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Thread: House Bill Defunds Health Care

  1. #201
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    Re: House Bill Defunds Health Care

    Quote Originally Posted by Shadow Serious View Post
    They have their constituents and are following their will.
    The will of the people to shut down the government when there is a disagreement? Really? Would you like a shutdown every time there is a disagreement? This is a step towards a level of dysfunction that is seriously alarming. Our congress people need to do their job on time with minimal disruption. This is a highly destructive method of running a country.

    A lot of people do not want Obama Care and they are playing to that crowd,
    A lot of people want it and whether you like it or not the bill was passed. Holding the country hostage to appease a minority of the population is ridiculous and an excuse.

    It is the majority of the citizens of the United States opinion.
    To shut down the country? No. A majority view it unfavorably, yes.

    However if you break down the bill and actually explain it to people they support it. This is due to the incredible amounts of propaganda that have branded Obamacare an evil that must be stopped. Just look at what people on this forum say. They act like a five mile wide meteor is headed to Earth and will wipe out civilization. Just like they did with electing Obama in 08, and 12, and with everything that happens that negatively effects the rich.

    This is politics at its most basic. This is not a gentleman's club where they chastise a fellow for mildly offensive behavior. The leaders in the Republican Party sometimes well, often thinks it is.
    Dysfunctional politics is not a good thing. There are real, negative consequences to this. No its not the end of the world but people lose jobs, miss paychecks, can't afford to pay bills. It is highly disruptive all for nothing.

    We are not a Democracy. We are a Republic. And if we were a Democracy , Obama Care would not have passed and now since the public knows about Obama Care the majority would hold it not be funded and to be repealed.
    Opinion.

    Backing out of a Dead End street is not regression; It is correction. And the only negativity I see is from Democrats that refuse to accept that the general public is opposed to this form of health care.
    Opinion.

    Obama Care is a colossal fubar and this is essentially the last chance to stop it from wrecking this country.
    Opinion.

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    Re: House Bill Defunds Health Care

    Quote Originally Posted by NIMBY View Post
    Is a law a policy?
    A law can reflect policy.

    Since the Repubs have already stated their wish to kill Medicare, Medicaid and Social Security,
    this would set a precedent NO President would allow.
    Some want to reform them and others want a diffrent solution to them. I can just easily accuse Democrats want to keep Medicare/Medicaid since it sends money to fraudulent firms and providers who support them. And they do not want to reform Social Security since they hope that Social Security will not go bust until after they leave office. It is so easy to just accuse your opponents point of view as being disingenuous.

    I now must call it a tie for first between Voting Wrongs Acts and Defunding Laws.
    Government should guarntee the veracity of elections and should defund programs that are in ill repute.
    An Enlightened Master is ideal only if your goal is to become a Benighted Slave. -- Robert Anton Wilson

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    Re: House Bill Defunds Health Care

    Quote Originally Posted by upsideguy View Post
    Based on what? There is no reason a company would terminate its existing health care plans, and subject themselves to the fines (which are rather stiff) and move good people from full time to part-time. Its non-sense

    The impact of ACA is on 50-200 employee companies that do not currently have healthcare for their employees. Only a few companies have to worry about this. I do, happen to have a company that falls in this area.
    Interesting, what is your company gonna do?
    "Obamacare delenda est"

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    Re: House Bill Defunds Health Care

    Quote Originally Posted by Shadow Serious View Post
    The Republicans passed a bill with everything but Obama Care. It is up to the Democrats to pass it or not. They will be the ones causing a shut down. There is no reason that the bill have to include everything on its budget and those areaa that are agreed to can be passed to avoid this senerio in the first place.
    Oh please. It is obstruction. I can't believe you guys are actually trying to float this.

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    Re: House Bill Defunds Health Care

    Quote Originally Posted by Verax View Post
    The will of the people to shut down the government when there is a disagreement? Really? Would you like a shutdown every time there is a disagreement? This is a step towards a level of dysfunction that is seriously alarming. Our congress people need to do their job on time with minimal disruption. This is a highly destructive method of running a country.
    It's also pretty ****ed up to pass unpopular laws banking on the fact that people love free things and will support it when those free things start rolling out. Who does that all the time? Oh right, democrats. The party that can't shut up about America being a democracy has a very bad habit of voting against the will of the people.


    A lot of people want it and whether you like it or not the bill was passed. Holding the country hostage to appease a minority of the population is ridiculous and an excuse.
    The majority of the country is against the law for one reason or another. Some want full repeal and others want changes, but the majority of the population is against the law.

    To shut down the country? No. A majority view it unfavorably, yes.
    Nope. 51% are for it. Not exactly sure why, but that is what is being reported anyway.

    However if you break down the bill and actually explain it to people they support it. This is due to the incredible amounts of propaganda that have branded Obamacare an evil that must be stopped. Just look at what people on this forum say. They act like a five mile wide meteor is headed to Earth and will wipe out civilization. Just like they did with electing Obama in 08, and 12, and with everything that happens that negatively effects the rich.
    I believe I have heard that before? Oh right, Obama said that.


    Dysfunctional politics is not a good thing. There are real, negative consequences to this. No its not the end of the world but people lose jobs, miss paychecks, can't afford to pay bills. It is highly disruptive all for nothing.
    Nothing? I think not.

  6. #206
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    Re: House Bill Defunds Health Care

    Quote Originally Posted by aberrant85 View Post
    Interesting, what is your company gonna do?
    I have another year to worry about it. I expect, over the next year, through the ingenuity of American business, the insurance industry will develop products for companies such as mine. My business has always been substantially staffed with part-time workers. I already have healthcare for the full time staff.

