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Thread: Reid says Obamacare just a step toward eventual single-payer system[W:1539]

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    re: Reid says Obamacare just a step toward eventual single-payer system[W:1539]

    Quote Originally Posted by NIMBY View Post
    OKay. And I'll bet you think all of these bad things happening because of Obama federally and Illinois at the state level happened overnight when Dems took over. Back to the future revision.
    It should be noted that Illinois is a net federal taxpayer. Meaning, the amount of federal income taxes paid to the federal government is greater than the amount of federal tax expenditures allocated to the state. How much so? Between 1990 and 2009, Illinois net tax contributions to the federal government was equivalent to 111% of the states 2009 GDP, or approximately $700 billion.

    This money goes to cover the state shortfalls in Kentucky, Tennessee, Alabama, Mississippi, Florida, Louisiana, New Mexico, Arizona, etc.... You know, for things like anti-poverty initiatives, civil service pensions, farm subsidies, nutritional aid, military spending, benefits, etc....
    It is not very unreasonable that the rich should contribute to the public expense, not only in proportion to their revenue, but something more than in that proportion.
    "Wealth of Nations," Book V, Chapter II, Part II, Article I, pg.911

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    re: Reid says Obamacare just a step toward eventual single-payer system[W:1539]

    Quote Originally Posted by NIMBY View Post
    If you only knew half the garbage Big Jerk Thompson pulled when making deals with Dem Chicago crooks, not the type that current Gov. Quinn is BTW.

    His pension is now more than he made as governor, thanks to a compound COLA bill he signed while in office.
    If they live long enough, lots of people end up with pensions higher than their final salaries. JT has lived a long time after leaving office. Such COLA's are not unusual. Otherwise, he was the state's longest serving governor, so he must have done some things right.
    "It's always reassuring to find you've made the right enemies." -- William J. Donovan

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    re: Reid says Obamacare just a step toward eventual single-payer system[W:1539]

    BTW, Ogilvie refused to sign the bill from the Dem. GA to allow the state to short the public pension funds. This went by the way-side in 1973 when Walker signed it after defeating Ogilvie. Edgar could have been great, but had a weak heart, and retired in 1995 for G. Ryan.
    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Hays View Post
    Ogilvie was my favorite as well.

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    re: Reid says Obamacare just a step toward eventual single-payer system[W:1539]

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Hays View Post
    Not surprising that those at the point of attack (so to speak) would welcome more resources. That was not, however, a discussion of health care. And in any case, the fact that someone wants does not oblige me to give.
    No, it was a discussion of charity. Focus.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    re: Reid says Obamacare just a step toward eventual single-payer system[W:1539]

    I seethe at his name. We used to talk before DP about means-testing on these pensions. How much is enough off the gov't teat? He has a highly successful attorney's office, even defended ex-con Gov. Ryan. His connections from gov't service should be enough.
    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Hays View Post
    If they live long enough, lots of people end up with pensions higher than their final salaries. JT has lived a long time after leaving office. Such COLA's are not unusual. Otherwise, he was the state's longest serving governor, so he must have done some things right.

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    re: Reid says Obamacare just a step toward eventual single-payer system[W:1539]

    Quote Originally Posted by NIMBY View Post
    BTW, Ogilvie refused to sign the bill from the Dem. GA to allow the state to short the public pension funds. This went by the way-side in 1973 when Walker signed it after defeating Ogilvie. Edgar could have been great, but had a weak heart, and retired in 1995 for G. Ryan.
    Walker was awful. I remember Ogilvie complaining: "It's his good looks against our good record." Oh well, file it under "life lessons." Sometimes the good guy doesn't win.
    "It's always reassuring to find you've made the right enemies." -- William J. Donovan

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    re: Reid says Obamacare just a step toward eventual single-payer system[W:1539]

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    No, it was a discussion of charity. Focus.
    Yes. It was a discussion of charity. So what?
    "It's always reassuring to find you've made the right enemies." -- William J. Donovan

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    re: Reid says Obamacare just a step toward eventual single-payer system[W:1539]

    Quote Originally Posted by NIMBY View Post
    I seethe at his name. We used to talk before DP about means-testing on these pensions. How much is enough off the gov't teat? He has a highly successful attorney's office, even defended ex-con Gov. Ryan. His connections from gov't service should be enough.
    He gets what he gets. That's the law of the land.
    "It's always reassuring to find you've made the right enemies." -- William J. Donovan

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    re: Reid says Obamacare just a step toward eventual single-payer system[W:1539]

    And this line of discussion is why C. Christie cuts into Dem. demographics. Such as women, private union, even some public, ACA, etc--CC can make the case to Blue states he is one of them. Repubs are stuck with CC and will hold their nose and vote for him.
    Quote Originally Posted by Kushinator View Post
    It should be noted that Illinois is a net federal taxpayer. Meaning, the amount of federal income taxes paid to the federal government is greater than the amount of federal tax expenditures allocated to the state. How much so? Between 1990 and 2009, Illinois net tax contributions to the federal government was equivalent to 111% of the states 2009 GDP, or approximately $700 billion.

    This money goes to cover the state shortfalls in Kentucky, Tennessee, Alabama, Mississippi, Florida, Louisiana, New Mexico, Arizona, etc.... You know, for things like anti-poverty initiatives, civil service pensions, farm subsidies, nutritional aid, military spending, benefits, etc....

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    re: Reid says Obamacare just a step toward eventual single-payer system[W:1539]

    Quote Originally Posted by Neomalthusian View Post
    There's something going on with this post that makes it difficult to understand.

    From what I can gather, you are apparently trying to base public policy off of what we find psychologically acceptable or unacceptable, which usually makes sense, but sometimes it doesn't. When we see one person violating another's rights, we find it to be unacceptable, and it's reasonable to make laws against one person abusing another. When it comes to death and dying, we get really sensitive and sometimes not rational. For example, a dying person, or the loved ones of a dying person, might feel entitled to any and all amount of money and effort on the part of others to save the life, because they don't want to die or don't want the other person to die. This is psychologically somewhat normal (to cling to life), but that doesn't mean it's rational of financially workable.

    We simply cannot entitle people to unlimited resources of others the moment they hit a desperate circumstance, and this is because 100% of us eventually hit a desperate circumstance.
    First, no one said anything about unlimited. Every system has limitations. No one pretends otherwise.

    But, factually, we have proven as a people we won't allow denial of emergency care for example. Good policy or not, it's a fact that we've said no. So, we can plan to cover this and other such issues, or pretend that it's being covered. UHC allows us to better plan. Yes, some things are more elective. And everyone is free to buy what they can afford with those things. But basic care, needed care, we'd do better as a people to plan for it.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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