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Thread: Gay Marriage Stirs Little Public Outcry in NM[W:95]

  1. #91
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    Re: Gay Marriage Stirs Little Public Outcry in NM

    Quote Originally Posted by Kal'Stang View Post
    Heya Hic!

    The problem here is that the slippery slope arguement doesn't work as well with any other group other than having multiple partners.

    It does not work for pedophilia because a child cannot consent due to lack of understanding, knowledge, and at least 17 years of experiance.

    It also does not work with beastiality because again, no animal can consent. They simply lack the brain capacity to do so.

    Necrophilia also does not work due to the simple fact that the being is dead.

    Incest does not work due to several variables, one of which being able to, over time, being able to convince the other "partner" that "incest isn't bad. This is usually done starting at a very young age. Basically it is brainwashing. Which takes a persons free will away without them realizing it. Another reason is the genetic problems caused by incestual breeding. That can put a burden on society.

    As far as polygamy/polyandry goes I have no problem with those being accepted as it involves consenting adults.

    dont use facts they just get ignored and talked over
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  2. #92
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    Re: Gay Marriage Stirs Little Public Outcry in NM

    Quote Originally Posted by Hicup View Post
    Agreed, but the slippery slope in the case of polygamy is not a fallacy which AGENTJ made claim to. It does apply, and it is not a fallacy.


    Tim-
    nope already proved to be a fallacy when one honestly looks at the facts, law, cases and precedence set
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  3. #93
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    Re: Gay Marriage Stirs Little Public Outcry in NM

    Quote Originally Posted by AGENT J View Post
    Gay Marriage Stirs Little Public Outcry in NM - ABC News

    Back-up Links:
    NM Supreme Court Set to Hear Marriage Equality Case :: EDGE Boston
    NM Judge Upholds County's Gay Marriage Ruling - ABC News (Older but still part of the story)

    now it looks like 2 more states will be granting equal rights soon, thats 15 and that would bring the total to 3 or 5 this year depending on how you look at it> Some ruled on it before this year but it went into effect this year.

    The dominoes are falling! that's like the 3rd or 4th gays rights victory or possible victory Ive been able to post in just as many days.

    I wonder what states will be next?!
    My state already has legalized it so all's right in my world

    I don't see why it's a scary notion for some people, as long as religions aren't forced to recognize it then fine. I see nothing wrong with gay marriage and a lot of potential good that can come from it.
    I believe half of the things I say and say half of the things I believe.

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    Re: Gay Marriage Stirs Little Public Outcry in NM

    Quote Originally Posted by Monserrat View Post
    My state already has legalized it so all's right in my world

    I don't see why it's a scary notion for some people, as long as religions aren't forced to recognize it then fine. I see nothing wrong with gay marriage and a lot of potential good that can come from it.
    while i agree with you about churches being forced to marry when people bring that up, not say you, im talking about anti-gay people. I always laugh because its nothing more than a fear tactic

    1.) the constitution isnt changing to force that, just isnt gonna happen
    2.) if people are afraid about the churches being forced to marry people this has nothing to do with "the gays" Churches already dont marry STRAIGHT couples or INTERRACIAL couples or MINORITY couples or couplse not religious enough right now. ANd that is their right. And im fine with CHURCHES being allowed to discriminate.

    but the fact is a person could try to sue a church now without equal gay rights but they would fail majorly.

    sorry just a small rant
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    Re: Gay Marriage Stirs Little Public Outcry in NM

    Moderator's Warning:
    Gay Marriage Stirs Little Public Outcry in NM[W:95]There has been some derailment over posting styles. Please drop it and return to the topic.
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    Re: Gay Marriage Stirs Little Public Outcry in NM

    Quote Originally Posted by AGENT J View Post
    nope already proved to be a fallacy when one honestly looks at the facts, law, cases and precedence set
    What are you talking about? Polygamy was once legal in some of the United States, and is no longer legal. That is a fact, and supported by case law. Do you deny this?

    Fact: Only in a few states is SSM legal now, but only recently has that been the case. Previously, and still in most United States, gay marriage is illegal, do you deny this?

