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Thread: Judge rules Detroit bankruptcy filing UNCONSTITUTIONAL[W:584]

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    re: Judge rules Detroit bankruptcy filing UNCONSTITUTIONAL[W:584]

    Quote Originally Posted by justabubba View Post
    really? you were asking a question and not making a statement?

    it is a fabulous thing. its a constitutional provision to assure that those who have earned a pension can expect to receive it. ALL of it
    it says pensioners have a right to the pension income they have earned by their labors
    So a constitution should place obligations on the people and not just the government? Is that what you're saying?

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    re: Judge rules Detroit bankruptcy filing UNCONSTITUTIONAL[W:584]

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    Detroit began its slide under two consecutive Republican mayors from 1950 through 1961. During that time, under Cobo and Mariani, Detroit lost 10% of its population. That was the beginning of the end of a trend that is still in effect today.

    But to blame this on a party is silly as no mayor is responsible for the two huge factors that killed Detroit:

    1 - economic desertion of the city causing it to be abandoned by business and the middle class
    2 - deeply ingrained racial problems

    It was those two things which have taken Detroit from 1.8 million down to just over 700,000. And that is not the fault of a Republican or Democratic mayor.
    Perhaps this brand of socialism, like every other brand, was just not done by the right people. If only they had a little more power to make the lives of their citizens miserable. If only there had been a wall to keep the city's victims from escaping the tyranny.

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    re: Judge rules Detroit bankruptcy filing UNCONSTITUTIONAL[W:584]

    Quote Originally Posted by Misterveritis View Post
    Perhaps this brand of socialism, like every other brand, was just not done by the right people. If only they had a little more power to make the lives of their citizens miserable. If only there had been a wall to keep the city's victims from escaping the tyranny.
    well, if you listen to Melissa Harry-Perris... small government caused Detriot's collapse ..so you may be on to something

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    re: Judge rules Detroit bankruptcy filing UNCONSTITUTIONAL[W:584]

    For those who are interested in gaining some insight into Detroit's fiscal problems, here's a good report:

    http://www.crcmich.org/PUBLICAT/2010s/2010/rpt361.pdf

    It should be noted that the situation has broadly and significantly deteriorated since that report was issued. Nevertheless, the report provides some basis for understanding the magnitude of challenges confronting Detroit.

    Notice, for example, on Table 3, just 10.9% of Detroit's population have attained a bachelor's degree or higher vs. 27.7% for the nation as a whole. That's a colossal gap. The unemployment rate in Detroit was running at just over 24% (p.2) at the time of the report. In other words, Detroit was suffering from Great Depression-type conditions. If one also examines the monthly employment situation reports published by the Bureau of Labor Statistics, one finds unemployment is inversely related to educational attainment. Hence, not only was Detroit suffering from Great Depression-type conditions, a substantial share of its extreme incidence of unemployment is structural, not cyclical in nature. That means no quick reductions are likely anytime soon.

    Today, the city is largely a desert when it comes to business formation and economic activity. It finds itself in that situation on account of, among other things, chronic disinvestment in education (city and state finances) that resulted in a labor pool that was increasingly unattractive to business. With the global economy growing more competitive, the premium on knowledge increasing in the information era, and reduced trade barriers creating ever higher costs associated with a lack of competitiveness, businesses looked elsewhere. Lack of economic opportunity is but one factor among a complex web of overlapping factors (i.e., rising crime, racial divisions, etc.) that have driven Detroit into crisis.

    As the city's long-term structural situation deteriorated, both Michigan's and Detroit's political leaders were less responsive than they should have been given the gradual nature of the decay. They were far more bystanders than change agents.

    Some on talk radio today cast the crisis as one of political ideology. Yet, if those hosts were right, then the GOP would have passed a balanced budget as affirmed by CBO, on repeated occasions, would have seamlessly addressed such social challenges as the immigration issue, and provided a coherent alternative health reform package that would have dramatically reduced uninsurance and slowed the rise of health costs, etc. That hasn't happened.

    Moreover, Michigan has seen both Republican and Democratic governors, none of whom took a decisive approach to head off the crisis toward which Detroit was headed. Action occurred when it was universally evident that Detroit was on the brink of fiscal catastrophe, long after easy remedies were no longer available. In other words, as often happens in any organization, there was lack of comprehension of the gravity of the changing structural environment confronting Detroit, leading to more of a bias toward the status quo in policy making both at the State and City level than bold reform.

