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Thread: Federal judge temporarily blocks new Wisconsin abortion law..................[W:44]

  1. #101
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    Re: Federal judge temporarily blocks new Wisconsin abortion law..................[W:4

    Quote Originally Posted by Zyphlin View Post
    And you suppor tthem? And do you support them based on the same standard
    YOU just put forth, which is that any form of limitation is okay as long as it comes short of stopping it from being possible?



    Absolutely.

    And I think you should be able to do the first one on private property, though believe it's within the states power to restrict it's access on public roads.

    The RPG's issue is it falls into a grey area for me as I see the 2nd in terms of the notion of small arms, such as what an individual within a militia would own, rather than "artillery" such as canons and other such objects whose primary purposes is clearly for interstate warfare than personal defense. Still, if some private range wanted to offer up that experience I don't have a huge issue with it.

    I'm also hardly a fan of the outright ban on owning a fully automatic weapon.

    None of those things are actual good analogs however.

    What you're suggesting is that the government should be able to force an individual to have to purchase and/or undertake an unnecessary private service for no legitimate government purpose NOR for any legitimate purpose relating to the original service being rendered.

    So it would be akin to making individuals undertake a class where for an hour they're sat in a dark room and shown horrific images of gunshot wound victims while sounds of gunfire and screaming are occuring prior to being able to purchase any firearm...all for the purpose of making people really "think" about what they're purchasing.
    It wasn't my analog...LOL.

    It was by some distinct poster, an attempt to justify abortion with out limits using the second amendment as an analogy.

    I'm not a fan of justifications by arbitrary comparisons as I think most possess the cognizant lattitude to consider the distinctions between 2 seperate issues no matter their Constitutional derivations.

    Do you have a Morgan Gun ? Cause I have a 1983 F150 that needs to be put out of it's misery and I can't think of a better way to do that than turning it into swiss cheese on fire.

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    Re: Federal judge temporarily blocks new Wisconsin abortion law..................[W:4

    Quote Originally Posted by Samhain View Post
    Have you had a transvaginal ultrasound before?
    No, have you? I don't have to have experienced having a foreign object forced into my vagina against my will to understand the concept of rape.

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    Re: Federal judge temporarily blocks new Wisconsin abortion law..................[W:4

    Quote Originally Posted by Fenton View Post
    Without getting too graphic a ABORTION is a very INVASIVE procedure.

    I can't believe the whole " forcible rape " narrative has gotten this much traction considering the steps of the average Abortion.
    Abortion is a woman's choice. Being raped by a probe against her will is not. I'm surprised you don't understand the difference.

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    Re: Federal judge temporarily blocks new Wisconsin abortion law..................[W:4

    Quote Originally Posted by DiAnna View Post
    Abortion is a woman's choice. Being raped by a probe against her will is not. I'm surprised you don't understand the difference.
    how anybody could miss this fact and not see the different between them is beyond me.
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    Re: Federal judge temporarily blocks new Wisconsin abortion law..................[W:4

    Quote Originally Posted by danarhea View Post
    Federal judge temporarily blocks new Wisconsin abortion law on hospital admitting privileges


    This is pending a full hearing on July 17th, in which the new Wisconsin law is expected to be ruled unconstitutional. In granting the injunction, the judge plainly stated that the State is not going to be able to show the constitutionality of the new law.

    Looks like women in Wisconsin have just gotten their vaginas back. Expect the courts to also intervene here in Texas if the same kind of law is passed. Want to ride roughshod over women? Go ahead. You will just waste taxpayer dollars in the process, only to have it smacked down in the courts. Good luck with that.

    Article is here.
    glad the bill was temporarily blocked

    like bills similar to it, if it gets challenged in court it will go down.
    There no reason for it and its nonsensical and has no logic behind it. Its just trying to infringe on rights, freedoms and use the backdoor to restrict aboriton
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    Re: Federal judge temporarily blocks new Wisconsin abortion law..................[W:4

    Quote Originally Posted by Deuce View Post
    The fact that complications exist doesn't mean that the hospital admitting privileges are medically necessary. The nature and severity of the complications, and how much of that information needs to be briefed in detail to the hospital, are what really determines whether this is necessary. To take the extreme example, why not require all abortions to be performed at a hospital with an ER? There could be complications! Hey, there could be complications during an eye exam, so let's do the same with every eye exam... unnecessary, right?

