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Active gunmen in US navy Yard [W:69, 700]

TurtleDude said:
I don't come here to satisfy the needs
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You're clearly trying to advocate for a position and challenge my argument. Unfortunately continually falling back on empty bluster isn't going to get you far with either

We get the fact that you are anti gun and you think cops are more worthy to carry than the rest of us civilians.
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Actually I'm pretty pro-gun. I just saw what seemed to be a silly claim, asked for clarification on it, and saw someone try to support it with a silly argument. And as we continue to discuss it, there is still a clear disparity in supporting evidence and reason


You base that on an irrelevant claim that it takes more effort to be a cop than to get a ccw which means nothing in this issue.
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If the claim is that CCWs will out perform cops it serves as pretty clear evidence on why that would not be true.

IF it were relevant, then cops would be better gun handlers than CCW holders
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I keep asking you to show this evidence that CCW holders are better gun handlers, but you won't do it. And unfortunately that makes your claim look false.

They are not and the evidence has been posted on the gun forum dozens of times
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Then feel free to shut me up and post it here. Should be easy, right?
 
Dr. Chuckles said:
Again, assuming you are being honest, I know CCW holders who haven't fired a gun in years. Hence the problem with relying on your personal anecdotes to establish a trend



Yes. Are you asking me to tutor you?
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Snort!
 
Dr. Chuckles said:
Again, assuming you are being honest, I know CCW holders who haven't fired a gun in years. Hence the problem with relying on your personal anecdotes to establish a trend



Yes. Are you asking me to tutor you?
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same with cops. many of the top brass almost never shoot and the average cop shoots less than 200 rounds a year
 
poweRob said:
Don't know why you are confronting me. I just countered the ridiculous claim that Μολὼν λαβέ made saying that CCW's would've killed the shooter and ended it before that many people were killed. Seeing how you claim that you wouldn't have engaged, then you seem to agree with me. BTW... I didn't say what you said was untrue. I just said it's hard to believe. Had you credibly linked, I wouldn't have doubted it so.
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Yea, you did:

And you still didn't address my last sentence. How does introducing more guns into a scenario where nobody knows who the bad guy is but several people have drawn guns help?
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I explained that there would be no more guns, and why.

Simple.
 
TurtleDude said:
same with cops. many of the top brass almost never shoot and the average cop shoots less than 200 rounds a year
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almost never shoot/200 rounds per year > haven't fired in years.

Are you going to finally cite that data which proves me wrong, or are you and SMTA going to just continue setting gun advocacy back?
 
TurtleDude said:
same with cops. many of the top brass almost never shoot and the average cop shoots less than 200 rounds a year
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My detective buddy Travis, who, when he retired, had not had his gun out of it's holster for many years.

It was loaded, and stuck.

We know, cause we tried to get it out.
 
Dr. Chuckles said:
almost never shoot/200 rounds per year > haven't fired in years.

Are you going to finally cite that data which proves me wrong, or are you and SMTA going to just continue setting gun advocacy back?
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Apply math all you want - both those numbers are worthless - basically equal to zero.
 
Dr. Chuckles said:
I keep asking you to show this evidence that CCW holders are better gun handlers, but you won't do it. And unfortunately that makes your claim look false.



Then feel free to shut me up and post it here. Should be easy, right?
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ok here is your schooling


Fact Sheet: Guns Save Lives - Gun Owners of America

and readers of Newsweek learned that "only 2 percent of civilian shootings involved an innocent person mistakenly identified as a criminal. The 'error rate' for the police, however, was 11 percent, more than five times as high."[7]
 
SMTA said:
Snort!
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you're still showing obvious signs of confusion. I'm not citing the personal anecdote of that individual to establish a trend. I cited him to show how your personal anecdote is faulty because it doesn't account for such individuals. What I cited to establish a trend was the requirements for getting a CCW in comparison to those for becoming a cop

A pretty simple and rather obvious distinction
 
TurtleDude said:
ok here is your schooling


Fact Sheet: Guns Save Lives - Gun Owners of America

and readers of Newsweek learned that "only 2 percent of civilian shootings involved an innocent person mistakenly identified as a criminal. The 'error rate' for the police, however, was 11 percent, more than five times as high."[7]
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thank you. I'll read it and get back to you

PS that's not research or data. It's a fact sheet which in no way gives me any context for the data.
 
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SMTA said:
My detective buddy Travis, who, when he retired, had not had his gun out of it's holster for many years.

It was loaded, and stuck.

We know, cause we tried to get it out.
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One of my shooting buddies, a former instructor with CPD and now a rangemaster and FFL got the contract to sell the SW trade-ins from CPD. He noted most of these guns have very little use. My similar gun has had at least 11,000 rounds through it
 
Dr. Chuckles said:
you're still showing obvious signs of confusion. I'm not citing the personal anecdote of that individual to establish a trend. I cited him to show how your personal anecdote is faulty because it doesn't account for such individuals. What I cited to establish a trend was the requirements for getting a CCW in comparison to those for becoming a cop

A pretty simple and rather obvious distinction
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No. I was laughing at the hilarity of your comment.

You are giving yourself way too much credit here.
 
TurtleDude said:
One of my shooting buddies, a former instructor with CPD and now a rangemaster and FFL got the contract to sell the SW trade-ins from CPD. He noted most of these guns have very little use. My similar gun has had at least 11,000 rounds through it
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Several of my friends have purchased these over the years.

Holster wear on the finish, and perfect bores.
 
SMTA said:
Yea, you did:



I explained that there would be no more guns, and why.

Simple.
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OK... you are fighting a strawman. Let me recap:

Μολὼν λαβέ said:
if concealed carry had been allowed, which I'm pretty sure it wasn't in this situation, the shooter wouldn't have killed nearly as many people as he did today.
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poweRob said:
That's such a bull**** hypothetical. It's just as likely that the conceal and carry person would've shot someone else by accident. Or that yet another conceal and carry person had theirs out and got mistaken for the shooter.
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SMTA said:
My first instinct is to leave a potentially violent situation, not to engage it.
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I was telling Μολὼν λαβέ his scenario where CCW's engage was bull****. You then inserted yourself into that as if you were countering me. You are agreeing with me while at the same time pretending that I'm contesting you somehow.
 
SMTA said:
Several of my friends have purchased these over the years.

Holster wear on the finish, and perfect bores.
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buds guns in KY has them for 389 they look really good

If I didn't own a drawer full I'd by a couple more
 
Dr. Chuckles said:
can you actually cite what you are referring to, like a big boy?
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you didn't understand the bit where cops are FIVE TIMES MORE LIKELY TO SHOOT AN INNOCENT PERSON
 
TurtleDude said:
you didn't understand the bit where cops are FIVE TIMES MORE LIKELY TO SHOOT AN INNOCENT PERSON
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compare the above to your first citation where you offered a direct quote, which saves me from having to read the entire article to find the relevant data
 
TurtleDude said:
you didn't understand the bit where cops are FIVE TIMES MORE LIKELY TO SHOOT AN INNOCENT PERSON
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Must have been the math part that stumped him.
 
SMTA said:
Must have been the math part that stumped him.
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I think he got schooled and didn't like it. I won't bother with anymore facts since obviously they are going to be ignored anyway

Good night all
 
TurtleDude said:
I think he got schooled and didn't like it. I won't bother with anymore facts since obviously they are going to be ignored anyway

Good night all
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You cited a quote from a news week article. Not only is that a figure likely not coming from the news week article itself, we can't even see in which context it was presented in the article.
 
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