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Thread: Armed man arrested near White House wanted ‘fire a couple of shots,’ police say

  1. #91
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    Re: Armed man arrested near White House wanted ‘fire a couple of shots,’ police say

    Quote Originally Posted by ttwtt78640 View Post
    The biggest change is by eliminating suicides (about 50% of all US gun deaths) and justified shootings (zapping criminals), accidental gun fatalities were only 951 nationwide in 2011.

    http://www.cdc.gov/nchs/data/nvsr/nvsr61/nvsr61_06.pdf
    Interesting you are so dismissive at the avoidable tragedy of a child killing another child due to lax firearm laws, it isn't a big number so why bother with it...

    Oh I fully understand your pruning down the deaths to just one on another murder, but what you are ignoring is the the fallacy of 'an armed society is a polite one'. The difference between highly restricted states and give everyone a 'gun' states is .02 per 100,000. (and quite frankly the variance between each year can shift that back and forth)

    The argument isn't less 'guns' means less murders- that is the strawman you are attempting to deflect the discussion with- no Sir the argument is less 'guns' means less deaths.

    Arming everyone or making the poor citizen 'helpless' with no firearms doesn't seem to make much of a difference between Texas or Illinois in criminal activity- gangs will fight over turf and drugs, but lax 'gun' regulations do seem to promote more 'gun' related deaths.

    FYI I think it is a bit dishonest to exclude suicide- it is still killing someone who isn't harming anyone else and against the law.

  2. #92
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    Re: Armed man arrested near White House wanted ‘fire a couple of shots,’ police say

    Quote Originally Posted by sangha View Post
    I've seen no evidence about rural areas having higher rates of gun ownership than urban ones. The evidence suggests otherwise.

    However, I'm glad to see you reject the nonsensical "more guns = less crime" myth
    He said "It is clear that a higher percentage of folks are armed in the rural area where I live than in a nearby city like Austin"

    He was talking about where he lived...not in general.
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    Re: Armed man arrested near White House wanted ‘fire a couple of shots,’ police say

    Quote Originally Posted by sangha View Post
    I've seen no evidence about rural areas having higher rates of gun ownership than urban ones. The evidence suggests otherwise.

    However, I'm glad to see you reject the nonsensical "more guns = less crime" myth
    I can assure you that most of my immediate neighbors have guns (all but 2 of 14 on my road).

    https://blogs.commons.georgetown.edu...ted-States.pdf

    In gun debate, it's urban vs. rural
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    Therefore all progress depends on the unreasonable man.” ― George Bernard Shaw, Man and Superman

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    Re: Armed man arrested near White House wanted ‘fire a couple of shots,’ police say

    Quote Originally Posted by rcart76 View Post
    Disagree with you on that one buddy
    Of course you do.
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    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

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    Re: Armed man arrested near White House wanted ‘fire a couple of shots,’ police say

    Quote Originally Posted by sangha View Post
    Why eliminate suicides by gun? Are they not violent enough for you?
    Because one is done willingly. The other is not. One is illegal. The other is not. The only reason those that are anti-gun use suicide is to make the problem seem bigger than it actually is.

    The whole arguement of the anti-gun side is about criminals using guns to harm other people. That arguement by itself is a legitimate arguement. But as everyone knows the degree matters alot when it comes to the Rights outlined in the BoR. Which is why they want to use suicide statistics also because it beefs up the numbers and makes it seem more severe than it really is. Those that commit suicide are not harming anyone but themselves. They are not breaking any laws. Those two things right there takes them out of the equation for any legitimate claim to limit peoples 2nd Amendment Right.
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    Re: Armed man arrested near White House wanted ‘fire a couple of shots,’ police say

    Quote Originally Posted by notquiteright View Post
    FYI I think it is a bit dishonest to exclude suicide- it is still killing someone who isn't harming anyone else and against the law.
    1: It is killing yourself and not harming anyone else. Not "killing someone". BIG difference.

    2: There are no laws against suicide so no, it is not against the law.
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    Re: Armed man arrested near White House wanted ‘fire a couple of shots,’ police say

    Quote Originally Posted by notquiteright View Post
    Interesting you are so dismissive at the avoidable tragedy of a child killing another child due to lax firearm laws, it isn't a big number so why bother with it...

