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US will supply military weapons to the Syrian rebels.

I am not projecting :) You stated



I proved that the first article completely did not back up what you said as it stated "The newspapers sources refused to have their names revealed but said that “some kind of chemical weapon” has been used in the country. They could not tell whether Syrian President Bashar Assad’s forces or the rebels were responsible."

You responded with




In the last article I posted, I quoted the article as stating that there was not any proof as to who had used chemical weapons. "It has not been possible, on the evidence available, to determine the precise chemical agents used, their delivery systems or the perpetrator," Paulo Pinheiro, who chairs the UN commission of inquiry, told a news conference in Geneva."


You responded with




Thus, you did not address the points that I made that 1) Your first article completely went against what you stated and 2) You ignored where I quoted the article as stating that we didn't know who had used the chemical weapons. You replied with quote from that same article stating the chemical weapons were used. We are not arguing about whether or not they were used, but who used them.




In terms of likelihood of who is more likely to have chemical weapons, it is the Syrian government, however that doesn't change the fact that there is still no evidence as to who used chemical weapons.





I explained that they are with the rebels (as was stated in the article) and when the fighting occurs, they have to depend upon said rebels to protect them, thus they could be potentially biased in favor of the rebels, seeing as how those rebels are protecting them.

How do you know there is not more evidence that was not released to the public. France and GB have determined that Assad used Sarin gas also.
 
How do you know there is not more evidence that was not released to the public. France and GB have determined that Assad used Sarin gas also.

I don't know. Personally, I would like to see such evidence released as if my tax dollars are going to go to support these guys, at the very least I should have access to the evidence that Assad used chemical weapons.

EDIT: We need to keep in mind that the US government has lied to us before about what was going on. Just look at Gaddafi: The Top Ten Myths in the War Against Libya » CounterPunch: Tells the Facts, Names the Names
 
Very well. You have proven me incorrect. I concede this debate.

I only maintain that if chemical weapons were used, they were certainly of the Syrian army, as I seriously doubt that the rebel forces would be able to manufacture Sarin gas.

It was a good debate though. I definitely had to look and think on my feet :p I always enjoy that.

If you want, we can do a debate in the True Debate section. :)
 
It was a good debate though. I definitely had to look and think on my feet :p I always enjoy that.

I aim to please.

If you want, we can do a debate in the True Debate section. :)

Tempting, but I can only get my ass kicked so many times in one day. Maybe for another issue.
 
I don't know. Personally, I would like to see such evidence released as if my tax dollars are going to go to support these guys, at the very least I should have access to the evidence that Assad used chemical weapons.

EDIT: We need to keep in mind that the US government has lied to us before about what was going on. Just look at Gaddafi: The Top Ten Myths in the War Against Libya » CounterPunch: Tells the Facts, Names the Names

It seems you like to give totalitarian dictators the benefit of the doubt. Do you have any reason to believe that Assad would not use the chemical weapons that are at his disposal?
 
I aim to please.



Tempting, but I can only get my ass kicked so many times in one day. Maybe for another issue.

Of course for another issue. :D When you think of one, just hit me up.
 
It seems you like to give totalitarian dictators the benefit of the doubt. Do you have any reason to believe that Assad would not use the chemical weapons that are at his disposal?

I am not giving Assad the benefit of the doubt, nowhere have I stated that. All I am saying is that at the moment, we still do not have any evidence of who used those chemical weapons. We only have allegations.
 
It seems you like to give totalitarian dictators the benefit of the doubt. Do you have any reason to believe that Assad would not use the chemical weapons that are at his disposal?

i believe that Obama's warning of consequences should chemical weapons be employed would dissuade him from using them
unless he had run out of conventional options

my concern is that this allegation may be a ruse to get involved in a country's governance, not unlike the false claim that iraq had WMDs
fool me once, shame on you; fool me again, shame on me ... something the shrub obviously did not understand. hopefully, Obama can do better
 
It seems you like to give totalitarian dictators the benefit of the doubt. Do you have any reason to believe that Assad would not use the chemical weapons that are at his disposal?

Yeah...common sense.

Why on Earth would Assad authorize the use of chemical weapons if he knew that was EXACTLY the excuse Obama was waiting for to arm the rebels?

The guy has been a dictator for many years - he maybe a crappy human being...but surely he is not THAT stupid.


And besides, where is this evidence that Obama talks about?

There is no friggin' way I am taking his word for ANYTHING.

And you are naive if you believe him just because he says it is so.
 
U.S. to increase military support to Syria rebels | Reuters

Just announced. The US has confirmed it has undeniable proof that Assad in fact used chemical weapons against his own people and, as a result, the US will begin supplying lethal military aid to the rebels for the first time since the war began 2 years ago.

About damn time.

