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Greenwald says 'low-level' NSA workers can tap into phone, Internet records

Misterveritis said:
Snowden has awakened a sleeping giant. I am surprised that you do not see the growing rage. At town halls citizens are asking their reps why they support the NSA spying on American citizens.
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lol town halls.

I recognize that you are part of the problem and are unlikely to ever be part of the solution. There were Tories in the first Revolution. There will be Statists in the next. You are a statist. I get it.
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Good.

Do you think my prediction is a call to violence? I see what is coming very clearly. There are a few hundred million armed citizens that are becoming very frustrated by this government. We will fight you every way we can. And in the end we win. You lose.
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I don't think you're gonna fight, there's like 100 of you, and you mostly post here. You're nothing. That's why you can't change anything: there aren't enough of you to vote anyone into power that thinks like you.

We have a rendezvous with destiny. And you are on the wrong side.
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No you. (I'm making fun of you, see?)
 
OldWorldOrder said:
No. Sorry. Poor answer.
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I understand with your limited perspective that you failed to understand. That is the way it is. We all have a limited perspective. That's okay. We have these cultural/knowledge transfer items called books, I recommend them.

What is an airstrike if not asymmetrical warfare? I could give you any of a number of examples but it would be tedious.

A homicide bomber is the poor man's cruise missile strike. Nothing more.

Obama spying on Americans is asymmetrical warfare. What can we do? We are unable to defend ourselves against this enemy.
 
Misterveritis said:
I understand with your limited perspective that you failed to understand. That is the way it is. We all have a limited perspective. That's okay. We have these cultural/knowledge transfer items called books, I recommend them.

What is an airstrike if not asymmetrical warfare? I could give you any of a number of examples but it would be tedious.

A homicide bomber is the poor man's cruise missile strike. Nothing more.

Obama spying on Americans is asymmetrical warfare. What can we do? We are unable to defend ourselves against this enemy.
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You just can't wrap your head about a representative government not promoting what you believe, can you?
 
OldWorldOrder said:
lol town halls.

Good.

I don't think you're gonna fight, there's like 100 of you, and you mostly post here. You're nothing. That's why you can't change anything: there aren't enough of you to vote anyone into power that thinks like you.

No you. (I'm making fun of you, see?)
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I already am fighting. I hope you remain in the dark. I want all statists to remain in the dark until it is too late for you. If we fail to return the nation to its Constitutional moorings then we fail. But until that day we will not give in any more than the founders did.

Slumber peacefully.
 
OldWorldOrder said:
You just can't wrap your head about a representative government not promoting what you believe, can you?
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Wisdom gives me the ability to discern right from wrong even when I cannot prove it. You might have it someday.

You do not get to spy on American citizens. If we know and we let you then this is the end for this nation.
 
Misterveritis said:
I already am fighting. I hope you remain in the dark. I want all statists to remain in the dark until it is too late for you. If we fail to return the nation to its Constitutional moorings then we fail. But until that day we will not give in any more than the founders did.

Slumber peacefully.
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You just can't wrap your head about a representative government not promoting what you believe, can you?
 
Misterveritis said:
Wisdom gives me the ability to discern right from wrong even when I cannot prove it. You might have it someday.

You do not get to spy on American citizens. If we know and we let you then this is the end for this nation.
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You just can't wrap your head about a representative government not promoting what you believe, can you?
 
For those who didn't read all 41 pages, I can sum up OldWorldOrder's logical flow thus:

Post 1: Ad Hominem

Post 2: Appeal to authority

Post 3: Ad Hominem

Post 4: Appeal to authority

Post 5: Ad Hominem

Post 6: Appeal to authority

etc.
 
Maybe they should read then and come up with their own conclusions...
 
StringBean said:
For those who didn't read all 41 pages, I can sum up OldWorldOrder's logical flow thus:

Post 1: Ad Hominem

Post 2: Appeal to authority

Post 3: Ad Hominem

Post 4: Appeal to authority

Post 5: Ad Hominem

Post 6: Appeal to authority

etc.
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And StringBean's:

Post 1: Hypocritical Ad Hominem
 
Jango said:
Greenwald says 'low-level' NSA workers can tap into phone, Internet records | Fox News

So how do you feel about this? Do you think that this dragnet that ensnares us all is necessary and just? How about Constitutional? Does it make you feel safer? What is the natural progression from here?
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I don't think this is Constitutional in the least. I fear that we've allowed the State to dictate to us the terms of the 4th when it should be the other way around. I'm tired of the government doing whatever they want with my information. That's part of my papers and effects and they can kindly butt out.
 
A secretive U.S. Drug Enforcement Agency unit is taking information gathered by intelligence agencies and using it to prosecute Americans, sometimes for minor offenses, according to a Reuters report. Furthermore, DEA agents have been instructed to obfuscate how they came into possession of the information and reverse-engineer the evidence trail to make it appear as if the information was obtained through other means, Reuters reported.

At question are the practices of the DEA's Special Operations Division (SOD), which works with two dozen partner agencies, including the CIA, National Security Agency, Internal Revenue Service and Department of Homeland Security. The DEA unit reportedly has been passing NSA-furnished counterterrorism surveillance -- including wiretap information, tips and telephone records -- to other agencies, some of which are using it as part of criminal investigations unrelated to espionage, terrorism or nuclear proliferation.

