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Thread: U.S. Adds 195,000 Jobs; Unemployment Remains 7.6%

  1. #161
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    Re: U.S. Adds 195,000 Jobs; Unemployment Remains 7.6%

    Quote Originally Posted by Gimmesometruth View Post
    Helix posted a quote and a link I doubt either one of you read since the bottom line in the article is that nearly all observers are saying the same thing, now is not the time for pulling back on QE if you are concerned about INCREASING employment.

    When you predicate your argument on the straw man that I or anyone else suggested QE should be or will be "permanent", you just prove what I said previously, you just can't help but to engage in dishonest debate.
    Unlike you I understand what QE does and doesn't do. It doesn't offset the effects of higher taxes, Obamacare, more regulations. QE is short term stimulus whereas tax policies, regulations, and Obamacare affect long term business planning and job creation, something that intellectually dishonest liberals who are pro big govt. individuals don't understand. When people like you predicate your argument based upon more govt. spending that just shows how little you understand about personal investment and risk taking

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    Re: U.S. Adds 195,000 Jobs; Unemployment Remains 7.6%

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post
    Unlike you I understand what QE does and doesn't do. It doesn't offset the effects of higher taxes, Obamacare, more regulations. QE is short term stimulus whereas tax policies, regulations, and Obamacare affect long term business planning and job creation, something that intellectually dishonest liberals who are pro big govt. individuals don't understand. When people like you predicate your argument based upon more govt. spending that just shows how little you understand about personal investment and risk taking
    Duh, and the current issue is using all available tools IN THE SHORT TERM to revive employment/demand, not just monetary policy.

    You were correct earlier, partisanship blocking the use of fiscal policy in conjunction with monetary policy is limiting our recovery from the aftermath of the Bush Recession.
    Quote Originally Posted by trouble13 View Post
    If you wanna know why Trumpsters are ignoring you its for the same reason you ignored the KKKs complaints about Obama.
    Quote Originally Posted by Moderate Right View Post
    When it comes down to it, all facts are cherry picked.
    Quote Originally Posted by Bodhisattva View Post
    He didn't say it didn't make sense. He said it is complete nonsense.

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    Re: U.S. Adds 195,000 Jobs; Unemployment Remains 7.6%

    Quote Originally Posted by Gimmesometruth View Post
    Duh, and the current issue is using all available tools IN THE SHORT TERM to revive employment/demand, not just monetary policy.

    You were correct earlier, partisanship blocking the use of fiscal policy in conjunction with monetary policy is limiting our recovery from the aftermath of the Bush Recession.
    And what fiscal policy would that be, driving small businesses out of business with higher taxes, Obamacare, and regulations? The aftermath of the Bush recession? we are over four years since the end of the recession, four years. What part of that do you not understand?

    Keep ignoring the truth, QE will not offset the costs to small businesses of Obamacare, higher taxes, and more regulations? All the easy money in the world will not pay the monthly expenses of a small business.

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    Re: U.S. Adds 195,000 Jobs; Unemployment Remains 7.6%

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post
    Keep ignoring the truth, QE will not offset the costs to small businesses of Obamacare, higher taxes, and more regulations?
    This is funny, you are questioning your own "truth"!!

    I would ask you to support your contention, but since it is not only off topic AND an attempt to prove a negative, I won't force you to do so here....but feel free to prove it in your own thread on this topic you insist upon.


    All the easy money in the world will not pay the monthly expenses of a small business.
    And we are observing a poster who claims to know all about QE.....believing that the purpose of QE is to pay for these things!

    You help me with every post.
    Quote Originally Posted by trouble13 View Post
    If you wanna know why Trumpsters are ignoring you its for the same reason you ignored the KKKs complaints about Obama.
    Quote Originally Posted by Moderate Right View Post
    When it comes down to it, all facts are cherry picked.
    Quote Originally Posted by Bodhisattva View Post
    He didn't say it didn't make sense. He said it is complete nonsense.

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    Re: U.S. Adds 195,000 Jobs; Unemployment Remains 7.6%

    Quote Originally Posted by DA60 View Post
    That old excuse?

    What the heck do yesterday's numbers have to do with 5 years ago? Or even two years ago.

    The numbers describe the present employment situation in America.

    Do you not have the emotional capacity to look at the numbers and make a judgement based only on recent figures?

    If you don't, please let us know now so I can just assume that you are not capable of a frank discussion on the present employment situation in America.


    Now...in your opinion, is this a good jobs reports?

    Yes or no?

