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Thread: Jimmy Carter: ‘America no longer has a functioning democracy’

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    Re: Jimmy Carter: ‘America no longer has a functioning democracy’

    Quote Originally Posted by TheNextEra View Post
    You need to stop watching T.V. and movies. Yes, there are intelligent people in the NSA, but they are managed by regular people as well, not super nerd geniouses. A neighbor of mine when I was in North Carolina got picked as a Manager and he was no super nerd.

    So you might want to step back and not believe every movie you see on T.V.
    Information presented above not derived from television (as I do not get American TV, living abroad as I do), but rather from direct interaction with the relevant agencies discussed, and interaction with other members of the Intelligence Community, admittedly heavily weighted in favor of the DIA. I've worked with analysts from DHS. Not impressed. I've worked with analysts working with NSA. Not so much a different ballgame as a different league.

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    Re: Jimmy Carter: ‘America no longer has a functioning democracy’

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    Information presented above not derived from television (as I do not get American TV, living abroad as I do), but rather from direct interaction with the relevant agencies discussed, and interaction with other members of the Intelligence Community, admittedly heavily weighted in favor of the DIA.
    It's obviously from movies that you get your information from becuase the NSA is not filled with only super geniouses. Your erroneous sensationalism of the NSA is noted and ignored.

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    Re: Jimmy Carter: ‘America no longer has a functioning democracy’

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    Fair enough.


    To bring it back to the OP, I think he is trying to claim that the unrestricted communications of Facebook etc. are enablers of Democracy, and that the NSA program limits the effectiveness of those enablers.

    Two points about how very wrong he was:

    1. Information derived from programs of the kind he is referring to are not exactly shared with the likes of Egyptian police. They are - you know - sort of "secret".
    2. Facebook et. al. do not enable democracy. They enable group action. There is an important difference between "representative government" and "a mob".
    I think you are reading it and interpreting it right.
    We went from sticks and stones may break my bones but words will never hurt me to safe spaces.

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    Re: Jimmy Carter: ‘America no longer has a functioning democracy’

    Quote Originally Posted by TheNextEra View Post
    It's obviously from movies that you get your information from becuase the NSA is not filled with only super geniouses. Your erroneous sensationalism of the NSA is noted and ignored.
    whatever. You cannot convince those who are not open to the possibility of new information. Obviously the NSA is not 100% super geniuses nor did I ever make that claim. But there is definitely a qualitative difference between their product, and that of DHS.

    But hey, you had a neighbor once who had a clearance. Obviously you have vast personal experience in the IC. Please, tell me more.

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    Re: Jimmy Carter: ‘America no longer has a functioning democracy’

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    whatever. You cannot convince those who are not open to the possibility of new information. Hey, you had a neighbor once. Obviously you have vast personal experience in the IC.
    I'm not the one claimiung they are all filled with super nerds, you are. Obviously you think YOU have VAST knowledge on the matter. But continue to elevate the NSA to the point of godhood in your mind. It is quite amusing.

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    Re: Jimmy Carter: ‘America no longer has a functioning democracy’

    So, the man who hobnobs with Hamas and claims they are not corrupt is now saying the U.S. is no longer a functioning democracy?

    It appears that he is at least a tiny bit shaky on the concept.
    "you're better off on Stormfront discussing how evil brown men are taking innocent white flowers." Infinite Chaos

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    Re: Jimmy Carter: ‘America no longer has a functioning democracy’

    Quote Originally Posted by TheNextEra View Post
    I'm not the one claimiung they are all filled with super nerds, you are. Obviously you think YOU have VAST knowledge on the matter
    No. I have low-to-intermediate knowledge of this matter.

    But continue to elevate the NSA to the point of godhood in your mind. It is quite amusing.
    not at all. I simply elevate it above the DHS. In a similar fashion, I "elevate" Navy SEALs above your standard JROTC unit when it comes to combat efficiency.

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    Re: Jimmy Carter: ‘America no longer has a functioning democracy’

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    No. I have intermediate knowledge of this matter.
    No, you don't. That much is clear.

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    not at all. I simply elevate it above the DHS. In a similar fashion, I "elevate" Navy SEALs above your standard JROTC unit when it comes to combat efficiency.
    ALL government agencies are run by careeer management, including the NSA and they are mismanaging funds. To claim otherwise is denying reality and ignore the debt.

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    Re: Jimmy Carter: ‘America no longer has a functioning democracy’

    Quote Originally Posted by TheNextEra View Post
    No, you don't. That much is clear.
    Full disclosure: modified to point out it is low-to-intermediate. I have a little under a decade of experience in and around the IC. How much do you have? As I recall thus far your evidence depends upon your personal assessment of a neighbor you had once.

    ALL government agencies are run by careeer management, including the NSA and they are mismanaging funds. To claim otherwise is denying reality and ignore the debt.
    No one has claimed there isn't fiscal waste at NSA. There is. Which in no way means that there is not a qualitative difference between the NSA's ability to effectively conduct Computer Network Defense / Exploitation v the DHS's. You give the NSA's tools to the DHS, and you are handing a .50 cal to the kid who did really good in the bb-gun competition.

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    Re: Jimmy Carter: ‘America no longer has a functioning democracy’

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    Full disclosure: modified to point out it is low-to-intermediate. I have a little under a decade of experience in and around the IC. How much do you have? As I recall thus far your evidence depends upon your personal assessment of a neighbor you had once.
    I held a TS/SCI clearance for over 15 years. I Worked in my career while inthe military in SIGINT and MASINT. I saw some of those "geniouses" you seem to think work there. Are some of them really really good? Yes. Others are not. I don't elevate ANY agency to godhood as you claim because the management is what matters. The management is lacking in both the NSA and DHS.

    What I did see is mismanagment of funds, fraud waste and abuse, which I reported several times to my superiors. The NSA managment is just as corrupt as any other agency. So when you say the NSA is run by professionals and DHS is not, you are incorrect.

    You were talking about who was RUNNING the agencies.

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