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Thread: Obamacare: Is a $2,000 deductible 'affordable?'

  1. #411
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    Re: Obamacare: Is a $2,000 deductible 'affordable?'

    Quote Originally Posted by roughdraft274 View Post
    1. The healthcare bill was the most widely disseminated, widely studied bills that's ever passed. There are plenty of very large bills that pass every year that garner much less attention. To act as though it was rushed through after over a year of debate is silly at best.

    2. Yes, no republicans voted for it. That doesn't mean that they have to be ignorant and not make it better in the future. Look at all the GOP governors tat understand how that medicaid expansion would help out their states.

    3. Emergency surgeries weren't denied but his credit will be ruined. And that doesn't seem like a big deal til he goes out to try to buy a house or a car. The simple truth is he'd be better off if this were 2014 and he had insurance or was on medicaid.
    You keep harping on this Medicaid expansion, as being part of PPACA, but have yet to supply any link to substanciate it. I have shown you that in Texas, and I am sure many other states, that you must have dependents, be disabled or be a senior citizen to get any Medicaid benefits. I have also shown you that the PPACA law does not apply to anyone making under 100% (133% in some states) of the federal poverty level. 27 states have refused to play the PPACA exchange game yet you make it sound like all will get some benefit from PPACA.

    The U.S. Supreme Court’s ruling in June 2012 on the constitutionality of the PPACA allows individual states to opt out of expanding Medicaid under the law.
    “The reasonable man adapts himself to the world: the unreasonable one persists to adapt the world to himself.
    Therefore all progress depends on the unreasonable man.” ― George Bernard Shaw, Man and Superman

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    Re: Obamacare: Is a $2,000 deductible 'affordable?'

    Quote Originally Posted by ttwtt78640 View Post
    You keep harping on this Medicaid expansion, as being part of PPACA, but have yet to supply any link to substanciate it. I have shown you that in Texas, and I am sure many other states, that you must have dependents, be disabled or be a senior citizen to get any Medicaid benefits. I have also shown you that the PPACA law does not apply to anyone making under 100% (133% in some states) of the federal poverty level. 27 states have refused to play the PPACA exchange game yet you make it sound like all will get some benefit from PPACA.
    All that Congress or Obama can do is offer the expansion. If Texas is too retarded to take it, then fine. They'll take it down the road.

    Every source I can find shows that it applies to 133% over the poverty line. And you get subsidies up to 400% of the poverty line on s sliding scale.
    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    uh that is so small as to be stupid. Do you want registration? given less than 3% of criminals get their guns from private sales, its pretty much a waste of resources
    **Thirty Minutes Later**
    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    you are confused. I never denied that many criminals get guns in private sales.

  3. #413
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    Re: Obamacare: Is a $2,000 deductible 'affordable?'

    Quote Originally Posted by roughdraft274 View Post
    1. The healthcare bill was the most widely disseminated, widely studied bills that's ever passed.
    Rewriting history already? I as well as many people in this country remember all of the different stories about the bill when it was being written, and "disseminated" to the people...

    There are plenty of very large bills that pass every year that garner much less attention.
    And that is a problem with progressive legislation...Each proposed action to change the lives of Americans through legislating law, should be held out there on its own merit, IMO. Not hidden in these massive piles of legal language that the congresspeople don't even read.

    To act as though it was rushed through after over a year of debate is silly at best.
    It's not silly, it is what happened. Remember this....



    Or this:

    ABC News' Jonathan Karl reports: What does it take to get a wavering senator to vote for health care reform? Here’s a case study. On page 432 of the Reid bill, there is a section increasing federal Medicaid subsidies for “certain states recovering from a major disaster.” The section spends two pages defining which “states” would qualify, saying, among other things, that it would be states that “during the preceding 7 fiscal years” have been declared a “major disaster area.” I am told the section applies to exactly one state: Louisiana, the home of moderate Democrat Mary Landrieu, who has been playing hard to get on the health care bill. In other words, the bill spends two pages describing would could be written with a single world: Louisiana. (This may also help explain why the bill is long.) Senator Harry Reid, who drafted the bill, cannot pass it without the support of Louisiana’s Mary Landrieu. How much does it cost? According to the Congressional Budget Office: $100 million.

    The $100 Million Health Care Vote? - ABC News
    The President said while running for the office, that he wanted 72 hours for any bill to be online so that congress, and the people could read it fully and understand it before any vote happened...That didn't happen with Obamacare. it was passed on Christmas eve, near midnight along a pure party line vote, IOW rammed through.

    2. Yes, no republicans voted for it. That doesn't mean that they have to be ignorant and not make it better in the future. Look at all the GOP governors tat understand how that medicaid expansion would help out their states.
    Oh please. Liberal progressives passed this turd, now you try the old, why can't we polish it? You seem to be under the delusion that once passed it is set in stone....Hint, things change.

    3. Emergency surgeries weren't denied but his credit will be ruined. And that doesn't seem like a big deal til he goes out to try to buy a house or a car. The simple truth is he'd be better off if this were 2014 and he had insurance or was on medicaid.
    Again, not true...If he were to go bankrupt, which is unfortunately where many in his position end up, with the right decisions he could buy a house within 2 years, and in today's climate, a car in probably the same amount of time...And although his personal position would have been better off if everyone else paid for what he needed and absolved any responsibility of his, for his own incurred costs, but at the same time he would have been better off had he owned a catastrophic policy that would have covered this sort of thing...But then again, how would that have made others pay for him....
    Americans are so enamored of equality that they would rather be equal in slavery than unequal in freedom.

    Alexis de Tocqueville

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    Re: Obamacare: Is a $2,000 deductible 'affordable?'