How many wars is that now for our Nobel Laureate? And where is the UN and the rest of the world? Why is it always the US?
 
The reporters are not their to support the Syrian rebel cause; they are there to report. What exactly is the bias coming in?

Like Walter Cronkite and Tet.
 
I guess when it comes to the Liberal Radio Talk Shows the Syrian people aren't worth as much as the people of Iraq ...

Syria and U.S. Imperialism

"When U.S. imperialism engages in an attack on any government or movement, it is essential that the workers' and progressive political movements for change gather as much information as is available and take a stand.

It is cowardly to be neutral and rank betrayal to stand on the same side as the imperialist octopus, which seeks to dominate the world."

The Arab American News - Syria and U.S. imperialism
 
We do seem do seem to have a history of helping our future enemies militarily, don't we?
 
There are reports that the Syria No Fly Zone and bombings will start this month. There is a reason the Pentagon pushed back at the Syria No Fly Zone story … because the decision has been made.

Pentagon pushes back against Syria no-fly zone report - The Hill's DEFCON Hill

The Preznit Obomber, serial fascist and Nazi butt pipe, will set in motion a chain of events in Syria which he will not be able to undo. First off, the No Fly Zone has been completed, and then the bombings will rain down from U.S. fighter planes which Israel already has done. Next, the thousands of American troops will be necessary to battle a huge ground war taking years, with horrific casualties. Then, when the battle becomes a stalemate, the U.S. will have to have new American army recruits to keep the quagmire going. Iran will destablize the war will broaden into mass carnage, sanctions, disease, starvation and conflagration. World opinion will solidify against Obomber the fascist and the U.S. Nazi aggressors disregard for human life on a mass scale in Syria as was the case in Iraq.
The U.S. will lose after having exhausted options and available U.S. troops stationed nearby.

Here is a video of what the Obama secretly funded, trained terrorists in Syria are really doing the last two years hidden from the American people but once you get past the COINTELPRO MEDIA censors like the NYT, CNN, NBC, PBS, NPR, etc.

WARNING GRAPHIC

 
U.S. to increase military support to Syria rebels | Reuters

Just announced. The US has confirmed it has undeniable proof that Assad in fact used chemical weapons against his own people and, as a result, the US will begin supplying lethal military aid to the rebels for the first time since the war began 2 years ago.

About damn time.
:shock:
NOOOO!!!
Why the **** is it our business to get involved in a civil war!?
I also suspect that the gov could just be totally making this **** up to get invovled.
Also i suspect that we have already been arming them.
Why the hell should we get on a side that allies itself with Al-Qaeda groups?
This is so stupid.
 
I have to question why on earth we should sit back and let thousands of people be killed by their own government, which evidently has used chemical weapons against them.

Heya JB :2wave: I hope you are aware that the Rebels are responsible for minimum of 1/3 of the 93K killed in Syria.
 
Of course we should supply the rebels weapons!! When has supplying weapons to foreign rebels ever resulted in unintended consequences down the road?

121121_osama_bin_laden_ap_605.jpg
 
What's the point? Think a majority of the rebels are AlQ? No, you can't be that lame.

Yes....the majority of rebels are tied to AQ and the MB, and Salafis. Which we went thru this in another thread.

Syrian Rebels: “When We Finish With Assad, We Will Fight the U.S.....

A shocking report by McClatchy Newspapers’ David Enders reveals that the militants now on the front lines of the rebel uprising in Syria – supported by the Obama administration and other western powers – are Al-Qaeda terrorists who killed U.S. troops in Iraq and openly espouse their desire to “fight the U.S.” after they topple Bashar Al-Assad.

The official narrative at first attempted to deny the existence of Al-Qaeda terrorists in Syria altogether, before being forced to admit they were present but downplaying their role as limited and not characteristic of the rebel uprising.

However, Enders documents how Jabhat al Nusra, a group directly affiliated with Al-Qaeda, “has become essential to the frontline operations of the rebels fighting to topple Assad,” that the group is “critical to the rebels’ military advance” and how it conducts the “heaviest frontline fighting” in “battle after battle across the country.”

A journalist cited in the article also discovered “Nusra’s fighters on every frontline he visited.”
Jabhat al Nusra has claimed responsibility for numerous suicide bombings and other attacks that have killed hundreds of innocent people. Last weekend, disturbing footage emerged of one of their members slaughtering prisoners in cold blood.

Extremist militants have also ransacked Christian churches and carried out sectarian beheadings.

The article quotes one of the members of the group, who stated unequivocally, “When we finish with Assad, we will fight the U.S.!”

The journalist who heard the comment considered that it could have been a “joke,” but it didn’t appear to be much of a laughing matter when Syrian rebels were shown on camera proudly burning U.S. flags on two separate occasions recently.

As we previously documented, rebel supporters chanted anti-American slogans as they torched the American flag in Homs and Aleppo.

