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Thread: Judge rules Detroit bankruptcy filing UNCONSTITUTIONAL[W:584]

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    re: Judge rules Detroit bankruptcy filing UNCONSTITUTIONAL[W:584]

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    Why are you lying? Why are you attempting to take a part of my post and take it out of its complete context?
    The context really doesn't matter. The entire post is riddled with denial.
    Why would you intentionally misrepresent my complete argument which had the total opposite end as its major point?
    Jack Fabulous did no such thing.
    My point was clear: those on the right who attempt to use the Detroit situation as a sledge hammer to beat Democrats or the progressives and blame them as the cause of the Detroit bankruptcy and engaging in intellectual fraud.
    They deserve to be beaten with sledgehammers and those who voted for them deserve to be ridiculed forever.

    it ignores many things including what I repeatedly stated were the main reasons for the situation
    1- the economic abandonment of the city as evident by a 2/3 population exodus and loss of businness. jobs and the tax base which went with it, and
    Why did they leave? High taxes? Corruption? They could see the writing on the crumbling walls?
    2- the tremendous racial gap and divide and the problems caused by that.
    And who was responsible for that? Are you blaming Blacks here? Whites? What is the point of this assertion?

    They should let Detroit die peacefully and then use it as a monument for all the leftism stands for, as a reminder to future generations of what happens when governments, unions, and crony capitalists collude to fill their pockets at the expense of the people.

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    re: Judge rules Detroit bankruptcy filing UNCONSTITUTIONAL[W:584]

    Quote Originally Posted by Grant View Post
    The context really doesn't matter.
    And after admitting that - it shows that even you have owned up to your admiration of and support for intellectual fraud. In all my years I have never seen anybody say that context is not important.

    But congratulations on admitting what you are really doing here. At least now its out in the open for all to see.
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    re: Judge rules Detroit bankruptcy filing UNCONSTITUTIONAL[W:584]

    Quote Originally Posted by Green Balls View Post
    The fact of the matter is Coleman Young allowed Detroit's government to become corrupted during his 30+ years in office. The city council started funneling money to the point where it seemed to magically disappear. The police department became corrupt. The school board became corrupt. It isn't a coincidence that all this happened while he was in office. Yes, it became worse after he was out, but it all started with him. He only managed to stay in office that long because he had cronies that would target most of the poor people by telling them their houses would be torn down if they didn't vote for him.
    Coleman Young was a terrible mayor for one main reason: he pursued his goal of a black city above all else. In doing this - telling people to hit the road at Eight Mile - he drove out most of the remaining whites and that was then followed by middle class blacks who did not want to live in a poor city environment. That was his crime and that was his great sin.

    Young did not have to threaten anybody. He was an immensely popular figure in the black community and they were more than willing to overlook any failings he had.

    He had people on his staff go to prison. But he himself was never charged or tried for anything.

    btw - you want to leave the school board out of it in liking him to the mayor as the two are legally separate and have nothing to do with each other. The sad reality is that the school boards in the Young years did a better job managing finances and schools that the state has done over the last 15 years basically under the district. At least then they balanced budgets in some years and attracted students filling nearly 300 schools. Today under state control - as its been for over a decade - its the opposite with deficits and closing buildings and a shrinking district.
    __________________________________________________ _
    There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old's life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs.... John Rogers

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    re: Judge rules Detroit bankruptcy filing UNCONSTITUTIONAL[W:584]

    For those who want to place blame on others - look at the year 1969 and the mayoral race for your answers.

    That was the last major election in Detroit where white voters still represented the majority who turned out on election day. The terrible 67 riots were close in the rear view mirror and white families were leaving in droves. Two very fine men ended up in the general election - Roman Gribbs and Richard H. Austin. Basically almost all the whites voted for Gribbs because he was white while blacks did the same for Austin. Gribbs won and ended up without much public support as his voters continued to leave and proved ineffective.

    Austin was a CPA and a whiz with numbers. He was professional through and through and had the complete opposite personality of the combative and abrasive Coleman Young. He was a gentleman and a unifier who did not pander to racial agendas knowing they were divisive.

    While Austin lost, he then ran for Michigan Secretary of State - a position he won and held for the next 24 years doing an excellent job reforming a terrible state department which had been neglected for decades. You will find few in Michigan who do not praise Richard Austin for his excellent work.

