medicare works just fine.... The insurance exchanges are no different than Medicare Advantage Plans...

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    Re: House Bill Defunds Health Care

    Quote Originally Posted by Juanita View Post
    Medicare works just fine.... The insurance exchanges are no different than Medicare Advantage Plans...
    There's a downside to those Medicare Advantage Plans. It's very confusing and sometimes it's difficult for the healthcare providers to get paid because of all the plans they have to keep track of.
    Last edited by reinoe; 09-22-13 at 01:45 AM.

  3. #313
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    Re: House Bill Defunds Health Care

    Quote Originally Posted by reinoe View Post
    There's a downside to those Medicare Advantage Plans. It's very confusing and sometimes it's difficult for the healthcare providers to get paid because of all the plans they have to keep track of.


    All insurance plans can be confusing...They still land up getting paid tho, don't they?

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    Re: House Bill Defunds Health Care

    Quote Originally Posted by aberrant85 View Post
    http://www.nytimes.com/2013/09/19/us...ocDrMbeP5FlRag

    House Bill Cuts Health Funds, Raising Odds of U.S. Shutdown

    By JONATHAN WEISMAN and ASHLEY PARKER
    Published: September 18, 2013

    WASHINGTON — House Republican leaders — bowing to the demands of their conservative wing — will put to a vote on Friday a stopgap spending measure that would strip all funding from President Obama’s signature health care law, increasing the likelihood that the government will shut down in two weeks.


    So what's going on here? Another defeat Obamacare vote? And will this shut down the government like in the 90's? If so, will it come back to bite the Republicans in the a**?

    Why the urgency to defeat this "train wreck"? If that's what this is, why not let it fail and bring down its Democratic authors? Republicans have shown they can play politics with the welfare of the American people by threatening the full faith and credit of the country, so why not let the law destroy itself, then sweep in and take the credit for predicting it?

    My question is, do Republicans fear that ACA will not be the disaster they predict, or even worse, a success, and are trying to sabotage it before they look bad for opposing it? Or is this just a stunt to appease their radical right wing? "Obamacare delenda est"?
    Well it makes sense considering the only collectivists who believe the program is a good idea are the elitist progressives and their sheep while the rest of society that actually work blue collar jobs or those who own small businesses (or even franchises) including democrats know it's epic bull****....

    Hell the progressives major voting block - the labor unions are calling bull****....

    The only difference is that the progressives/democrats opposed to this socialist nonsense want "waivers" while the rest of us non-socialists and non-democrats want it repealed entirely...

    Democrats and progressives are fine with it just as long as they don't have to abide by it...

  5. #315
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    Re: House Bill Defunds Health Care

    Quote Originally Posted by upsideguy View Post
    Requires insurance companies to devote 80-85% of premiums to benefit payments or rebate the difference to its customers
    I'm confused, that happens oh so very often these days so bear with me. I read through that list and as a former business owner
    I can only draw one conclusion. That will put private insurance companies out of business. Now before you attempt to offer a counter argument please
    realize that I believe the administration when they stated that they realize that Americans would never accept single payer in one go but phased in over a ten to fifteen year period it would be doable and I agree that is fully possible. The only thing I can't fathom is that the folks on your side actually believe it will save money. SSI Medicare/Medicaid are doomed to insolvency no amount of restriction in services or untenable tax increases can change that...

    Basically adding the majority of all American citizens medical care to the Federal budget seems like complete lunacy?

    If you look at any piechart for the current Federal budget the only real big expenditures are entitlements and defence
    lord knows we can do without the outrageous outlays for the military and still be quite safe but with all the baby boomers soon to put their hands out for their slices of the entitlement pie I can't imagine that any reasonable person would believe the tax burden or the additional amount of public debt is sustainable. For the eight years I had CEO legally attached to my name there were only three things I wanted to know on a daily basis:
    how much do we have
    how much do we owe
    and
    how much is coming in
    then you'd know if you were in the red or the black
    (a daily cashflow calculation)
    we are headed as a nation in only one direction, like a runaway freight train and the guys driving the locomotive are pouring on the coal!
    Last edited by AngryOldGuy; 09-22-13 at 04:11 AM.

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    Re: House Bill Defunds Health Care

    Quote Originally Posted by aberrant85 View Post
    The unions didn't get a waiver, so that's just not true.
    You're ignoring the bigger picture.
    "He who does not think himself worth saving from poverty and ignorance by his own efforts, will hardly be thought worth the efforts of anybody else." -- Frederick Douglass, Self-Made Men (1872)
    "Fly-over" country voted, and The Donald is now POTUS.

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    Re: House Bill Defunds Health Care

    Quote Originally Posted by Dittohead not! View Post
    That's a lie I don't even remember having heard, except in the title "Affordable Care Act." Did anyone really believe that "affordable" meant cheaper overall, or merely subsidized by government? If they did, then they were living in a fool's paradise.

    "Obamacare" might provide more access to the health care system, but it will do nothing to control the costs, which have been out of control for decades now, and could result in increased costs.

