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SCOTUS blog: DOMA Unconstitutional

exactly don't argue over the name. Civil unions are marriage. It has always been that way.

Right. Don't argue over a name. Call them the civil unions that have always been marriage instead of arguing over the name of marriage and most of your opposition vanishes. But no.... you DO want to argue over the name.
 
No, you see you did not read the article, civil unions are most often not recognized by other states and do not have the same status at the federal level.

Homosexual marriages are most often not recognized by other states nor at the federal level (until yesterday). That's a lot more like a similarity between homosexual marriages and civil unions than a difference, in my book.
 
Anything else doesn't fit their definition of marriage and since it was clear that there was an overt attempt to backdoor (no pun intended) homosexual marriage by exploiting the laws of the most liberal states for marriage and then importing an illegitimate "marriage" back into the state, this was the response. It ultimately boiled down to the definition of marriage, though, and the desire for some people (like you) to change it.
No, actually Prop 8 was a response to the SCoCA striking down of Prop 22, finding it violated the constitution of CA. I did not live in CA at that time.
 
Whether a civil union carries the same protections as marriage depends entirely on how it's written.
Homosexual marriages are most often not recognized by other states nor at the federal level (until yesterday). That's a lot more like a similarity between homosexual marriages and civil unions than a difference, in my book.
So then you do now recognize that civil unions, whether between M/F or SS, are not legally equal to marriage.

I am glad you are on the same page now.
 
So then you do now recognize that civil unions, whether between M/F or SS, are not legally equal to marriage.

I am glad you are on the same page now.

AGAIN, it depends on how they are written and what the state is. Legal contracts are legal contracts.
 
Can you disprove gravity? When scientists use theory the concept is past prove/disprove and now awaiting that magic part that convinces even the worst skeptic it is valid. The Theory of Relativity is one of the newer ones and is still on occasion wobbling on the knife edge- Evolution and Gravity are not. They can make mistakes but not to the point of invalidation. There certainly is no credible rival to evolution.

I'm sure you have a list of names... :roll: Howsomeever the list that wouldn't is beyond your ability to list.

It just made me wonder about you to say 8 tons, not around 8 tons or a bit more/less of 8 tons but just flat out 8 tons. You have the distinction of being the first gunner I know to have kept track of the number of boxes he fired and then converted them to weight. (most are too busy to keep track, many don't use boxes but bandoleers)

Odd you would claim to only want peaceful political revolution when you posted several rather strident rants about the middle class rising up in revolution and another poster is safe in Europe... a peaceful political revolution... what is the fear??? You seem to be back tracking now, and that is just as well/fairly typical.

Mayhem has three definitions I see. That you only see the first is telling. Be it riots in the street as you referred to as being mild compared to what the middle class revolution will be seems to indicate mayhem... but you now dance away from that...again just as well.

Now you claim to not be fomenting, yet you 'see' a time where the middle class will rise up in revolution making past riots look tame... :confused:

I'd agree with you on one thing, it does seem to involve a frothy mug.... :2wave:

There are scientific laws. Then, theories, then hypothesis, then conjecture and speculation.

When you confuse them, you end up with DOGMA, which is not scientific. Settled science isn't science. Ask a real scientist. Science is NEVER settled!

I said roughly 8 tons..actually I rounded down, not up. 8 tons is a ROUND figure. :D 8? round? lol
The twin 50 mount held two 100 round ammo boxes, one each side feeding the 50 on that side.
Some counted days, some KIAs, some collected ears, I counted my ammo boxes. Two boxes empty amazingly quick in a twin 50 in a fire fight.
Did I count the boxes as I used them? of course not. I counted empty boxes when we re-ammo-ed /refueled.
I suppose if I collected EARs that would be more acceptable to you?


Blacks threaten to riot if Zimmerman is aquitted.

They riot at thin excuses.

The long suffering middle class just takes abuse, and takes, and absorbs, and rolls with the punches.

Untill they DON'T!

I'm not leading or threatening anything. Threats are stupid (either a bluff or telegraphing your punch!).
I was WARNING that if liberals/socialists think middle America has no guts and can be stepped on at will?
I believe you have a SHOCK coming. Just keep it up and you will see.

I like a beer from time to time.
I also like to come to debate cites and VENT from time to time!
Keeps me sane, and calm in my day to day persona.
 
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There are scientific laws. Then, theories, then hypothesis, then conjecture and speculation.

When you confuse them, you end up with DOGMA, which is not scientific. Settled science isn't science. Ask a real scientist. Science is NEVER settled!