    Oh I fully understand your pruning down the deaths to just one on another murder, but what you are ignoring is the the fallacy of 'an armed society is a polite one'. The difference between highly restricted states and give everyone a 'gun' states is .02 per 100,000. (and quite frankly the variance between each year can shift that back and forth)

    The argument isn't less 'guns' means less murders- that is the strawman you are attempting to deflect the discussion with- no Sir the argument is less 'guns' means less deaths.

    Arming everyone or making the poor citizen 'helpless' with no firearms doesn't seem to make much of a difference between Texas or Illinois in criminal activity- gangs will fight over turf and drugs, but lax 'gun' regulations do seem to promote more 'gun' related deaths.

    FYI I think it is a bit dishonest to exclude suicide- it is still killing someone who isn't harming anyone else and against the law.
    Suicide is a self preventing crime as it has a ZERO recidivism rate and perp = victim in every case. I am not at all opposed to holding those criminally responsible for gun "accidents" if gross negligence can be proven, thus they would count as criminal gun deaths and not accidents.

    It is silly to assert that criminal gangs would be deterred by gun bans, as these gangs make most of their money dealing in illegal drugs (also banned nationwide). Mexico has very strict gun and drug laws, yet has plenty of both. The police state required to enforce any ban is well beyond that which the public would be willing to tolerate, thus the failure of nearly all national attempts at "gun control".

    The war on drugs "succeeds" only in briefly locking up morons (at high cost) that are either simply users or low level "dealers" in the supply chain. As long as there is demand, and huge profits to be made, the supply/distribution of recreational drugs will continue, so gangs will survive and maintain power primarily using that drug money.
    “The reasonable man adapts himself to the world: the unreasonable one persists to adapt the world to himself.
    Therefore all progress depends on the unreasonable man.” ― George Bernard Shaw, Man and Superman

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    Re: Armed man arrested near White House wanted ‘fire a couple of shots,’ police say

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    Of course you do.
    I think I would know considering I live in Texas. Oh and by the way, the a**holes out here comes in all colors.

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    Re: Armed man arrested near White House wanted ‘fire a couple of shots,’ police say

    Quote Originally Posted by Kal'Stang View Post
    Was he in a gun free zone? If so then why isn't he charged with that also? Since he wasn't then we can only assume that he was not in a gun free zone. And the sensitive place would be if he had been on the white house grounds. Which he wasn't.

    I do admit that the first part..the..."It is not a right to keep and carry any weapon whatsoever in any manner whatsoever and for whatever purpose" might apply. But then it is so open ended as to be meaningless because one could argue that it would apply in this situation and could argue that it wouldn't apply and both assertions would be correct. As such its worthless.
    The quote I posted did not say that the govt can only limit the possession of guns in a GFZ. I don't know why you keep bringing that up.

    I don't think it's unreasonable to consider the area around the White House to be a "sensitive" location.

    I'd also like to point out that before he pulled the weapon out of his backpack, it was being concealed.
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    Re: Armed man arrested near White House wanted ‘fire a couple of shots,’ police say

    Quote Originally Posted by Kal'Stang View Post
    1: It is killing yourself and not harming anyone else. Not "killing someone". BIG difference.

    2: There are no laws against suicide so no, it is not against the law.
    You are correct there is no law against suicide, my bad. however it is still killing someone who is no threat or danger to any other person- the standard for justifiable killing. I see suicide by firearm as a firearm death that wasn't in self defense or defense of others.

    As I pointed out to TWTT the statistical difference between a lax regulation state and a much higher restriction one is .02 per 100,000 even by reducing the deaths to just murder, and that teeny tiny difference can come and go as the economies and drug gangs ebb and flow.

    Now since the reality is firearms cause all manner of deaths past murder including those victims in the discussion as the cemetery includes the bodies of those victims as well....

    Just seems to make sense... oh FYI I own several firearms- no big collection but like I used to tell students I don't need a lot of hammers to build a house...

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