    Fact: Gay marriage has been made legal in a few states, and the basis for making SSM legal was due to a claim that gay people were being discriminated against. Why they were being discriminated against is not nearly as important as the discrimination itself.

    Fact: Polygamists are being discriminated against.

    Fact: Polygamists, as with gay people are of legal consenting age. They are both consisting of legal aged men and women that, as a matter of their identity and existence, are in most states denied the rights to marriage afforded to heterosexual couples, or more accurately, consenting men and women wishing to marry only each other.

    Fact: Gays are now being permitted to marry each other in certain states, the discrimination is no longer a bar to their happiness.

    Fact: Polygamists are not allowed to marry each other, they are still being discriminated against, and are being barred from their happiness.

    Fact: The central arguments for SSM are discrimination based on gender, and or sexuality.

    Fact: Gays argue that allowing their rights to marry each other harms no one; that their right to pursue their happiness was being impeded with no compelling argument from the state in which to do so.

    Opinion: I see no material difference between the arguments presented by the gays, and those presented by polygamists.

    Fact: Allowing polygamists to marry each other harms no one.

    Fact: Allowing polygamists to marry each other would make them happy.

    Fact: There is no compelling argument from the state that should bar polygamists from pursuing their rights to marry each other.

    Opinion: Until gays successfully changed the opinion of certain courts and to some extent the people's will in some states, polygamy would never have had an avenue to pursue change itself. With this event (A), Polygamists now have the same opportunity to argue in the exact same manner that gays did, possibly leading to event (B).

    Opinion: We say possibly, but in reality the chances of polygamists all over the country using the same tactics and strategy gays have is more likely than unlikely at this point.

    FACT: THAT is the very definition of a slippery slope unfolding right before your very eyes!

    Care to dispute any of the above?

    Tim-
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    Re: Gay Marriage Stirs Little Public Outcry in NM

    Quote Originally Posted by Hicup View Post
    1.)What are you talking about? Polygamy was once legal in some of the United States, and is no longer legal. That is a fact, and supported by case law. Do you deny this?

    2.) Fact: Only in a few states is SSM legal now, but only recently has that been the case. Previously, and still in most United States, gay marriage is illegal, do you deny this?
    3.) Fact: Gay marriage has been made legal in a few states, and the basis for making SSM legal was due to a claim that gay people were being discriminated against. Why they were being discriminated against is not nearly as important as the discrimination itself.
    4.) Fact: Polygamists are being discriminated against.
    5.) Fact: Polygamists, as with gay people are of legal consenting age. They are both consisting of legal aged men and women that, as a matter of their identity and existence, are in most states denied the rights to marriage afforded to heterosexual couples, or more accurately, consenting men and women wishing to marry only each other.
    6.)Fact: Gays are now being permitted to marry each other in certain states, the discrimination is no longer a bar to their happiness.
    7.) Fact: Polygamists are not allowed to marry each other, they are still being discriminated against, and are being barred from their happiness.
    8.) Fact: The central arguments for SSM are discrimination based on gender, and or sexuality.
    9.) Fact: Gays argue that allowing their rights to marry each other harms no one; that their right to pursue their happiness was being impeded with no compelling argument from the state in which to do so.
    10.)Opinion: I see no material difference between the arguments presented by the gays, and those presented by polygamists.
    11.) Fact: Allowing polygamists to marry each other harms no one.
    12.) Fact: Allowing polygamists to marry each other would make them happy.
    13.) Fact: There is no compelling argument from the state that should bar polygamists from pursuing their rights to marry each other.
    14.) Opinion: Until gays successfully changed the opinion of certain courts and to some extent the people's will in some states, polygamy would never have had an avenue to pursue change itself. With this event (A), Polygamists now have the same opportunity to argue in the exact same manner that gays did, possibly leading to event (B).
    15.) Opinion: We say possibly, but in reality the chances of polygamists all over the country using the same tactics and strategy gays have is more likely than unlikely at this point.
    16.) FACT: THAT is the very definition of a slippery slope unfolding right before your very eyes!
    17.) Care to dispute any of the above?