The twin 50 mount held two 100 round ammo boxes, one each side feeding the 50 on that side.
Some counted days, some KIAs, some collected ears, I counted my ammo boxes. Two boxes empty amazingly quick in a twin 50 in a fire fight.
Did I count the boxes as I used them? of course not. I counted empty boxes when we re-ammo-ed /refueled.
I suppose if I collected EARs that would be more acceptable to you?


Blacks threaten to riot if Zimmerman is aquitted.

They riot at thin excuses.

The long suffering middle class just takes abuse, and takes, and absorbs, and rolls with the punches.

Untill they DON'T!

I'm not leading or threatening anything. Threats are stupid (either a bluff or telegraphing your punch!).
I was WARNING that if liberals/socialists think middle America has no guts and can be stepped on at will?
I believe you have a SHOCK coming. Just keep it up and you will see.

I like a beer from time to time.
I also like to come to debate cites and VENT from time to time!
Keeps me sane, and calm in my day to day persona.

Middle America has no guts. They are lazy drunk and stupid. Sports mean more than liberty.
 
1: I don't fear God. I embrace Him. Anyone that fears God doesn't really believe in Him.

2: God made homosexuals just like He made you and me. Because of that it would be silly to think that He considers their behavior as sinful. Only heterosexual males who wrote the bible and who want to control other peoples lives don't want it or like it. Not that I blame them for not liking it, after all during that war the other side loved to humilate those it conquered as a form of pshycological warfare. (wish i could remember which war that was :p )

You evidently don't have a clue about God or the Bible.
 
There are scientific laws. Then, theories, then hypothesis, then conjecture and speculation. When you confuse them, you end up with DOGMA, which is not scientific. Settled science isn't science. Ask a real scientist. Science is NEVER settled!

The twin 50 mount held two 100 round ammo boxes, one each side feeding the 50 on that side.
Some counted days, some KIAs, some collected ears, I counted my ammo boxes. Two boxes empty amazingly quick in a twin 50 in a fire fight.
Did I count the boxes as I used them? of course not. I counted empty boxes when we re-ammo-ed /refueled.
I suppose if I collected EARs that would be more acceptable to you?


Blacks threaten to riot if Zimmerman is aquitted. They riot at thin excuses. The long suffering middle class just takes abuse, and takes, and absorbs, and rolls with the punches. Untill they DON'T! I'm not leading or threatening anything. Threats are stupid (either a bluff or telegraphing your punch!).
I was WARNING that if liberals/socialists think middle America has no guts and can be stepped on at will?
I believe you have a SHOCK coming. Just keep it up and you will see. I like a beer from time to time.
I also like to come to debate cites and VENT from time to time!
Keeps me sane, and calm in my day to day persona.

Oh I am not the one who is confusing the issue. You seem intent on using theory to cast doubt on Evolution when it is the same word attached to Gravity. The small print may be altered from time to time as more data comes in but Evolution will not be displaced. I never said it is 'settled' but the path has been set and it is just a matter of filling in a few gaps.

Well ears would mean ya at least hit something for all that ammo... ;)

Ah you said riot was nothing compared to the revolution that is coming, you told a poster it was a good thing he was in Europe so as to miss the middle Class Revolution. Then you walked that back, just as well, I don't think many folks think the middle class will revolt over Doma or SSM.

I agree threats are stupid, but the 'just you wait 'n see' isn't much brighter. :peace
 
Oh I am not the one who is confusing the issue. You seem intent on using theory to cast doubt on Evolution when it is the same word attached to Gravity. The small print may be altered from time to time as more data comes in but Evolution will not be displaced. I never said it is 'settled' but the path has been set and it is just a matter of filling in a few gaps.

Well ears would mean ya at least hit something for all that ammo... ;)

Ah you said riot was nothing compared to the revolution that is coming, you told a poster it was a good thing he was in Europe so as to miss the middle Class Revolution. Then you walked that back, just as well, I don't think many folks think the middle class will revolt over Doma or SSM.

I agree threats are stupid, but the 'just you wait 'n see' isn't much brighter. :peace

over DOMA and SSM alone? No, I agree.

But the load of straw on our backs is getting large and heavy!

What tiny thing will be the LAST straw?

Predict that and you'll be rich and famous! :D


I walked back because it seemed to me you were egging me to openly declare war.

Warning was my intent. Not announcing revolution.

When/if I go over the edge it will be a voluntary leap, not pushed or dared! :p
 
Don't argue over the name and you eliminate most of your opposition.

Not true. Most of the major organizations that are anti-ssm also oppose same sex civil unions of any kind.