    Going back to the point about Detroit's educational attainment problem, there was no major infusion of investment in Detroit's educational system to address what was becoming a severe gap in educational attainment. In part, that gap is the result of better educated residents departing for better opportunities and other socioeconomic reasons (depletion of human capital). In part, it is the result of grossly underperforming schools (failure to regenerate human capital).

    Given these, among other complex socioeconomic issues, stabilizing Detroit's finances via bankruptcy will likely be one of the city's easier challenges. Putting the city on a sustainable path of growth, which depends on rebuilding human capital could be more difficult.

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    re: Judge rules Detroit bankruptcy filing UNCONSTITUTIONAL[W:584]

    Present day Detroit is a shining example of what 60 years of corrupt Liberal policies will bring you. Yet being right there for the naked eye to see, like the charge of the light brigade these fools (not just in Detroit) will probably double down on socialism with the excuse that if they'd had 70% of your income instead of 50 that things would have been different. Its time for normal people to come to there senses & relegate this radical statist idealogy to the dustbin of history in the next election cycle.

    A long term commitment back to the constitution is the only way to turn the mess around on a national level.
    Last edited by Iron Yank; 07-22-13 at 11:39 PM.

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    re: Judge rules Detroit bankruptcy filing UNCONSTITUTIONAL[W:584]

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Fabulous View Post
    Of course the problem is economic! Find me a bankruptcy that isn't. As far as racism... meh. Racism doesn't cause economic meltdowns like this. Corruption, mismanagement, and poor planning does.
    Lets compare your posts and mine.

    earlier in the day I was challenged by another poster to supply evidence for the claim that race played a major role in Detorits downfall. I supplied at least a half dozen sources to document this including several award winning books on the subject.

    What do you do in your post? Attack me for one. Failing to provide any evidence that it was corruption that was the major factor in Detroit declaring bankruptcy is the second. But its not too late. Lets see the objective verifiable evidence to support your claim that

    Racism doesn't cause economic meltdowns like this. Corruption, mismanagement, and poor planning does.
    So step up and show us.

    As for your sensitivity about democrats - do you really think this is about you? This thread has been filled with people vilifying democrats which ignoring republicans. Got it?

    I told you this in post 401 when you did not want to hear about the two main causes of Detroits problems

    By all means, find me an expert who agrees that the problem is not principally economic and racial.
    You have been woefully impotent to present that expert. Why is that?
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    re: Judge rules Detroit bankruptcy filing UNCONSTITUTIONAL[W:584]

    Quote Originally Posted by Iron Yank View Post
    A long term commitment back to the constitution is the only way to turn the mess around on a national level.
    Detroit's fiscal catastrophe has nothing to do with the U.S. constitution.

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    re: Judge rules Detroit bankruptcy filing UNCONSTITUTIONAL[W:584]

    Quote Originally Posted by donsutherland1 View Post
    Detroit's fiscal catastrophe has nothing to do with the U.S. constitution.
    I'm sorry but 60 years of Liberal socialist mayors along with organized Labor aka the mob, running the show..... you cant possibly be claiming these people were following the letter of the constitution? lol

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    re: Judge rules Detroit bankruptcy filing UNCONSTITUTIONAL[W:584]

    Quote Originally Posted by Iron Yank View Post
    I'm sorry but 60 years of Liberal socialist mayors along with organized Labor aka the mob, running the show..... you cant possibly be claiming these people were following the letter of the constitution? lol
    I'm not saying that there hasn't been corruption. Indeed, corruption is being investigated with regard to some of the pension funds.

    Detroit emergency manager launches pension corruption probe | Reuters

    My point is that this fiscal crisis is much more than a matter of corruption. Corruption exacerbated Detroit's challenges, but the challenges had their roots beyond corruption e.g., dramatic population decline, particularly better educated persons.

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    re: Judge rules Detroit bankruptcy filing UNCONSTITUTIONAL[W:584]

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    Lets compare your posts and mine.

    earlier in the day I was challenged by another poster to supply evidence for the claim that race played a major role in Detorits downfall. I supplied at least a half dozen sources to document this including several award winning books on the subject.

    What do you do in your post? Attack me for one. Failing to provide any evidence that it was corruption that was the major factor in Detroit declaring bankruptcy is the second. But its not too late. Lets see the objective verifiable evidence to support your claim that



    So step up and show us.

    As for your sensitivity about democrats - do you really think this is about you? This thread has been filled with people vilifying democrats which ignoring republicans. Got it?

    I told you this in post 401 when you did not want to hear about the two main causes of Detroits problems



    You have been woefully impotent to present that expert. Why is that?
    Coming soon to a city near you. Detroit in RUINS! (Crowder goes Ghetto) - YouTube

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