    I've never heard a doctor express that they believe this is a useful precaution. And let's face it, safety of the woman is not the reason Wisconsin Republicans are pushing this bill.
    I don't care about your anecdotal experience. You're the one claiming exclusive knowledge to start with. There could be complications with an eye exam, but that hardly compares to surgery - a fact every physician will tell you is serious business. Besides, this is invasive surgery, to say the least, no matter how much you seek to minimize it or characterize it as something less than what it is. Again, it's only serious if it happens to you, and the effort to make this removing a spec from one's eye is completely unconvincing. If you're not in favor of those offering surgical services offering a safe means of dealing with complications you should just say so.

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    Re: Federal judge temporarily blocks new Wisconsin abortion law..................[W:4

    Quote Originally Posted by humbolt View Post
    I don't care about your anecdotal experience. You're the one claiming exclusive knowledge to start with. There could be complications with an eye exam, but that hardly compares to surgery - a fact every physician will tell you is serious business. Besides, this is invasive surgery, to say the least, no matter how much you seek to minimize it or characterize it as something less than what it is. Again, it's only serious if it happens to you, and the effort to make this removing a spec from one's eye is completely unconvincing. If you're not in favor of those offering surgical services offering a safe means of dealing with complications you should just say so.
    its already safe, thats why the medical industry has the standards they do, the people that are educated in this area havent made these BS requirements needed
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    Re: Federal judge temporarily blocks new Wisconsin abortion law..................[W:4

    Quote Originally Posted by Zyphlin View Post
    And yet you parrot the same type of mentality and arguments as the anti-second amendment crowd. How wonderfully hypocritical. So you just support Big Government, intrusion upon individuals rights, and the expansion of the state when it suits your personal emotional feelings. Great to know.
    Interesting that you can't separate one distinctive event from another totally separate event.


    All well and good, and I'd have zero issue if a place decided to CHOOSE to make this their own practice when dealing with abortions.

    But unlike you, I'm not going to empower the government to get further involved into the exchange of PRIVATE services and further into the decision making process of medical procedures all in the name of what "feels good".[/QUOTE]I never said that. You're jumping to conclusions that the statement didn't warrant. I never said we should empower government do such a thing. They already have that power, unless you missed the PPACA decision. I simply said that the failure of an agency of the government, and Planned Parenthood is just that without the official connotation, should be corrected by other means when necessary. I don't like the necessity, but the federal government itself feels no need to offer the obvious (as we are seeing with PPACA), so I leave it to the states to fill in the vacuum. That some may construe that as an attack on abortion rights is just to freaking bad. They see every statement which doesn't offer unmitigated support of their position as an attack.

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    Re: Federal judge temporarily blocks new Wisconsin abortion law..................[W:4

    Quote Originally Posted by AGENT J View Post
    its already safe, thats why the medical industry has the standards they do, the people that are educated in this area havent made these BS requirements needed
    It's interesting then, that the very same argument that the effectiveness of contraception is used as a justification for abortion. I don't dispute that. When, on the other hand, virtually the same rate of complication is used as an argument that additional medical support may be required based on that number, it's suddenly insignificant. Let me be specific. Depending on the numbers you subscribe to, a roughly 5 or 6% rate of abortion complication is recorded. This is roughly comparable to the numbers of contraceptive failure. If you claim that abortions are justified based on the ineffectiveness of contraception, then I can easily claim that hospital admission should be required to address the complications arising from abortions. You don't get to have it both ways. Based on the numbers.

  10. #110
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    Re: Federal judge temporarily blocks new Wisconsin abortion law..................[W:4

    Quote Originally Posted by humbolt View Post
    It's interesting then, that the very same argument that the effectiveness of contraception is used as a justification for abortion. I don't dispute that. When, on the other hand, virtually the same rate of complication is used as an argument that additional medical support may be required based on that number, it's suddenly insignificant. Let me be specific. Depending on the numbers you subscribe to, a roughly 5 or 6% rate of abortion complication is recorded. This is roughly comparable to the numbers of contraceptive failure. If you claim that abortions are justified based on the ineffectiveness of contraception, then I can easily claim that hospital admission should be required to address the complications arising from abortions. You don't get to have it both ways. Based on the numbers.
    I think you are missing a critical detail. In order to get admitting privileges, a place has to utilize the hospital at least so many times a year. Apparently most clinics don't meet that criteria because they don't have a high enough number of screw ups. So to meet the criteria they would have to lower their rate of safe, uncomplicated abortions, and raise the number requiring hospitalization. Now what f'ing gov't has the right to invade my privacy, make me pay for unnecessary ultrasounds, and then tell my provider that he/she has to lower his/her success rate???? I mean really, puullleeeeazeee.
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