    The sad reality is that had more whites voted for Austin that year, the history of Detroit may be very very different. He would have brought his professional expertise to the mayors office and the rcial divisiveness of the Young administration may never have happened with a long Austin tenure in city hall. It truly could have been a historic WHAT IF moment for the city.
    Last edited by haymarket; 07-25-13 at 07:48 AM.
    __________________________________________________ _
    There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old's life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs.... John Rogers

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    re: Judge rules Detroit bankruptcy filing UNCONSTITUTIONAL[W:584]

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    YOu confuse me with somebody who cares about the opinion of somebody on the far right fringe of extremism.
    Wouldn't you say that about anyone who still supports and defends the Constitution?

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    re: Judge rules Detroit bankruptcy filing UNCONSTITUTIONAL[W:584]

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    Earlier in this thread I provided a great amount of verifiable evidence showing that while the TAX RATE in Detroit is high the actual tax paid is rather low because the homes are valued at such low levels compared to the suburbs around it. Because of that reality, Detroiters who do move to the suburbs as you suggest - voting with their feet - are almost always voting themselves a TAX INCREASE in doing so. One can get a three bedroom home in Detroit for under $10,000.00. There are some available for as little as $2,500.00 and that is an intact home. Just cross the line into Dearborn or Southfield and you will expect to many many times that for the same size home. Because you are now paying five to ten times as much for the home, even if your tax rate is half of that in the city, you still end up paying a great deal more in taxes due to the home value differences.

    You are right that people did vote with their feet by leaving Detroit. However, it had precious little to do with liberalism or taxation since they normally moved to Wayne County suburbs where the people in charge were also Democrats and the taxes ended up even more than they were paying.
    Do you believe it is a single tax rate or a single regulation or a single rule that drives business away and the people as well? I left California because I could see how dangerous it was to succeed there.

    I know that you will go out of your way to find anything you can claim as evidence. It is in your nature to excuse all of the Left's excesses.

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    re: Judge rules Detroit bankruptcy filing UNCONSTITUTIONAL[W:584]

    Quote Originally Posted by Green Balls View Post
    The fact of the matter is Coleman Young allowed Detroit's government to become corrupted during his 30+ years in office. The city council started funneling money to the point where it seemed to magically disappear. The police department became corrupt. The school board became corrupt. It isn't a coincidence that all this happened while he was in office. Yes, it became worse after he was out, but it all started with him. He only managed to stay in office that long because he had cronies that would target most of the poor people by telling them their houses would be torn down if they didn't vote for him.
    Isn't it really George Bush's fault?

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    re: Judge rules Detroit bankruptcy filing UNCONSTITUTIONAL[W:584]

    Quote Originally Posted by Misterveritis View Post
    Wouldn't you say that about anyone who still supports and defends the Constitution?
    As I strongly do support and defend the Constitution that is a silly thing to say to me.
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    re: Judge rules Detroit bankruptcy filing UNCONSTITUTIONAL[W:584]

    Quote Originally Posted by Misterveritis View Post
    Do you believe it is a single tax rate or a single regulation or a single rule that drives business away and the people as well? I left California because I could see how dangerous it was to succeed there.

    I know that you will go out of your way to find anything you can claim as evidence. It is in your nature to excuse all of the Left's excesses.
    I guess that would depend on the individual case. For example, for some people having their job relocated may be the reason.

    I would suspect that for many others it is a combination of things which motivate them to relocate.

    I must say that I am a bit taken aback at your snide remark attacking me for looking for and finding evidence. I have never come across anyone in debate who views evidence as a negative to be criticized. Far too many people on these forums ignore it altogether instead opting for their own beliefs or pompous pontifications insted of verifiable evidence. Perhaps your contempt is part of that trend?
    __________________________________________________ _
    There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old's life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs.... John Rogers

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    re: Judge rules Detroit bankruptcy filing UNCONSTITUTIONAL[W:584]

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    And after admitting that - it shows that even you have owned up to your admiration of and support for intellectual fraud. In all my years I have never seen anybody say that context is not important.

    But congratulations on admitting what you are really doing here. At least now its out in the open for all to see.
    More dishonesty on your part. I said that in this case we are discussing that "the context doesn't really matter" because you tried to blame another poster for not using context. He nailed it.. You've changed that to "In all my years I have never seen anybody say that context is not important", which any fair minded person can see is not what I said at all.

    Your entire post was ridiculous and I countered those miserable little excuses you made for the half century of liberal corruption in Detroit. Of curse you zeroed in on that one minor part so you could hope to ignore the rest. This you did, but only because you lack the balls to respond to the remainder.

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