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    Re: House Bill Defunds Health Care

    Quote Originally Posted by Verax View Post
    IMHO it has little to do with logistics and everything to do with maximizing profits and conservative ideology of making sure nobody gets anything for "free".
    Republicans are more interested in preserving the health care service than "maximizing profits" of it. And if Obama Care is not stopped then there will be great damage to the health care system.

    Also there is no "free". Everything has a cost and someone must pay it. TANSTAAFL. If there ever were a law of the Universe this would be one.

    Healthcare profits are absolutely fantastic for those on top so they will fight to the death to keep it that way.
    The high costs of health care in part are to pay for those who were and are not able to pay for it. And since you want "free" health care this is the result. Imagine it ballooning.

    Conservatives are already in a tizzy over people getting food for free, the prospect of them getting more or better healthcare has them even more outraged
    .

    Conservative are concerned that the Food Stamp Program and others are being abused. Or like WAC is causing harm to families and communities.

    And with respect to health care there are better options than Obama Care which is meant to fail.
    An Enlightened Master is ideal only if your goal is to become a Benighted Slave. -- Robert Anton Wilson

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    Re: House Bill Defunds Health Care

    Quote Originally Posted by Henrin View Post
    It's also pretty ****ed up to pass unpopular laws banking on the fact that people love free things and will support it when those free things start rolling out. Who does that all the time? Oh right, democrats. The party that can't shut up about America being a democracy has a very bad habit of voting against the will of the people.
    Complaining about poor people getting healthcare for "free" does not please me. There is a myth in that word free. You see when people do menial low paying jobs they create a lot of value, value that goes up the chain and redistributes itself disproportionately to the upper echelon. If you look at the direction the country is going this imbalance is becoming larger and larger in the last four decades. If they have to give some money back in the form of making sure everyone has decent healthcare that is not an injustice, it is fairness. I do not care if some people get a free ride if it means another ten get what they deserve. The world is not perfect and this is next best thing to single payer for the poor.

    The majority of the country is against the law for one reason or another. Some want full repeal and others want changes, but the majority of the population is against the law.
    The majority of the country also once supported slavery. The amount of right-wing propaganda injected into the public makes them a poor candidate to judge anything. I hate to say it but most people are not fit to make these kinds of decisions. LoL, I know you guys will have a **** fit over what I just said.

    Nope. 51% are for it. Not exactly sure why, but that is what is being reported anyway.
    For shutting down the government?

    I believe I have heard that before? Oh right, Obama said that.
    I've seen it in numerous polls and he probably used it. This is part of the "not fit to make decisions for themselves" argument.

    Nothing? I think not.
    What will they get then?

  9. #209
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    Re: House Bill Defunds Health Care

    Quote Originally Posted by upsideguy View Post
    They do. Of course, the interesting irony in this is substantially all of the funding of Obama care is in mandatory spending part of the budget. It is outside of the domain of congress, so this is an exercise in complete silliness.
    WRONG. The House has the Power of the Purse. Budget bills start there and the only real mandatory spending per the Constitution would be maintaining a Navy.
    Obama care was passed and signed into law in 2010. What is it about Regressives that makes them live in the past?
    It was passed by members who did not have time to review what was in the bill. And was done on a partisan vote. There should be a long discussion about it before it would be allowed to go into effect. And I think that the law should be repealed.

    Just a reality check for Cons. Eisenhower completed his two terms (and you would never elect him today, anyway, so whats the fascination?); Reagan is dead (and you would never elect him today, anyway, so whats the fascination?); and Obamacare is the law of the land. None of these things is going to change.
    The ones who do not want to change are the Democrats they always want more tax money and more expansive expensive programs and to make the government bigger than before.
    An Enlightened Master is ideal only if your goal is to become a Benighted Slave. -- Robert Anton Wilson

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    Re: House Bill Defunds Health Care

    Quote Originally Posted by Verax View Post
    Complaining about poor people getting healthcare for "free" does not please me.
    Ok?

    There is a myth in that word free.
    Of course, nothing is free. Don't tell the democrats though. They live in some weird world where they support higher taxes to pay for welfare and at the same time think welfare is free.

    You see when people do menial low paying jobs they create a lot of value, value that goes up the chain and redistributes itself disproportionately to the upper echelon. If you look at the direction the country is going this imbalance is becoming larger and larger in the last four decades. If they have to give some money back in the form of making sure everyone has decent healthcare that is not an injustice, it is fairness.
    Yes, providing people with healthcare against your will is justice. Perhaps if the world was upside down and all the blood rushed to my head that would make sense.

    I do not care if some people get a free ride if it means another ten get what they deserve.
    What makes you think they deserve anything?

    The world is not perfect and this is next best thing to single payer for the poor.
    No, this is a stepping stone to single payer. It's kind of the point of the law.

    The majority of the country also once supported slavery. The amount of right-wing propaganda injected into the public makes them a poor candidate to judge anything. I hate to say it but most people are not fit to make these kinds of decisions. LoL, I know you guys will have a **** fit over what I just said.
    No, I expected it. Many people sit around chanting democracy and when the people oppose them all of a sudden the people are stupid and the smart people know what is good for them.

    For shutting down the government?
    That is what I said.

    I've seen it in numerous polls and he probably used it. This is part of the "not fit to make decisions for themselves" argument.
    Yeah, Obama likes to think he is smarter than everyone else. Nothing new there.

    What will they get then?
    What they are after?

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