    There is such a thing called context and perspective. Figures don't exist in a vacuum. Are the employment figures where they should be? No. Are they a hell of a lot better than they were 5 years ago? Absolutely.
    Is this a good jobs report? Yes and No. It could be a lot better, but it is better than a jobs report showing us hemorraghing hundreds of thousands of jobs. There are things about Obama that I like and things about him that I dislike. Overall on the economy....considering where we were and where we were headed....I would give him a B-. Better than most but certainly there is room for improvement.

    The previous clown in the whitehouse did as good with the economy as he did capturing Bin Laden. It didn't concern him that much.
    <font size=5><b>Its been several weeks since the Vegas shooting.  Its it still "Too Early" or can we start having the conversation about finally doing something about these mass shootings???​</b></font>

  6. #166
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    Re: U.S. Adds 195,000 Jobs; Unemployment Remains 7.6%

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post
    In an economy that is predominantly private sector comparing govt. spending and debt to the private sector GDP is an exercise that excites liberals but means nothing.
    Much better. I am glad to see you are willing to confront the point. Though, obviously you have given up on denying the fact that debt to GDP consistently rises during the Republican administrations and falls during the Democratic administrations....


    Total Increase in debt to GDP overall.jpg


    .... and settled for the "deny the quality of the fact" (the "so-what?" retort).

    Sorry, the aggregate value of the debt means nothing unless compared to something... some benchmark. Almost all bankers will tell you that total debt means nothing unless compared to ability to pay. General Electric has almost 1/2 trillion of debt. Is that more troublesome than an unemployed middle manager with a $100,000 mortgage? Though the GE debt is 5Billion times that of the middle manager, which banker do you think loses more sleep?

    Aggregate debt has no significance without a comparison to debt service capacity. What is the source of the debt service capacity of the United States? The ability to tax. What does the government tax? Economic activity a/k/a GDP. The higher the GDP, the higher the tax receipts. US government debt service is derived from GDP (private sector activity).... on the flip side, government expenditures, though less correlated, are also a function of GDP. The fact the US taxes are amongst the lowest in the world and it has one of the largest GDPs lets us realize that there is a lot more debt service capacity that can be tapped into, if required.

    Now I appreciate the fact the Republicans have a remarkably poor record in managing the debt when they hold the executive office (see chart above), but you will just have to accept their P-poor performance here if you want to complain about the debt (accept the fact that your party is a big part of the problem, then you have the credibility to complain about the problem (AA 101))

    There has been an interesting line of reasoning that the Cons deliberately run up the debt while in power and then turn around and complain about it when out of power, forcing the Dems to do the nasty work. That is an interesting allegation and completely consistent with the chart above.

    So, if you want to tell us debt to GDP is meaningless, then help us with a generally accepted measure of debt service capacity to help us understand why the debt now is a bigger problem then it was in 1945, 1965 or 1985. I doubt you will have a metric better than debt to GDP.

    .... I stand ready to put on my obfuscation mask...

  7. #167
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    Re: U.S. Adds 195,000 Jobs; Unemployment Remains 7.6%

    Quote Originally Posted by Gimmesometruth View Post
    This is funny, you are questioning your own "truth"!!

    I would ask you to support your contention, but since it is not only off topic AND an attempt to prove a negative, I won't force you to do so here....but feel free to prove it in your own thread on this topic you insist upon.


    And we are observing a poster who claims to know all about QE.....believing that the purpose of QE is to pay for these things!

    You help me with every post.
    You can never admit you are wrong on any topic thus you divert. You tell me how QE pays the monthly expenses of a business? I actually ran a business, have you? I employed people, have you? You don't seem to have any concept of monthly operating expenses for a small business or the requirements to actually establish a small business. I know enough about QE to know that printing money keeps interest rates low and makes money available for expansion but expansion with higher operating expenses benefits whom? You think businesses are charities that are required to hire people? You think higher operating expenses for employees is conducive to hiring more employees? Amazing how 195,000 jobs created is great but 1 million discouraged workers is ignored. That is true loyalty to the empty suit in the WH right now.

  8. #168
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    Re: U.S. Adds 195,000 Jobs; Unemployment Remains 7.6%

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post
    You can never admit you are wrong on any topic thus you divert. You tell me how QE pays the monthly expenses of a business?
    I have no idea why you think I need to answer YOUR claim!

    FFS con, YOU think that QE is supposed to pay for "monthly business expenses"...not me!

    And then you have the gall to claim I am "diverting"!!!!

