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Thread: Syria crisis: UK to put forward UN resolution

  1. #131
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    Re: Syria crisis: UK to put forward UN resolution

    Quote Originally Posted by greengirl77 View Post
    Oh and Republicans have done so much better at it please. Last Republican lied to get us into a war. Republicans have dug deeper pits than Dems ever will
    Heya Greengirl. Well on this issue both parties are divided over it. Neo Libs and Neo Cons want to jump. Others don't.

    Some lawmakers don't buy it.

    “Before engaging in a military strike against Assad’s forces, the United States must understand that this action will likely draw us into a much wider and much longer-term conflict that could mean an even greater loss of life within Syria,” Senate Foreign Relations Committee member Chris Murphy (D-Conn.) said in a statement Tuesday. “I urge the Administration to continue to exercise restraint, because absent an imminent threat to America’s national security, the U.S. should not take military action without Congressional authorization.”

    Twenty-one Republican lawmakers, joined by one Democrat, so far have signed onto a House letter to Obama demanding that Congress sign off on any military response.

    “Engaging our military in Syria when no direct threat to the United States exists and without prior congressional authorization would violate the separation of powers that is clearly delineated in the Constitution,” says the letter, spearheaded by Rep. Scott Rigell (R-Va.).

    Others have made their voices heard separately.


    Read more: Kucinich: Syria strike would turn US into 'al Qaeda's air force' - The Hill's Global Affairs
    Follow us: @thehill on Twitter | TheHill on Facebook

  2. #132
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    Re: Syria crisis: UK to put forward UN resolution

    Quote Originally Posted by donsutherland1 View Post
    Pete,

    I'm suggesting that what the UN does or, in the case, fails to do, will not stop the U.S., UK, France, and some others from carrying out military action.
    Actually there is a big difference. Most if not all of Frances military "interventions" were sanctioned by the UN or they were invited in by the sitting government of the country in question. France rarely unilaterally goes out and does an Iraq.

    Such action appears increasingly likely and imminent. Given the pace of consultations, it would not surprise me if the operation's timing is a matter of days rather than a matter of weeks away.

    In the U.S., much was made about the Bush Administration's rush into Iraq before there was evidence that it had reconstituted a WMD program. Post-war, it was found that it had not. Now, it appears that the U.S. is poised to launch another military operation in the face of incomplete evidence and significant uncertainty.
    Yes but in the Iraq case we knew then (the French and Germans both had evidence that contradicted the US narrative and it was shared but ignored, plus even the US had evidence that contradicted the narrative), and certainly know now, that the Bush administration was cherry picking evidence to suit their narrative. The same thing seems to be happening again here.. and that is what must stop.
    PeteEU

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    Re: Syria crisis: UK to put forward UN resolution

    Quote Originally Posted by MMC View Post
    Yes but like here, Pete. Keeping a small force at the Airport to hurry on out. Doesn't count. Plus For Mali.....France had to have us ship them and carry them to their own fight. Use our Infrared and Satellite tracking. Things the French should be able to do all on their own.
    Only the US and Russia has the airlifting capacity to move large amounts of troops fast.. France needed this because the situation was dire in Mali. And why on earth should every country on the planet have infrared and satellite tracking .. seems a waste when both are members of NATO.

    Does France have troops in Syria Pete?
    ¨

    They have troops in Lebanon.. so almost. Where are the closest US troops.. hmmm Germany or Afghanistan.

    Since when do the French decide they can go and punish anyone?
    When the UN says they can.. because normally France asks.
    PeteEU

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    Re: Syria crisis: UK to put forward UN resolution

    Quote Originally Posted by PeteEU View Post
    Only the US and Russia has the airlifting capacity to move large amounts of troops fast.. France needed this because the situation was dire in Mali. And why on earth should every country on the planet have infrared and satellite tracking .. seems a waste when both are members of NATO.

    ¨

    They have troops in Lebanon.. so almost. Where are the closest US troops.. hmmm Germany or Afghanistan.



    When the UN says they can.. because normally France asks.

    Well, I would ask Hillary she said they were using them to assist the Syrian Rebels to evade capture when we were only sending minor aid to them.

    Closest US Troops Pete.....Jordan, Turkey, Israel, Right there Johnny Quest McCain Style Like on the spot.

    Then of course as you Noticed in Africa. Right upwind of the French Foreign Legion in Djibouti.

    That's just it Pete.....the UN can say they can. But when will they ever do something on their own. Without US help or assistance or our supplies?

    See that supplying issue needs to be dealt with in Foreign Policy with the US. That where I have a little problem with France puffing out their chests to punish people. I don't mind them going and punishing terrorists. I just would rather they use their own **** than ours.

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    Re: Syria crisis: UK to put forward UN resolution

    Quote Originally Posted by MMC View Post
    Well
    That's just it Pete.....the UN can say they can. But when will they ever do something on their own.
    And this is typical of an American who has zero clue on what the UN is..

    The UN has no military forces. They have no military infrastructure to speak off.. they are NOT the world police force and were never designed to be. Anything the UN does with military forces is done with donated troops and weapons... something the US almost never ever does... but France does.

    So yes the UN will never go out and do anything on their own.. because they cant according to their own rules and treaty...
    PeteEU

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    Re: Syria crisis: UK to put forward UN resolution

    Quote Originally Posted by Manc Skipper View Post
    There's no way for it to pass, with Russia and China blocking. I get the feeling the decision's made, but the US is reluctant, under pressure from its allies to be policeman again. Cameron's desperate to be seen as more macho.
    I'd say the pressure is more internal than external. Nobody in the US is keen on going to war AGAIN in ANOTHER middle eastern country with zero in return. The least we could have done is taken enough Iraqi oil to pay for the damn war.

