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Thread: Police warned Navy about gunman's mental instability 6 weeks ago, report says

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    Re: Police warned Navy about gunman's mental instability 6 weeks ago, report says

    Quote Originally Posted by Hatuey View Post
    How Libertarian of you to support a blatant display of statism. More signs that the "freedom" the right wing talks about is utter bull****.
    Im a libertarian realist I agree with civil liberties as long as they don't infringe or endanger on others
    Him telling the cops he is hearing voices is a sure sign of paranoid schizophrenia and they are a danger to them selves and or others if not treated

    also being politically affiliated with a belief doesn't mean you have to tow the line on all what they believe or be as extreme as some
    for example I believe in the legalization of Pot but not coke meth or heroin like some libertarians believe because I do see the harm of those hard drugs have on society
    Last edited by trfjr; 09-18-13 at 03:19 AM.

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    Re: Police warned Navy about gunman's mental instability 6 weeks ago, report says

    Quote Originally Posted by Hatuey View Post
    No. That's not what he's saying at all.
    yes he is he is all for the government to keep a data base on all who ever showed signs of mental illness and would like to add that almost could be 25% of the public
    he wants the government to keep track of them and to do what they can to keep them from being a threat even if they never committed any crime
    Last edited by trfjr; 09-18-13 at 03:34 AM.

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    Re: Police warned Navy about gunman's mental instability 6 weeks ago, report says

    Quote Originally Posted by trfjr View Post
    so according to you there is no such thing as civil liberties you want to live in a police state that they have you, your medical history, and all accessed by the government to be used in any way they feel fit. if you want to live like that im sure they will gladly accept you in Cube China or N.Korea but don't you dare try to make my country into some kind of Orwellian society
    No, that is not what I said. i said that if you have shown mental instability to the point where it has been noted by society that you should not be allowed to own a gun. I did not even say you should have to undergo a psych eval to get a gun. You made a logic jump right off a cliff and I am not following you. if you would like to argue why people who have been declared a danger to themselves or others because of a psychotic state should have guns feel free. if you would like to argue that we are infringing on the rights of people who have been wacko enough in public to get noticed, i have to say we already do that. We can already put you in a 3 day psych eval with no reason aside from shrink says so and strip you of your freedom. We can already throw you into a psych ward against your will without you committing a crime. the only reason that has become less common is because of money. We save it by letting patients out, and we spend a lot more on their meds when we do.

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    Re: Police warned Navy about gunman's mental instability 6 weeks ago, report says

    Quote Originally Posted by tererun View Post
    No, that is not what I said. i said that if you have shown mental instability to the point where it has been noted by society that you should not be allowed to own a gun. I did not even say you should have to undergo a psych eval to get a gun. You made a logic jump right off a cliff and I am not following you. if you would like to argue why people who have been declared a danger to themselves or others because of a psychotic state should have guns feel free. if you would like to argue that we are infringing on the rights of people who have been wacko enough in public to get noticed, i have to say we already do that. We can already put you in a 3 day psych eval with no reason aside from shrink says so and strip you of your freedom. We can already throw you into a psych ward against your will without you committing a crime. the only reason that has become less common is because of money. We save it by letting patients out, and we spend a lot more on their meds when we do.


    Federal Law

    Under 18 U.S.C. § 922(d), it is unlawful for any person to sell or otherwise dispose of any firearm or ammunition to any person knowing or having reasonable cause to believe that such person “has been adjudicated as a mental defective or has been committed to any mental institution.”

    and no you cant willy nilly throw some one involuntary into a mental institute unless they show signs of immediate threat to one self or others unless you want to get sued
    you actually have to go through a court process to be involuntary committed

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    Re: Police warned Navy about gunman's mental instability 6 weeks ago, report says

    Quote Originally Posted by trfjr View Post
    Federal Law

    Under 18 U.S.C. § 922(d), it is unlawful for any person to sell or otherwise dispose of any firearm or ammunition to any person knowing or having reasonable cause to believe that such person “has been adjudicated as a mental defective or has been committed to any mental institution.”
    Such a law becomes pointless if you do not show them the info. That is how they get around the law by doing what you want and pretending they have no right to check on that. Are you telling us there is some sign on a person like a scarlet letter that indicates they were in a mental institution or have been declared mentally incompetent? That information has to be compiled and shared with every gon seller in the US and that is what you have been bitching about so far in this thread. that is sharing medical records. That according to you is big brother and an invasion of your privacy. I agree with that, but it needs to be applied properly which it is not.

