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Thread: U.S. Adds 195,000 Jobs; Unemployment Remains 7.6%

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    Re: U.S. Adds 195,000 Jobs; Unemployment Remains 7.6%

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post
    So if you are going to support a "fair" wage, isn't it a requirement to define fair?

    Fair wage, living wage, minimum wage... its all getting at the same thing isn't it?

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    Re: U.S. Adds 195,000 Jobs; Unemployment Remains 7.6%

    Quote Originally Posted by MusicAdventurer View Post
    Wages that take advantage of the worker... that's why we have minimum wage... which needs to be increased at this time
    You didn't answer the question. What wage is not fair in which each party agrees?
    I don't often change my signature, but this was just too over the top to let anyone forget with what this country is up against...
    Quote Originally Posted by James D Hill View Post
    I am for gay marriage because it ticks off Jesus freaks and social conservatives. Gays are also good voters because the vote for my side so I fight next to them.

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    Re: U.S. Adds 195,000 Jobs; Unemployment Remains 7.6%

    Quote Originally Posted by MusicAdventurer View Post
    Minimum wage forces companies not to take advantage of workers out of greed. It also forces them to be creative. Many employers become overwhelmed with greed and simply whine because they don't have full control of what happens in their lives. I say get over it... no one has full control over their lives... no one ever has. Don't try to take it out on others, most specifically, your employees.
    Look, minimum wage isn't meant to be a permanent long term wage but rather a starting wage. In some cases minimum wage is overpaying some people and I can put you in touch with many. Why is that never a consideration to people like you?

    On the other hand minimum wage establishes a value for a job regardless of its value to the customer, the company, or the value of that employee which again you cannot see. It is the market that should determine what wage an employee should be paid not the federal govt. It is the market that will determine the definition of fair as well unless you have no problem paying $10 for a Big Mac so that a McDonalds employee can get what you perceive as fair.

    It is always so easy for someone else to spend some other person's money

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    Re: U.S. Adds 195,000 Jobs; Unemployment Remains 7.6%

    Quote Originally Posted by MusicAdventurer View Post
    Fair wage, living wage, minimum wage... its all getting at the same thing isn't it?
    No, because fair wage in TX based upon cost of living is different than the fair wage in NY if you want to equate fair wage to living wage. Further if you want to dictate what some company pays its workers, you should be willing to pay some of their profit demand as well

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    Re: U.S. Adds 195,000 Jobs; Unemployment Remains 7.6%

    Quote Originally Posted by AlabamaPaul View Post
    You didn't answer the question. What wage is not fair in which each party agrees?
    A prisoner may admit to a crime after being tortured for hours even though he hasn't committed a crime at all. Does the fact that he agreed to admit to the crime make the situation fair?

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    Re: U.S. Adds 195,000 Jobs; Unemployment Remains 7.6%

    Quote Originally Posted by MusicAdventurer View Post
    A prisoner may admit to a crime after being tortured for hours even though he hasn't committed a crime at all. Does the fact that he agreed to admit to the crime make the situation fair?
    Is there a particular reason you're avoiding the question?
    I don't often change my signature, but this was just too over the top to let anyone forget with what this country is up against...
    Quote Originally Posted by James D Hill View Post
    I am for gay marriage because it ticks off Jesus freaks and social conservatives. Gays are also good voters because the vote for my side so I fight next to them.

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    Re: U.S. Adds 195,000 Jobs; Unemployment Remains 7.6%

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post
    Look, minimum wage isn't meant to be a permanent long term wage but rather a starting wage. In some cases minimum wage is overpaying some people and I can put you in touch with many. Why is that never a consideration to people like you?
    People like who? Who is to say its an overpayment?

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post
    On the other hand minimum wage establishes a value for a job regardless of its value to the customer, the company, or the value of that employee which again you cannot see. It is the market that should determine what wage an employee should be paid not the federal govt. It is the market that will determine the definition of fair as well unless you have no problem paying $10 for a Big Mac so that a McDonalds employee can get what you perceive as fair.
    Companies can chose how much profit they want to hoard and how much they want to share with the people that make their company possible (i.e. their employees). Economic principles work in a perfect world. It gets messy when you add in the humanity factor. I think that is where you are running into problems. In the real world, people in society's don't like to be taken advantage of. In the real world, people become very, very greedy. In the real world, humans exist. This means imperfection. The challenge is applying economic principles with thinking, feeling, breathing humans, who have a right to decide what is and isn't acceptable in their society.

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post
    It is always so easy for someone else to spend some other person's money
    1st of all, remember that if it weren't for other people, companies wouldn't be able to hoard large sums of money. If it weren't for certain governmental protections, this wouldn't be possible either. If it weren't for certain services this wouldn't be possible. And most of all, if it weren't for the use of artificial wealth (paper money, digital money, gold, silver, etc.) such great hoarding wouldn't be possible. Before the use of such technology, people couldn't hoard wealth in the same way. If one were to hoard a barn full of apples that they were somehow able to pluck from the trees before anyone else could, those apples would go bad and all their effort to gain wealth would have been for not. So just remember, massive wealth accumulation is not really a "natural" phenomena. Government helps keep things natural, so to speak.

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    Re: U.S. Adds 195,000 Jobs; Unemployment Remains 7.6%

    Quote Originally Posted by AlabamaPaul View Post
    Is there a particular reason you're avoiding the question?
    Why didn't you answer my question? If you want, I can explain the analogy I presented.... as that was my way of answering your question

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    Re: U.S. Adds 195,000 Jobs; Unemployment Remains 7.6%

    MusicAdventurer;1062076641]People like who? Who is to say its an overpayment?
    The quality of the employee



    Companies can chose how much profit they want to hoard and how much they want to share with the people that make their company possible (i.e. their employees). Economic principles work in a perfect world. It gets messy when you add in the humanity factor. I think that is where you are running into problems. In the real world, people in society's don't like to be taken advantage of. In the real world, people become very, very greedy. In the real world, humans exist. This means imperfection. The challenge is applying economic principles with thinking, feeling, breathing humans, who have a right to decide what is and isn't acceptable in their society.
    Profit really bothers you doesn't it? Why do you care? How does a company's profit affect you. Name for me one major corporation that pays its workers minimum wage? As I stated, start your own business and learn what it costs to run it the pay the employees whatever you want.


    1st of all, remember that if it weren't for other people, companies wouldn't be able to hoard large sums of money. If it weren't for certain governmental protections, this wouldn't be possible either. If it weren't for certain services this wouldn't be possible. And most of all, if it weren't for the use of artificial wealth (paper money, digital money, gold, silver, etc.) such great hoarding wouldn't be possible. Before the use of such technology, people couldn't hoard wealth in the same way. If one were to hoard a barn full of apples that they were somehow able to pluck from the trees before anyone else could, those apples would go bad and all their effort to gain wealth would have been for not. So just remember, massive wealth accumulation is not really a "natural" phenomena. Government helps keep things natural, so to speak.
    What a company does with its profit is none of your or my business. Companies aren't in business to employ people, they are in business to make a profit, hiring people helps them do that.

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    Re: U.S. Adds 195,000 Jobs; Unemployment Remains 7.6%

    Here's the "real" unemployment rate (U-6)
    Screen-Shot-2013-07-05-at-5.34.54-PM.jpg
    I haven't seen any evidence for any major decline in unemployment in the last couple of months, so this is pretty much indicative of the fact that we have an unemployment rate that is still twice as much as 2007 levels.

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