    Screw that.

    Let them solve their own problems. Or let Europe deal with it. They need to pull their weight for once instead of just whining and monday morning quarterbacking.

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    Re: Syria crisis: UK to put forward UN resolution

    Quote Originally Posted by PeteEU View Post
    And this is typical of an American who has zero clue on what the UN is..

    The UN has no military forces. They have no military infrastructure to speak off.. they are NOT the world police force and were never designed to be. Anything the UN does with military forces is done with donated troops and weapons... something the US almost never ever does... but France does.

    So yes the UN will never go out and do anything on their own.. because they cant according to their own rules and treaty...
    We weren't talking about the UN going out Pete. We were talking about France leading the Way and always pushing to get involved into other countries business. Yet they cannot do it on their own. Its France that wants to go out and Punish People. So don't you think they should be responsible for funding themselves and to start doing things on their own. Without the US Supplies and Tech? Whats wrong with France paying their own way?

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    Re: Syria crisis: UK to put forward UN resolution

    Quote Originally Posted by PeteEU View Post
    And this is typical of an American who has zero clue on what the UN is..

    The UN has no military forces. They have no military infrastructure to speak off.. they are NOT the world police force and were never designed to be. Anything the UN does with military forces is done with donated troops and weapons... something the US almost never ever does... but France does.

    So yes the UN will never go out and do anything on their own.. because they cant according to their own rules and treaty...
    Every time the UN has ever used military force in the past 50 years it's been predominantly US forces with a few European troops sprinkled in to make the operation appear "international."

    The Persian Gulf War is the most glaring example. I think the US had like 80 percent of the troops and equipment in the fight, although the operation was under the flag of the UN.

    The US pays for the UN. The US is the most important member of the UN. If the US withdrew from the UN, the UN would no longer be relevant.

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    Re: Syria crisis: UK to put forward UN resolution

    Quote Originally Posted by MMC View Post
    Heya Greengirl. Well on this issue both parties are divided over it. Neo Libs and Neo Cons want to jump. Others don't.

    Some lawmakers don't buy it.

    “Before engaging in a military strike against Assad’s forces, the United States must understand that this action will likely draw us into a much wider and much longer-term conflict that could mean an even greater loss of life within Syria,” Senate Foreign Relations Committee member Chris Murphy (D-Conn.) said in a statement Tuesday. “I urge the Administration to continue to exercise restraint, because absent an imminent threat to America’s national security, the U.S. should not take military action without Congressional authorization.”

    Twenty-one Republican lawmakers, joined by one Democrat, so far have signed onto a House letter to Obama demanding that Congress sign off on any military response.

    “Engaging our military in Syria when no direct threat to the United States exists and without prior congressional authorization would violate the separation of powers that is clearly delineated in the Constitution,” says the letter, spearheaded by Rep. Scott Rigell (R-Va.).

    Others have made their voices heard separately.


    Read more: Kucinich: Syria strike would turn US into 'al Qaeda's air force' - The Hill's Global Affairs
    Follow us: @thehill on Twitter | TheHill on Facebook
    I know! I do not care what side of the fence anyone is on! Sending our boys and girls to fight a war that does not in anyway defend our freedoms is insane. I never had a problem going into Afganistan (sp) that had to be done. Now the rest of the wars between WWII and the Afganistan were wars of choice. That we had no business in fighting. I do not want to demean the service of the men and women who fought in them. However, shame on the ones that made them fight in them. Syria, Iran, and the rest of those rat holes can blow themselves up for all I care. When they cross the Atlantic God help them. I just am a firm believer in the fact we have no business messing in other countries affairs, let alone send good money overseas to the asshats only to be be fighting them 10 years down the road. We have made that mistake to many times. Plus I am sick of seeing our service people being brought back home in body bags for fighting for a bunch of people who could really give a damn.

    Honestly, I would be happy if Obama went to Congress and ask for military action. I hope they tell him to stick it where the sun don't shine. Our military is not a police force, nor is it a tool to make money for war profiteers. These men and woman are not mercenaries despites what more than a few Congressmen and Presidents have thought in the past.

  10. #140
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    Re: Syria crisis: UK to put forward UN resolution

    Quote Originally Posted by Peter Grimm View Post
    Every time the UN has ever used military force in the past 50 years it's been predominantly US forces with a few European troops sprinkled in to make the operation appear "international."
    Bull**** on so many levels. Where were the US troops in Cyprus, most conflicts in Africa and so on.

    The Persian Gulf War is the most glaring example. I think the US had like 80 percent of the troops and equipment in the fight, although the operation was under the flag of the UN.
    No it was not. It was authorized by the UN, but not under the UN flag, because the US refuses to let its troops be commanded by anyone else but an American. Big difference. There were no blue helmets on the ground.

    The US pays for the UN.
    No, we all pay for the UN. The US being the biggest economy, pays the most yes. That is how it is.

    The US is the most important member of the UN. If the US withdrew from the UN, the UN would no longer be relevant.
    Talk about being arrogant.. If the US withdrew from the UN, then yes it would be less relevant for the US, but it would be irrelevant. It would also make the US isolated and irrelevant.. but hey!
    PeteEU

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