    Quote Originally Posted by roughdraft274 View Post
    Yes, they get taken care of, but at least they've paid extra taxes to make up for the hospital losing money on their treatment.
    So really nothing changes from the current system, except maybe the person paid a $95 tax?
    There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences.
    P. J. O'Rourke

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    Re: Obamacare: Is a $2,000 deductible 'affordable?'

    Quote Originally Posted by Heebie Jeebie View Post
    So really nothing changes from the current system, except maybe the person paid a $95 tax?
    Have you ever actually read anything on the bill? Do you know anything about it?

    The 95$ fee is for low income people, and for the first year. After that the tax goes up and up every year. It reaches I think, 2.5% of your income at the end. But if your poor, you can be put on medicaid since it has been expanded under obamacare. And if you make below 400% of the poverty level you get subsidies, depending on what you make. So with the rising fee for not having insurance, and the fact that insurance will be subsidized and be easier to get, much more people will get it.
    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    uh that is so small as to be stupid. Do you want registration? given less than 3% of criminals get their guns from private sales, its pretty much a waste of resources
    **Thirty Minutes Later**
    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    you are confused. I never denied that many criminals get guns in private sales.

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    Re: Obamacare: Is a $2,000 deductible 'affordable?'

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    Rewriting history already? I as well as many people in this country remember all of the different stories about the bill when it was being written, and "disseminated" to the people...
    That's not rewriting history. It was widely debated in every little detail. You can't deny reality.
    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    uh that is so small as to be stupid. Do you want registration? given less than 3% of criminals get their guns from private sales, its pretty much a waste of resources
    **Thirty Minutes Later**
    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    you are confused. I never denied that many criminals get guns in private sales.

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    Re: Obamacare: Is a $2,000 deductible 'affordable?'

    Quote Originally Posted by roughdraft274 View Post
    Have you ever actually read anything on the bill? Do you know anything about it?
    Most of it but not all. How aobut you, gotten past page 10 yet?

    So you are saying that for someone who is not insured and is below the subsidy threshold nothing will change regarding how they receive treatment if they do not have insurance when they get sick? And we needed to put this idiotic system in place to do the same thing that was already being done?
    There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences.
    P. J. O'Rourke

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    Re: Obamacare: Is a $2,000 deductible 'affordable?'

    Quote Originally Posted by Heebie Jeebie View Post
    Most of it but not all. How aobut you, gotten past page 10 yet?

    So you are saying that for someone who is not insured and is below the subsidy threshold nothing will change regarding how they receive treatment if they do not have insurance when they get sick? And we needed to put this idiotic system in place to do the same thing that was already being done?
    I didn't ask have you read the bill. I asked have you read anything on the bill. Kind of proves my point. You're foaming at the mouth so much that you can't bother yourself to read what I've written.

    And if you're below the threshold for subsidies then you will be put on medicaid as the bill is written with the medicaid expansion. A number of states are still fighting the medicaid expansion, but that's their problem. You can lead a horse to water as they say. Nothing will change how they receive care, but if you can get subsidized health insurance or pay an extra tax at the end of the year, and the insurance will prevent you from going bankrupt or ruining your credit down the road should you get really sick, it's a no brainer.

    You're pretending that the bill because the original problem will be there. The problem with your argument is that the problem that stays is now a fraction of the size that it used to be. It greatly reduces the problem.
    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    uh that is so small as to be stupid. Do you want registration? given less than 3% of criminals get their guns from private sales, its pretty much a waste of resources
    **Thirty Minutes Later**
    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    you are confused. I never denied that many criminals get guns in private sales.

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    Re: Obamacare: Is a $2,000 deductible 'affordable?'

    Quote Originally Posted by roughdraft274 View Post
    I didn't ask have you read the bill. I asked have you read anything on the bill. Kind of proves my point. You're foaming at the mouth so much that you can't bother yourself to read what I've written.
    So you prefer to read about the bill as opposed to reading the bill to get your info? Figures.

    No people who receive subsidies are not automatically put on Medicaid. Perhaps you should read about different parts of the bill instead of foaming on about how others don't anything about the bill.

    The end result will be the same, people who don't have insurance will get treatment just like they do now. Get the foam out of your ears and try to keep up.
    There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences.
    P. J. O'Rourke

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    Re: Obamacare: Is a $2,000 deductible 'affordable?'

    Quote Originally Posted by Heebie Jeebie View Post
    1.(So you prefer to read about the bill as opposed to reading the bill to get your info? Figures.

    2.)No people who receive subsidies are not automatically put on Medicaid. Perhaps you should read about different parts of the bill instead of foaming on about how others don't anything about the bill.
    Good lord...

    1. Yes, it's better to read up on many different sources about the bill than actually read the bill. I'm not a lawyer and if I were to go through the bill I probably wouldn't understand the majority of it. I also didn't read my mortgage before I signed it or the full contract for my life insurance before I signed it. I trusted my realitor and lender and my insurance agent and did as much research I could before hand. That's just the truth.

    2. I never said that people that are on subsidies are on medicaid. Here is what I typed:
    "And if you're below the threshold for subsidies then you will be put on medicaid as the bill is written with the medicaid expansion."

    So if you are below a certain level, you qualify for medicaid. If you are above that level then you buy your own insurance and qualify for subsidies unless you make over 400% of the poverty level.
    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    uh that is so small as to be stupid. Do you want registration? given less than 3% of criminals get their guns from private sales, its pretty much a waste of resources
    **Thirty Minutes Later**
    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    you are confused. I never denied that many criminals get guns in private sales.

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