The only reason many are now going to supporting civil unions is because they recognize what was happening, the majority support equality for same sex couples and they know that without supporting civil unions, same sex couples will get to marry. So they switched (just recently, as in the last year) to supporting same sex civil unions because opposition to any recognition is an absolute lost cause.

But there are still some who oppose all civil unions for same sex couples of any kind, just as there are still many people who want to see sodomy laws enforceable again and even those that want to see homosexuals killed or isolated from society.

All are on the wrong side of history though. The younger generation supports same sex marriage, not civil unions, not domestic partnerships, but marriage. And we support it in large majorities that just continue to grow.
 
AGAIN, it depends on how they are written and what the state is. Legal contracts are legal contracts.
"What the state is"? When I read things like this, a collection of words posing as a sentence, it reminds me and confirms who I am debating.
A civil union is only recognized in other states that have a civil union too...AND the other state has agreed to recognize it. Legal contracts are not necessarily enforceable in states other than where they were written. And again, beyond the state level, civil unions are dealt with differently at the federal level, which is the pertinent point.


You just keep displaying your ignorance on this subject because you refuse to read material I supply to you.
 
There are scientific laws. Then, theories, then hypothesis, then conjecture and speculation.

When you confuse them, you end up with DOGMA, which is not scientific. Settled science isn't science. Ask a real scientist. Science is NEVER settled!

I said roughly 8 tons..actually I rounded down, not up. 8 tons is a ROUND figure. :D 8? round? lol
The twin 50 mount held two 100 round ammo boxes, one each side feeding the 50 on that side.
Some counted days, some KIAs, some collected ears, I counted my ammo boxes. Two boxes empty amazingly quick in a twin 50 in a fire fight.
Did I count the boxes as I used them? of course not. I counted empty boxes when we re-ammo-ed /refueled.
I suppose if I collected EARs that would be more acceptable to you?


Blacks threaten to riot if Zimmerman is aquitted.

They riot at thin excuses.

The long suffering middle class just takes abuse, and takes, and absorbs, and rolls with the punches.

Untill they DON'T!

I'm not leading or threatening anything. Threats are stupid (either a bluff or telegraphing your punch!).
I was WARNING that if liberals/socialists think middle America has no guts and can be stepped on at will?
I believe you have a SHOCK coming. Just keep it up and you will see.

I like a beer from time to time.
I also like to come to debate cites and VENT from time to time!
Keeps me sane, and calm in my day to day persona.

Shut the hell up and start shooting already. I'm tired of hearing privileged, lazy middle-class wannabe revolutionaries call for an uprising from their rascal scooters. Oh, sorry, you're just "warning" people, not "threatening." Trash talk you'll never back up is all I hear.
 
Shut the hell up and start shooting already. I'm tired of hearing privileged, lazy middle-class wannabe revolutionaries call for an uprising from their rascal scooters. Oh, sorry, you're just "warning" people, not "threatening." Trash talk you'll never back up is all I hear.

Okay. What range you want to meet at? What sort of competition you think you're good at?
skeet? clays? cowboy fast draw? benchrest? offhand rifle? steel target? what? :D
and where?

Make a date a couple months off.

I got to return to my ship in the morning.

So I won't be on line for awhile.

Please you? :)


Oh!

About privileged.
Yes. I was privileged to be born and grow up in the USA.
I worked and earned EVERYTHING I have.

Because I am an American, not an american't!

which are you?
 
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over DOMA and SSM alone? No, I agree. But the load of straw on our backs is getting large and heavy! What tiny thing will be the LAST straw? Predict that and you'll be rich and famous! :D I walked back because it seemed to me you were egging me to openly declare war. Warning was my intent. Not announcing revolution. When/if I go over the edge it will be a voluntary leap, not pushed or dared! :p

I rub my crystal ball, a childhood accident involving a barbed wire fence, and see no amount of straw will break 'our' backs. Gimme my money!

Oh you was doing just fine with your middle class revolution rant at the European guy, I just asked to refine the data. ;)

Your warning is lost in the myriad of 'warnings' given on a daily basis, 'full of sound and fury... signifying....' what does it signify, I forget...

I'll pass on a bit of intel those airborne crazies are fond of saying- when you stand up, buckle up and shuffle to the door, when the light turns green you really don't have a say, you EXIT the aircraft. So if you want total say on when you jump, don't get too close to that door.... check? :2wave:
 
I rub my crystal ball, a childhood accident involving a barbed wire fence, and see no amount of straw will break 'our' backs. Gimme my money!