    Seriously, step away from the keyboard Con, the damage you are inflicting on yourself is greater than you are realizing.
    Quote Originally Posted by trouble13 View Post
    If you wanna know why Trumpsters are ignoring you its for the same reason you ignored the KKKs complaints about Obama.
    Quote Originally Posted by Moderate Right View Post
    When it comes down to it, all facts are cherry picked.
    Quote Originally Posted by Bodhisattva View Post
    He didn't say it didn't make sense. He said it is complete nonsense.

  9. #169
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    Re: U.S. Adds 195,000 Jobs; Unemployment Remains 7.6%

    Quote Originally Posted by upsideguy View Post
    Much better. I am glad to see you are willing to confront the point. Though, obviously you have given up on denying the fact that debt to GDP consistently rises during the Republican administrations and falls during the Democratic administrations....


    Total Increase in debt to GDP overall.jpg


    .... and settled for the "deny the quality of the fact" (the "so-what?" retort).

    Sorry, the aggregate value of the debt means nothing unless compared to something... some benchmark. Almost all bankers will tell you that total debt means nothing unless compared to ability to pay. General Electric has almost 1/2 trillion of debt. Is that more troublesome than an unemployed middle manager with a $100,000 mortgage? Though the GE debt is 5Billion times that of the middle manager, which banker do you think loses more sleep?

    Aggregate debt has no significance without a comparison to debt service capacity. What is the source of the debt service capacity of the United States? The ability to tax. What does the government tax? Economic activity a/k/a GDP. The higher the GDP, the higher the tax receipts. US government debt service is derived from GDP (private sector activity).... on the flip side, government expenditures, though less correlated, are also a function of GDP. The fact the US taxes are amongst the lowest in the world and it has one of the largest GDPs lets us realize that there is a lot more debt service capacity that can be tapped into, if required.

    Now I appreciate the fact the Republicans have a remarkably poor record in managing the debt when they hold the executive office (see chart above), but you will just have to accept their P-poor performance here if you want to complain about the debt (accept the fact that your party is a big part of the problem, then you have the credibility to complain about the problem (AA 101))

    There has been an interesting line of reasoning that the Cons deliberately run up the debt while in power and then turn around and complain about it when out of power, forcing the Dems to do the nasty work. That is an interesting allegation and completely consistent with the chart above.

    So, if you want to tell us debt to GDP is meaningless, then help us with a generally accepted measure of debt service capacity to help us understand why the debt now is a bigger problem then it was in 1945, 1965 or 1985. I doubt you will have a metric better than debt to GDP.

    .... I stand ready to put on my obfuscation mask...
    Wow, that is really awesome, debt to GDP ratio? Do you have any idea what you are talking about? Do you know what percentage of GDP is govt spending yet you compare govt. spending and debt to GDP? What you do is show that you haven't a clue how our economy works and continues to buy the leftwing rhetoric that ignores actual private business costs. Just throw more money at the problem, right?

    Running up debt isn't unique to Republicans and what is amazing to me is how you ignore that Obama has run up more debt than any other President in history to generate 177000 jobs more than what he inherited over four years later. Those are good economic results to a liberal.

    Debt to GDP ratio is indeed meaningless but the debt service on that debt is meaningful. Debt service is the fourth largest budget item and benefits whom? 144 million working Americans today vs. 146 million in December 2007. 10.6 trillion in debt at the end of the Bush term to 16.8 trillion in debt today? 10 million people added to the labor force during the Bush term vs 1.5 million in the 4 plus years of Obama? 1 million in discouraged workers four years after the end of the recession vs. ZERO months of a million discouraged workers during the Bush term.

    Yes, keep buying the Obama rhetoric

  10. #170
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    Re: U.S. Adds 195,000 Jobs; Unemployment Remains 7.6%

    Quote Originally Posted by Gimmesometruth View Post
    I have no idea why you think I need to answer YOUR claim!

    FFS con, YOU think that QE is supposed to pay for "monthly business expenses"...not me!

    And then you have the gall to claim I am "diverting"!!!!

    Seriously, step away from the keyboard Con, the damage you are inflicting on yourself is greater than you are realizing.
    You are the one claiming that QE is necessary to create jobs when the reality is a pro business growth economic policy is what will create jobs. You don't have a clue what you are talking about and is exactly the problem we face today, people who don't understand how business works. All the printed money in the world isn't going to create a climate that offsets the costs of Obamacare, higher taxes, and more regulations.

    Seriously you have a problem and cannot admit that you are wrong. My expertise is in running a business, yours is in buying leftwing big govt. rhetoric.
    Last edited by Conservative; 07-06-13 at 03:20 PM.

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