    But its opponents will, goldfish like, attribute all of the rising costs to Obamacare and then promise their constituencies to overturn it, which they can't, and then blame all of the outrageous health care costs on Obamacare.

    all that instead of coming up with a workable plan that would actually reign in costs. What a circus.
    LOL. Really? LOL.
    "“If we don’t deepen our ports all along the Gulf — places like Charleston, South Carolina; or Savannah, Georgia; or Jacksonville, Florida…” -Obama

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    Re: House Bill Defunds Health Care

    Quote Originally Posted by upsideguy View Post
    You are right..... We have let the Cons control the dialogue on this, which they have done by villifying the ACA with silliness like 'death panels' and 'rationing'. Those that actually have a clue what the ACA is, spend too much time debunking the idiocy, which acts to obfuscate the real issue: Why we have the ACA. So, by your request, les't list what the ACA actually does:


    - Creates the Health Insurance Marketplace, a new way for individuals, families, and small businesses to get health coverage
    - Requires insurance companies to cover people with pre-existing health conditions
    - Holds insurance companies accountable for rate increases
    - Requires insurance companies to devote 80-85% of premiums to benefit payments or rebate the difference to its customers
    - Makes it illegal for health insurance companies to arbitrarily cancel your health insurance just because you get sick
    - Covers young adults under 26
    - Provides free preventive care
    - Ends lifetime and yearly dollar limits on coverage of essential health benefits
    - Guarantees your right to appeal should coverage be denied
    - Through cost control and greater participation by the general public in preventative medicine, should reduce the deficit over the first 10 years by $114B and the next 10 years by $1T.

    - Creates the Health Insurance Marketplace, a new way for individuals, families, and small businesses to get health coverage
    Where's this place at? What's the secret handshake to get in this place? What page in the yellow pages is it shown on?

    - Requires insurance companies to cover people with pre-existing health conditions
    And people can enroll when? Oh that's right, there will be windows from Oct to Dec. So that's when you better get sick or no insurance for you. Why it's almost exactly like the wait times requited now for people with pre-existing conditions.

    - Holds insurance companies accountable for rate increases
    How? They already have demonstrated what they will do if required to lose money. They don't offer insurance.

    - Requires insurance companies to devote 80-85% of premiums to benefit payments or rebate the difference to its customers
    That a way government. Force companies out of business because they can't cover a bad year. Decreasing completion has what effect on cost? Hint, hint, your wallet gets lighter.

    - Makes it illegal for health insurance companies to arbitrarily cancel your health insurance just because you get sick
    And if they do, what? Oh, you'll have to get a lawyer just like now.

    - Covers young adults under 26
    Good thing too. Because of this law, many (an ever increasing many) of them won't be able to land a job, much less one that provides insurance. To bad for them when they turn 26, they still won't be able to land a good job because of this law.

    - Provides free preventive care
    Are there people out there that still believe something is free? The dumb remain dumb if so. Costs go up for everybody.

    - Ends lifetime and yearly dollar limits on coverage of essential health benefits
    And this effects everybody else's insurance cost how? Uh, I know the answer, do you?

    - Guarantees your right to appeal should coverage be denied
    What's changed here? Not much if anything. You get to go whine to a nameless government employee and hire your own lawyer.

    - Through cost control and greater participation by the general public in preventative medicine, should reduce the deficit over the first 10 years by $114B and the next 10 years by $1T.
    You put this in for laughs right? Should. LOL. LOL. LOL.......
    "“If we don’t deepen our ports all along the Gulf — places like Charleston, South Carolina; or Savannah, Georgia; or Jacksonville, Florida…” -Obama

  9. #319
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    Re: House Bill Defunds Health Care

    Quote Originally Posted by Juanita View Post
    Medicare works just fine.... The insurance exchanges are no different than Medicare Advantage Plans...
    Medicare will be bankrupt in 10 years and could be sooner as some predict
    Trustees: Medicare Will Go Broke in 2016, If You Exclude Obamacare's Double-Counting - Forbes

    Medicare has 43 trillion in unfunded liability if you tax every one making over 60,000 and all cooperation's 100% you only would get 7 trillion
    Cox and Archer: Why $16 Trillion Only Hints at the True U.S. Debt - WSJ.com

    you call that working just fine? I guess you can call it that if your goal is to bankrupt America
    Last edited by trfjr; 09-22-13 at 08:49 AM.

  10. #320
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    Re: House Bill Defunds Health Care

    Quote Originally Posted by Juanita View Post
    Medicare works just fine....
    For many years an old sign in our family doctors office read:
    we will no longer accept any new medicare patients. When my son was about to graduate prep school (highschool) during a visit
    the doc asked him what he was going to study in college, he then went on to say whatever you don't go into medicine!
    He said that over the years he was making less and less money (he was already working as many hours as he could)
    his cost of operation keep going up, insurance paid less and less (we always paid cash) and his malpractice insurance
    was eating him alive, 5 years ago he closed his practice and went to work for an HMO It's driving him nuts because
    the insurance company now completely dictates how he practices medicine.

    Gawd help us all once the government dictates your medical care

    oh medicare? between what it cost him to get any money out of them (to pay office staff to file a claim and then wait forever)
    and the pittance they were willing to pay, medicare was a loser, it wasn't worth having those patients.

    Try and imagine how low the level of care will go, ever talk to someone in Canada that has to wait 3 to 4 months
    for a procedure but if they want to pay it will only take a one month wait or if they go to Seattle they can have
    that knee with the torn meniscus from the car bicycle accident four months ago (that's how long it took to get an MRI)
    fixed this week? My sister in law waited four days to get scheduled for coronary heart bypass surgery in 05 in Newport Beach CA
    Imagine being told you are on a wait list that depending on how urgent they think it is can range from 2 to 12 weeks
    ?
    New Hope for the Wretched era

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