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Thread: Reid says Obamacare just a step toward eventual single-payer system[W:1539]

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    re: Reid says Obamacare just a step toward eventual single-payer system[W:1539]

    Quote Originally Posted by calamity View Post
    Unlike you and your ilk, I'm not afraid of a bunch of misfits riding on the backs of camels.
    How did those camels hit the twin towers?

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    re: Reid says Obamacare just a step toward eventual single-payer system[W:1539]

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    I linked for you a while back that Medicare isn't as bad off as reported. Yes, they are asked to do a lot. More than envisioned with an aging population. It's a serious problem. But you misread the this. You think giving them care, which has improved the lives if the elderly immensely is too huge a burden. We could try to figure out a better way, which, btw, would be helped by going to a UHC system.

    And as is the common practice on these sites, you're exaggerating the problem. Some have refused patients. But the elderly still get care. Doctors are not going broke. Not here. Not in Canada. Not in Great Britain. Not in France.

    And I care less if you like Obama. Bush lies never bothered you, so such talk by you is just partisan. What I have been talking about here is what I prefer and about Obama in any way. So, say the typing. You have no audience here for the partisan silliness.
    Do you know what an unfunded mandate is? Think those IOU's are funded?

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    re: Reid says Obamacare just a step toward eventual single-payer system[W:1539]

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    I linked for you a while back that Medicare isn't as bad off as reported. Yes, they are asked to do a lot. More than envisioned with an aging population. It's a serious problem. But you misread the this. You think giving them care, which has improved the lives if the elderly immensely is too huge a burden. We could try to figure out a better way, which, btw, would be helped by going to a UHC system.

    And as is the common practice on these sites, you're exaggerating the problem. Some have refused patients. But the elderly still get care. Doctors are not going broke. Not here. Not in Canada. Not in Great Britain. Not in France.

    And I care less if you like Obama. Bush lies never bothered you, so such talk by you is just partisan. What I have been talking about here is what I prefer and about Obama in any way. So, say the typing. You have no audience here for the partisan silliness.
    Math is not your friend here. Medicare, which is underfunded, is paid for by a 2.9% payroll tax on every dollar that you earn and benefits are granted only upon reaching age 65. PPACA is "paid for" by as little as a 2% tax on AGI and benefits are available immediately.
    “The reasonable man adapts himself to the world: the unreasonable one persists to adapt the world to himself.
    Therefore all progress depends on the unreasonable man.” ― George Bernard Shaw, Man and Superman

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    re: Reid says Obamacare just a step toward eventual single-payer system[W:1539]

    Quote Originally Posted by ttwtt78640 View Post
    What are you talking about? Are you asserting that income based subsidies (income redistribution) is the magical fix to grant "access to" all necessary goods and services? All have "access to" grocery stores, in fact, most are expected to actually pay for the cost of their purchases made in these private establishments (by *gasp* earning/saving the money to do so) but some are now given a special privilege, based largely upon economic need (actually, personal failure to meet that economic need) to have others pay for some (or all) of their purchases in these grocery stores.
    What I sad was improving insurance coverage wasn't a bad thing. It's a simple statement.

    Medicine isn't grocery either. While we have private fire departments, we recognize the need for public ones. We have private police as well, but rightly recognize the need for public police. We even recognize the need for assistance with food. Medicine, largely more expensive than food, can be more efficiently handled for the most people through a more rational system. There are people who work, do their part, and are not adequately insured. We all ay for that.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    re: Reid says Obamacare just a step toward eventual single-payer system[W:1539]

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post
    Do you know what an unfunded mandate is? Think those IOU's are funded?
    Yes I do. Doesn't change what I said.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    re: Reid says Obamacare just a step toward eventual single-payer system[W:1539]

    Quote Originally Posted by ttwtt78640 View Post
    Math is not your friend here. Medicare, which is underfunded, is paid for by a 2.9% payroll tax on every dollar that you earn and benefits are granted only upon reaching age 65. PPACA is "paid for" by as little as a 2% tax on AGI and benefits are available immediately.
    I think you're mistaken on what I'm addressing. My conversation with conservative isn't about PPACA. I spoke of a 6% increase in taxes but removing insurance from employers, which would give a net gain for the worker. Laid that out earlier. He bounces back and forth between cost and quality never addressing the rebuttal.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    re: Reid says Obamacare just a step toward eventual single-payer system[W:1539]

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    I think you're mistaken on what I'm addressing. My conversation with conservative isn't about PPACA. I spoke of a 6% increase in taxes but removing insurance from employers, which would give a net gain for the worker. Laid that out earlier. He bounces back and forth between cost and quality never addressing the rebuttal.
    A 6% tax on every dollar of income (much less only a 6% increase in the current income tax) is not going to cover medical care expenses now at nearly 18% of GDP.

    Per capita annual medical costs are now close to $7K, so even a 10% tax on income of $70K would be the "break even point" for UHC without a very serious reduction in medical care costs/quality.
    “The reasonable man adapts himself to the world: the unreasonable one persists to adapt the world to himself.
    Therefore all progress depends on the unreasonable man.” ― George Bernard Shaw, Man and Superman

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    re: Reid says Obamacare just a step toward eventual single-payer system[W:1539]

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    Yes I do. Doesn't change what I said.
    Seems to me that you claimed Medicare wasn't in bad shape at all. Again you are wrong. IOU's have to be funded

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    re: Reid says Obamacare just a step toward eventual single-payer system[W:1539]

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post
    Seems to me that you claimed Medicare wasn't in bad shape at all. Again you are wrong. IOU's have to be funded
    As does the affordable care act.
    The haggardness of poverty is everywhere seen contrasted with the sleekness of wealth, the exhorted labor of some compensating for the idleness of others, wretched hovels by the side of stately colonnades, the rags of indigence blended with the ensigns of opulence; in a word, the most useless profusion in the midst of the most urgent wants.Jean-Baptiste Say

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    re: Reid says Obamacare just a step toward eventual single-payer system[W:1539]

    Quote Originally Posted by ttwtt78640 View Post
    A 6% tax on every dollar of income (much less only a 6% increase in the current income tax) is not going to cover medical care expenses now at nearly 18% of GDP.

    Per capita annual medical costs are now close to $7K, so even a 10% tax on income of $70K would be the "break even point" for UHC without a very serious reduction in medical care costs/quality.
    It also reduces costs with a reduction in paper work. However:

    . . . with average earnings of $79,000,000+. Clearly this pushes the average much higher and that is why you see the average household income at $69,821.

    http://www.mybudget360.com/how-much-...age-us-income/

    Employers would also save money. We'd be ahead even if we raised the %.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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