DEA, NSA Teamwork: 6 Privacy Worries - Security - Privacy -
 
DEA deal with money laundering, drugs, human trafficking etc; so it makes sense that they would use intel to pursue their mission.

Don't be a drug smuggler and they won't be looking for you...

What's with everyone being scared of their shadow? LOL
 
greyhat said:
DEA deal with money laundering, drugs, human trafficking etc; so it makes sense that they would use intel to pursue their mission.

Don't be a drug smuggler and they won't be looking for you...

What's with everyone being scared of their shadow? LOL
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This is basically a conspiracy theory website, dude. I mean, not quite serious political discussion, not quite full on UFO forums, but it's definitely over there on the spectrum, ya know?
 
OldWorldOrder said:
This is basically a conspiracy theory website, dude. I mean, not quite serious political discussion, not quite full on UFO forums, but it's definitely over there on the spectrum, ya know?
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I agree! It's like paranoia central.
 
OldWorldOrder said:
This is basically a conspiracy theory website, dude. I mean, not quite serious political discussion, not quite full on UFO forums, but it's definitely over there on the spectrum, ya know?
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Nice try. As mentioned in the link, the story has been in many mainsteam papers and originate from
Reuters Exclusive: U.S. directs agents to cover up program used to investigate Americans | Reuters

"A secretive U.S. Drug Enforcement Administration unit is funneling information from intelligence intercepts, wiretaps, informants and a massive database of telephone records to authorities across the nation to help them launch criminal investigations of Americans.

Although these cases rarely involve national security issues, documents reviewed by Reuters show that law enforcement agents have been directed to conceal how such investigations truly begin - not only from defense lawyers but also sometimes from prosecutors and judges.

The undated documents show that federal agents are trained to "recreate" the investigative trail to effectively cover up where the information originated, a practice that some experts say violates a defendant's Constitutional right to a fair trial. If defendants don't know how an investigation began, they cannot know to ask to review potential sources of exculpatory evidence - information that could reveal entrapment, mistakes or biased witnesses....."

You don't have to worry about government surveillance unless you're a terrorist.....

or talk to anyone who smokes pot or uses medical cannabis.
 
Hard Truth said:
Nice try.[/B]
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Nice try about what? In the past few days, I've read more about coverups and imminent coup d'etats than any one other thing in this forum. Some guy today tried to argue that bin Laden was a CIA 'operative' (whatever that means) that toured US military bases.

I said this was half conspiracy website/half political website. How is that a 'nice try'? Do you disagree or something?
 
greyhat said:
DEA deal with money laundering, drugs, human trafficking etc; so it makes sense that they would use intel to pursue their mission.

Don't be a drug smuggler and they won't be looking for you...

What's with everyone being scared of their shadow? LOL
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The "you don't have anything to fear if you're not doing anything wrong" argument tends to be the last argument one makes when they have no real argument to posit. Appeal to authority, tis logical fallacy.
 
Ikari said:
The "you don't have anything to fear if you're not doing anything wrong" argument tends to be the last argument one makes when they have no real argument to posit. Appeal to authority, tis logical fallacy.
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It's not that simple you know..intel collection is fairly grey; you have to look at context and not just jump to conclusion that you're being targeted.

We're fighting an asymmetrical war with an enemy that could give a shyt about your privacy all while trying to put together a digital puzzle to keep you safe.

Like I said- Facebook and Google know a hell of a lot more about you than the NSA. These are highly technical programs designed to keep people safe- no one gives a shyt about your private lives, sorry you're just not that important...
 
greyhat said:
....no one gives a shyt about your private lives, sorry you're just not that important...
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unless you or someone you know talks about illegal drugs, including medical cannabis.
 
greyhat said:
It's not that simple you know..intel collection is fairly grey; you have to look at context and not just jump to conclusion that you're being targeted.

We're fighting an asymmetrical war with an enemy that could give a shyt about your privacy all while trying to put together a digital puzzle to keep you safe.

Like I said- Facebook and Google know a hell of a lot more about you than the NSA. These are highly technical programs designed to keep people safe- no one gives a shyt about your private lives, sorry you're just not that important...
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Facebook and Google are datamined by the NSA, so the NSA is up to date. It indeed isn't that simple, but you offered up only simple argument. What enemy are we fighting that I have to be so worried about as to abdicate any amount of privacy to the government? I do think the whole "they're coming after your rights, so give them up to the government" argument is not so convincing.
 
Hard Truth said:
unless you or someone you know talks about illegal drugs, including medical cannabis.
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What are you taking about? You think that because you said "weed" someone is going to knock on your door? Be serious..
 
greyhat said:
What are you taking about? You think that because you said "weed" someone is going to knock on your door? Be serious..
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You have to search pressure cooker and backpack for that to happen.
 
Ikari said:
Facebook and Google are datamined by the NSA, so the NSA is up to date. It indeed isn't that simple, but you offered up only simple argument. What enemy are we fighting that I have to be so worried about as to abdicate any amount of privacy to the government? I do think the whole "they're coming after your rights, so give them up to the government" argument is not so convincing.
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Go back and read all 40+ pages of posts before you assume you know what I've said...
 
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