    Tim-
    1.) no, weird can you point out where i denied this? thats right i didnt and its meaningless to the topic of slipper slope using only gay marriage precedence
    2.) no, weird can you point out where i denied this? thats right i didnt and its meaningless to the topic of slipper slope using only gay marriage precedence
    3.) FALSE, its VERY important because thats the ONLY FACTUAL way to use a slipper slope argument. if not i could say freeing the slaves was the gate way to gay marrige because of discrimination thats all that matters. sorry thats NOT a slipper slope.
    4.) false, legally they are not unless there is a constitution/law out there that specifically says polygamist are not allowed to marry THEN they would be discriminated against and that would have NOTHING to do with gay marriage
    5.) FALSE. again see #4
    6.) gays are now being granted EQUAL rights
    7.) legally they have equal rights NOBODY is allowed to have a marriage contract with multiple partners
    8.) discrimination based on EQUAL rights and gender
    9.) this is only an argument when bigots try to say its not about equal rights and its evil and damaging to society which all educated people laugh at that lie
    10,) of course you dont but LAW, FACTS and PRECEDENCE do and it makes your opinion false
    11.) weird can you point out where i denied this? thats right i didnt and its meaningless to the topic of slipper slope using only gay marriage precedence but i agree if its consenting adults
    12.) weird can you point out where i denied this? thats right i didnt and its meaningless to the topic of slipper slope using only gay marriage precedence but i agree if its consenting adults
    13.) not a fact, i dont have one, i support them fighting for this NEW right but its not a fact
    14.) 100% false and idiotic. It has nothgin to do with equal rights for gays theres no logic or fact to support this
    15.) false because it wont be the SAME it will be its own thing
    16.) no its not because all your examples failed they are made up and facts destroy them, say simply the word discrimination is the slipper slope would make everything in the world a slipper slope. SOrry facts deafeat you again
    17.) yes i do and i did

    you post failed again because NOTHING you mentioned is a slipper slope from equal rights of gays to polygamy. NOTHING.

    again let me know when you have ANY fact, laws and precedence to back up your failed claims and please try to focus on those words because BS and opinion is not facts law and precedence.
    WOw that was easy as could be, still laughing at any argument for discrimination is the slipper slope, did you really think anybody honest and objective would buy that BS

    thanks for playing
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    Re: Gay Marriage Stirs Little Public Outcry in NM

    Quote Originally Posted by Hicup View Post
    FACT: THAT is the very definition of a slippery slope unfolding right before your very eyes!

    Care to dispute any of the above?

    Tim-
    Actually it is generally understood that when a slippery slope happens the subject at hand goes from bad to worse. What is bad with polygamists marrying?
    I have an answer for everything...you may not like the answer or it may not satisfy your curiosity..but it will still be an answer. ~ Kal'Stang

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    Re: Gay Marriage Stirs Little Public Outcry in NM

    Quote Originally Posted by Kal'Stang View Post
    Actually it is generally understood that when a slippery slope happens the subject at hand goes from bad to worse. What is bad with polygamists marrying?
    yeah i agree there is a negative connotation with the fallacy, just like the word cult. All religions are in fact cults but some people get offended or defensive because of the negative connotation.

    but in this case there isnt even a slippery slope that directly/solely connects with equal rights for Gays

    anything polygamist fight for could be done if gays never existed so the slippery slope argument is a failure and a lie.
    Last edited by AGENT J; 09-13-13 at 03:11 PM.
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    Re: Gay Marriage Stirs Little Public Outcry in NM

    Quote Originally Posted by AGENT J View Post
    yeah i agree there is a negative connotation with the fallacy, just like the word cult. All religions are in fact cults but some people get offended or defensive because of the negative connotation.

    but in this case there isnt even a slipper slope that directly/solely connects with equal rights for Gays

    anything polygamist fight for could be done if gays never existed so the slipper slop argument is a failure and a lie.
    I agree with this.
    I have an answer for everything...you may not like the answer or it may not satisfy your curiosity..but it will still be an answer. ~ Kal'Stang

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