    Quote Originally Posted by trfjr View Post
    and no you cant willy nilly throw some one involuntary into a mental institute unless they show signs of immediate threat to one self or others unless you want to get sued
    you actually have to go through a court process to be involuntary committed
    It is pretty reliant upon the judgment of a psychologist. the evaluation period is not being committed. Those three days are for the evaluation. it is like being detained and not arrested only in this case it is three days. Yes, when rthey are done with that there has to be some sort of legal proceeding to fully commit you, but they can hold you for evaluation.

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    Re: Police warned Navy about gunman's mental instability 6 weeks ago, report says

    I really think this was a false flag attack setup by the government.

    Why are attacks on American soil now suddenly all in bases where services people are?

    There is a big protest in DC tomorrow where transport truck drivers from all over the nation are planning to shut down the city by congesting traffic. Funny that these "attacks" always happen before big rebellions.

    Don't believe the hype.

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    Re: Police warned Navy about gunman's mental instability 6 weeks ago, report says

    Quote Originally Posted by tererun View Post
    Such a law becomes pointless if you do not show them the info. That is how they get around the law by doing what you want and pretending they have no right to check on that. Are you telling us there is some sign on a person like a scarlet letter that indicates they were in a mental institution or have been declared mentally incompetent? That information has to be compiled and shared with every gon seller in the US and that is what you have been bitching about so far in this thread. that is sharing medical records. That according to you is big brother and an invasion of your privacy. I agree with that, but it needs to be applied properly which it is not.



    It is pretty reliant upon the judgment of a psychologist. the evaluation period is not being committed. Those three days are for the evaluation. it is like being detained and not arrested only in this case it is three days. Yes, when rthey are done with that there has to be some sort of legal proceeding to fully commit you, but they can hold you for evaluation.
    wrong again you are not allowed to be detained even for a three day evolution unless you show signs of significant physical risk to self or others

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    Re: Police warned Navy about gunman's mental instability 6 weeks ago, report says

    Quote Originally Posted by Kobie View Post
    Right, because no mass shooters have been white. My eyes are rolling to far back in my head I can see my own brain stem.
    One has nothing to do with the other. Anyone familiar with government contracts knows that minorities are first in line for jobs and the contracts themselves when the companies are minority owned. The flags this man had on his record would have kept a high percentage of people from ever getting that position on a Navy Yard.

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    Re: Police warned Navy about gunman's mental instability 6 weeks ago, report says

    Quote Originally Posted by trfjr View Post
    so what are you suggesting go back to they way it was? instead of waiting them to commit a violent crime and lock them up in jail forcibly lock them up in a mental institution drug them before they commit a violent crime?
    That would be the lesser of two evils for sure, but perhaps something in between would be better.

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    Re: Police warned Navy about gunman's mental instability 6 weeks ago, report says

    Quote Originally Posted by trfjr View Post
    Im a libertarian realist I agree with civil liberties as long as they don't infringe or endanger on others
    This doesn't seem to be the case, considering you're willing to be judge on who is and isn't mentally ill without the slightest training in psychology or psychiatry.

    Him telling the cops he is hearing voices is a sure sign of paranoid schizophrenia
    As you're not a licensed psychiatrist or psychologist of any sort, you can't confirm that.

    Hearing Voices

    Sound research with many voice hearers, both within and outside of mental health services, has found that how voice hearers cope with their voices (or don’t) depends not on the content of the voice experience (which can be either abusive and devaluing or guiding and inspiring – or both) but on the nature of the relationship with the voices. If you believe the voices to be in control you can’t cope; if you believe you are stronger than the voices are, you can.

    This means it is no longer a sustainable position to think of voices as part of a disease syndrome, such as schizophrenia. Instead hearing voices can be regarded as a meaningful, real (although sometimes painful, fearful and overwhelming) experience that speak to the person in a metaphorical way about their life, emotions and environment. For instance, people experiencing distress as a consequence of abusive or commanding voices can often recognise their voices as those of their actual abusers and the voices have the effect of attacking their sense of self esteem and worth.
    I refuse to accept the view that mankind is so tragically bound to the starless midnight of racism and war that the bright daybreak of peace and brotherhood can never become a reality. - MLK

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