Oh you was doing just fine with your middle class revolution rant at the European guy, I just asked to refine the data. ;)

Your warning is lost in the myriad of 'warnings' given on a daily basis, 'full of sound and fury... signifying....' what does it signify, I forget...

I'll pass on a bit of intel those airborne crazies are fond of saying- when you stand up, buckle up and shuffle to the door, when the light turns green you really don't have a say, you EXIT the aircraft. So if you want total say on when you jump, don't get too close to that door.... check? :2wave:

Jumping out of perfectly good airplanes seems insane to me, but if I HAVE to jump, you keep the parachute. I want a 60 ft river barge rigging wire.

THAT things hangs on EVERYTHING!
 
Jumping out of perfectly good airplanes seems insane to me, but if I HAVE to jump, you keep the parachute. I want a 60 ft river barge rigging wire.

THAT things hangs on EVERYTHING!

To each his own, my point was proximity to door lowers the freedom of action as a bunch of other assholes and elbows will be bearing down to jump... :shock:
 
To each his own, my point was proximity to door lowers the freedom of action as a bunch of other assholes and elbows will be bearing down to jump... :shock:

There are no great men, only great challenges that ordinary men are forced by circumstances to meet." Adm. William F. Halsey
 
There are no great men, only great challenges that ordinary men are forced by circumstances to meet." Adm. William F. Halsey

gentlemen, we are surrounded by insurmountable opportunities!

we have met the enemy and he is us! Pogo....

my favorite 'Bull' Halsey quote.... 'What typhoon?' my second best is from the Battle of Leyte Gulf... 'we'll only be up north for a quick fight, what could happen down here?' later taffy 3 and 6 fought a suicidal battle against major Japanese surface units in a desperate attempt to protect the landing fleet.

ok, I made them up.... :lol:
 
gentlemen, we are surrounded by insurmountable opportunities!

we have met the enemy and he is us! Pogo....

my favorite 'Bull' Halsey quote.... 'What typhoon?' my second best is from the Battle of Leyte Gulf... 'we'll only be up north for a quick fight, what could happen down here?' later taffy 3 and 6 fought a suicidal battle against major Japanese surface units in a desperate attempt to protect the landing fleet.

ok, I made them up.... :lol:

Too late. Your fake quotes already have been transferred to "Famous Military quotes", by Google.

They're fast! :)
 
I think bias is skewing your perspective or your perspective takes in a broad scope of time with a lot of change in between. The pro SSM side has been snarling rabidly at anyone and everyone that does not go along with their agenda without question. Count up the references to racists, nzi's and "hate-filled bigots" and see which side has the winning tally.

No, your bias is certainly skewing your perspective. The anti-SSM side is EASILY nastier and more insulting and has been for the entire time I've been at DP. I can count up the "perverts", "diseased", "disordered", "disgusting", and a whole host of others that will easily beat anything the pro-SSM side has said, both in volume and intensity. It's not even a close comparison.
 
The vitriol and name calling from the left over this has been so vehement and obnoxious that ID vote against civil unions, myself, right now out of pure antipathy. The same left insisting on changing the definition of marriage has been utterly uncaring about gun rights or even protecting babies past the first trimester. There hasn't been any sense of empathy and I think battle lines are merely hardening. My position became more entrenched since the decision and all the subsequent hate-speech from the left. I know it can't be just me. I think its stupid of the left to goad their opponents into stiffer opposition but it seems that is what the intentions are. Whatever. The lines are drawn and positions hardened and I guess we will see how that works out for you. I wonder how many billions you will spend just trying to prove a point.

I find it amusing that some on the right bitch and complain about the left pushing this issue, when it has been many on the right who have been lying about information and data, and attacking gays for years. If those on the right who have been so attacking were not so hypocritical about liberty, they would have supported this from the get-go.
 
Funny. The left actually think it's worse to call someone a bigot or racist than a sexual deviant or pedophile. Go figure.

And one more thing. This kind of nasty and dishonest crap like you just posted again just stiffens the differences. Homosexuals weren't being compared to animal livers and kid touchers.

This is why it is laughable to listen to you bitch about what those on the left say about those on the right who oppose SSM. I have seen more posters on this site compare gays to child molesters than I have EVER seen someone on the left call an anti-SSM person a bigot.

You really shouldn't speak about things you don't know anything about... especially when your bias skews your perceptions.
 
I've proposed that, myself. Would solve the bickering, wouldn't it?

I proposed it a long time ago. You'd be amazed at how many on the anti-SSM side bitched and complained that it somehow altered the meaning of their "marriage".
 
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