Another opposition fighter recently spoke of his desire to see the Al-Qaeda flag fly over the White House once the rebels are victorious across the region. Suffice to say, he didn’t appear to be joking

Syrian rebel fighters are routinely photographed wearing the Al-Qaeda motif. There are also innumerable You Tube videos that show opposition forces flying the Al-Qaeda flag – the same distinctive black flag with white Arabic lettering that was flown by rioters during anti-U.S. demonstrations in numerous countries earlier this year.

French Surgeon Jacques Bérès, who worked at a hospital in Aleppo commented that at least half of the militants he treated for injuries were Al-Qaeda terrorists whose goal is to impose sharia law across Syria and the whole region. A German report estimated the figure of foreign fighters in Syria to be even higher - a staggering 95 per cent.

Among Nusra fighters are many Syrians who say they fought with al Qaida in Iraq, which waged a bloody and violent campaign against the U.S. presence in that country and is still blamed for suicide and car bombings that have killed hundreds of Iraqis since the U.S. troops left a year ago,” writes Enders.

The article asserts that the presence of these terrorists in Syria, “worries U.S. and other Western officials,” although it obviously wasn’t too much of a concern when the Obama administration signed off on over $200 million dollars in aid to the FSA rebels.

Nor was it much of a worry for the CIA when it helped the likes of Saudi Arabia, Turkey and Qatar funnel heavy arms to rebel groups in the region.

Although the establishment media has billed the rebels’ cause as a democratic uprising, one of the leaders of Jabhat al Nusra quoted in the McClatchy piece, Iyad al Sheikh Mahmoud, made it clear that there would be no free elections in Syria once Assad is toppled......snip~

Then....

Although Jabhat al-Nusra remains separate from the Free Syrian Army, many FSA leaders now recognise its strength and order their forces to cooperate with it.....snip~

Syrian rebels defy US and pledge allegiance to jihadi group - Telegraph

Then.....


Even mainstream opposition activists expressed anger at what they claimed was America's last-minute attempt to "muscle in on their revolution".

"It is terrible timing on the part of the United States," said Mulham Jundi, who works with the opposition charity Watan Syria. "By calling Jabhat al-Nusra terrorists, the US is legitimising the Syrian regime's bombardment of cities like Aleppo. Now the government can say it is attacking terrorists."

The rise of Jabhat al-Nusra represents the Americans' worst fear – they refused to arm the rebels earlier in the conflict to avoid weapons falling into the hands of jihadists, only to find that in their absence, jihadi groups well-funded by supporters in the Gulf have risen to prominence.

The West attempted to rectify this at the weekend by backing the formation of a new FSA command structure at a meeting in Turkey. Its new leadership, which sidelines former commanders such as Gen Mustafa al-Sheikh and Col Riad al-Assad, includes senior figures without a regime background. Many are linked to the Muslim Brotherhood or even more radical Salafi movements, but are thought to be men with whom the West "can do business".

Opposition fighters inside Syria told The Daily Telegraph that the US announcement was too little too late, and that any attempts by the West to intervene in Syria would be rejected. "We don't support the new FSA military command," said Ous al-Arabi, a spokesman of the Deir al-Zour Revolutionary council.

"For Deir al-Zour province they have chosen people who are not representative. Jabhat al-Nusra is the strongest group here and they ignored that.

"The people are not going to accept intervention by the West now. You were watching us die, and now that we close to victory you want to intervene? You are not welcome."

Read more: Syrian Rebels Pledge Allegiance To Newly Named 'Terrorist' Militant Group - Business Insider
 
:shock:
NOOOO!!!
Why the **** is it our business to get involved in a civil war!?
I also suspect that the gov could just be totally making this **** up to get invovled.
Also i suspect that we have already been arming them.
Why the hell should we get on a side that allies itself with Al-Qaeda groups?
This is so stupid.

Yes, but more than that, the intelligence community has been behind pretty much all the recent upheaval in the middle east.
 
I haven't read this whole thread, but given the Republican reaction to the red line mentioned by Obama before, I trust all Republicans in this thread are now joyful with the news Obama is enforcing his red line statement and are supporting the President's decision 100%. Correct?
 
Heya JB :2wave: I hope you are aware that the Rebels are responsible for minimum of 1/3 of the 93K killed in Syria.

Can I have a source?

And don't call me JB.
 
At the behest of Senator John McCain (R-AZ), the White House announced on Thursday that it will be supplying the Syrian opposition with more military support. History is bloodied by similar US interventions, namely in Afghanistan in the 1980's. So why do John McCain and the Obama White House think this intervention will be different this time? RT Political Commentator Sam Sacks reports.
Arming Syrian Rebels: History Repeats Itself - YouTube

History might repeat itself... Again..
 
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