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Thread: Active gunmen in US navy Yard [W:69, 700]

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    re: Active gunmen in US navy Yard [W:69, 700]

    Quote Originally Posted by poweRob View Post
    That's such a bull**** hypothetical. It's just as likely that the conceal and carry person would've shot someone else by accident. Or that yet another conceal and carry person had theirs out and got mistaken for the shooter.

    Here's trained officers in New York shooting at a perp and instead hitting a woman with a walker and another woman was shot in her butt. Trained officers. I could just imagine what would happen in a tense shooter scenario like today and interjecting any joe schmoe who bought a conceal and carry license put in the mix.
    Most CCW folks are better trained than cops.

    COps carry because they have to - CCW folks carry because they want to.

    CCW folks also do not have the advantage of ballistic undergarments, which makes them more dependent upon themselves.
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    re: Active gunmen in US navy Yard [W:69, 700]

    Quote Originally Posted by SMTA View Post
    Most CCW folks are better trained than cops.

    COps carry because they have to - CCW folks carry because they want to.

    CCW folks also do not have the advantage of ballistic undergarments, which makes them more dependent upon themselves.
    I doubt that's true. Maybe they go to the shooting range more and become better marksmen but with regards to situational training... I seriously doubt that. But even if it were, it doesn't help in the situation where they look like the perp and become the target from all the other CCW's and cops.
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    re: Active gunmen in US navy Yard [W:69, 700]

    Quote Originally Posted by poweRob View Post
    I doubt that's true. Maybe they go to the shooting range more and become better marksmen but with regards to situational training... I seriously doubt that. But even if it were, it doesn't help in the situation where they look like the perp and become the target from all the other CCW's and cops.
    You can seriously doubt truthful information that challenges your view of the world all you want to.

    I have been on both sides of this fence, and my comments are dead on.
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    re: Active gunmen in US navy Yard [W:69, 700]

    Quote Originally Posted by SMTA View Post
    You can seriously doubt truthful information that challenges your view of the world all you want to.

    I have been on both sides of this fence, and my comments are dead on.
    So it's something that is solely based on your personal experience as opposed to some form of documented research?

    If that is the case, while I have met some really dumb cops, there still seems to be a higher bar set in becoming a law enforcement officer in comparison to what is required to acquire a legal firearm in this country. The later is relatively easy, but the former actually requires some level of training, successful navigation of the hiring process, and a significant dedication of time

    Edit: NVM I see you were referring to a CCW permit. Which, though it's harder to get than a simply firearm, is still easier than becoming a cop and maintaining the position (in my county I simply need to recs from my neighbors and a background check)
    Last edited by Dr. Chuckles; 09-16-13 at 10:57 PM.

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    Active gunmen in US navy Yard [W:69]

    Quote Originally Posted by SMTA View Post
    You can seriously doubt truthful information that challenges your view of the world all you want to.

    I have been on both sides of this fence, and my comments are dead on.
    ...because you know the training of all CCW carriers in the nation as well as all law enforcement agencies?

    I'm just glad people like you are working hard for my freedom to be shot repeatedly while in a public place. It's priceless.
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    re: Active gunmen in US navy Yard [W:69, 700]

    Quote Originally Posted by Dr. Chuckles View Post
    So it's something that is solely based on your personal experience as opposed to some form of documented research?

    If that is the case, while I have met some really dumb cops, there still seems to be a higher bar set in becoming a cop as opposed what is required to a legal gun in this country
    Then I suggest that you understand the requirements for law enforcement, specifically firearms training.

    Generally the total hours required are about 700 hours of class time, which covers everything.

    That is about 18 weeks of instruction. Many departments require no college degree.

    Doubt all you want. Ignore all you want. Continue to be blissfully comfortable. A man has got to know his limitations.
    Greatness lies not in being strong, but in the right use of strength - Henry Ward Beecher
    Baby sister, I was born game and I intend to go out that way - Rooster Cogburn

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    re: Active gunmen in US navy Yard [W:69, 700]

    Quote Originally Posted by Threegoofs View Post
    ...because you know the training of all CCW carriers in the nation as well as all law enforcement agencies?

    I'm just glad people like you are working hard for my freedom to be shot repeatedly while in a public place. It's priceless.
    Ah, I see that you cannot understand at all.

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    re: Active gunmen in US navy Yard [W:69, 700]

    Quote Originally Posted by poweRob View Post
    I doubt that's true. Maybe they go to the shooting range more and become better marksmen but with regards to situational training... I seriously doubt that. But even if it were, it doesn't help in the situation where they look like the perp and become the target from all the other CCW's and cops.
    you are wrong. I will quote the former Cincinnati PD firearms instructor's testimony to Cincinnati City council years ago (BEFORE WE HAVE CCW)

    He noted if he went to the police range and chose 10 police officers at random and then drove a couple miles to the public indoor range target word, and chose 10 random shooters, and tested them on gun safety, marksmanship and shoot don't shoot scenarios, the non cops would win EVERY TIME.

    having trained hundreds of people, having spent hundreds of hours each year at ranges and training facilities and having defended police departments in these areas, I can tell you SMTA is absolutely correct.



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    re: Active gunmen in US navy Yard [W:69, 700]

    Quote Originally Posted by Dr. Chuckles View Post
    So it's something that is solely based on your personal experience as opposed to some form of documented research?

    If that is the case, while I have met some really dumb cops, there still seems to be a higher bar set in becoming a law enforcement officer in comparison to what is required to acquire a legal firearm in this country. The later is relatively easy, but the former actually requires some level of training, successful navigation of the hiring process, and a significant dedication of time

    Edit: NVM I see you were referring to a CCW permit. Which, though it's harder to get than a simply firearm, is still easier than becoming a cop and maintaining the position (in my county I simply need to recs from my neighbors and a background check)
    well if that were true cops would hit bad guys more than no cops and shoot less innocent people. Guess what

    they don't

    we just had a case of cops shooting two innocents in NY. its far more common with cops



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    re: Active gunmen in US navy Yard [W:69, 700]

    Quote Originally Posted by SMTA View Post
    Then I suggest that you understand the requirements for law enforcement, specifically firearms training.

    Generally the total hours required are about 700 hours of class time, which covers everything.

    That is about 18 weeks of instruction. Many departments require no college degree.

    Doubt all you want. Ignore all you want. Continue to be blissfully comfortable. A man has got to know his limitations.
    Assuming that is all correct, those are still higher requirements than what a ccw requires (at least in my area). Not to mention, you would still be over looking the fact they have to get and maintain a job as a police officer.


    ***Those all help to eliminate individuals who could still theoretically get a CCW

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