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Thread: Obamacare: Is a $2,000 deductible 'affordable?'

  1. #401
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    Re: Obamacare: Is a $2,000 deductible 'affordable?'

    Quote Originally Posted by ttwtt78640 View Post
    True enough. That being said, the bottom line remains the same; someome living in fear of the high cost of medical care (low income - like myself) is better off (financially) paying for their needed medical care out of pocket, and doing all in their power to stay healthy, rather than being forced to pay 2% of their income (off the top) plus up to $6K in added out of pocket costs. I spend about $15 for my monthly blood work and medicine and about $50 every three months for a doctor visit, or $380/year, much less than the cost of what any PPACA insurance plan would cost me even if my added out of pocket costs were then slightly reduced for the doctor visits.
    They would only be better off if they were too stupid to understand that health care costs aren't a constant thing. Just because you are currently paying 380 a year, it doesn't mean it will remain at that point. It differs ear to year. You have no idea if you are going to go to the hospital next week, need an x-ray etc. At which point that health insurance will seem like a good deal.

    Your entire plan is based off the idea that you don't make enough to afford health insurance, and that if you get majorly sick you can just go to the emergency room and you don't HAVE to pay the bills, it's just bad credit. Libertarian? Hardly. Sounds more like one of those mooching liberals that your side is always screaming about.
    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    uh that is so small as to be stupid. Do you want registration? given less than 3% of criminals get their guns from private sales, its pretty much a waste of resources
    **Thirty Minutes Later**
    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    you are confused. I never denied that many criminals get guns in private sales.

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    Re: Obamacare: Is a $2,000 deductible 'affordable?'

    Quote Originally Posted by roughdraft274 View Post
    They would only be better off if they were too stupid to understand that health care costs aren't a constant thing. Just because you are currently paying 380 a year, it doesn't mean it will remain at that point. It differs ear to year. You have no idea if you are going to go to the hospital next week, need an x-ray etc. At which point that health insurance will seem like a good deal.

    Your entire plan is based off the idea that you don't make enough to afford health insurance, and that if you get majorly sick you can just go to the emergency room and you don't HAVE to pay the bills, it's just bad credit. Libertarian? Hardly. Sounds more like one of those mooching liberals that your side is always screaming about.
    Ah! But that is the beauty of PPACA. I cannot be turned away should I choose to buy an exchange policy at any time. I can then simply bop on down to the federal PPACA exchange (or mybe just apply online) and get a "gold plan" whenever I feel the need, get the required expensive treatment that I desire and then cancel the policy. Once you have removed that pesky "pre-existing condition barrier" (gone as of 1/1/2014) there is no reason not to do so. Mooching liberals want the gov't to do the subsidizing, but who needs a subsidy for 2 months of medical insurance premiums per year? That newfound ability to "rent" medical care insurance for a short term, in and of itself, is an 84% discount, is it not?
    “The reasonable man adapts himself to the world: the unreasonable one persists to adapt the world to himself.
    Therefore all progress depends on the unreasonable man.” ― George Bernard Shaw, Man and Superman

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    Re: Obamacare: Is a $2,000 deductible 'affordable?'

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    I didn't say there was going to be one. I said we'd adjust. The retirements are not that huge a problem as they are too few. But with moves towards using other providers and encouraging more doctors, we will adjust. I think your mistake is thinking it is static. Instead, it is a fluid situation.
    So then tell me Joe, How are you going to entice new doc's into the field when their education alone is a mountain of debt for them, and once they get out of school, residency, and all that goes into becoming a doc, they are told that they have to accept the low rates that the government masters dictate?
    ...
    Answer: They'll become engineers, or lawyers instead
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    Re: Obamacare: Is a $2,000 deductible 'affordable?'

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    So then tell me Joe, How are you going to entice new doc's into the field when their education alone is a mountain of debt for them, and once they get out of school, residency, and all that goes into becoming a doc, they are told that they have to accept the low rates that the government masters dictate?
    ...
    Answer: They'll become engineers, or lawyers instead
    Oh, don't exaggerate. They are not going to go broke. They're aren't even going to notice a significant change. I think my brother-law said he'd likely go from 300 k to 298 k. I don't know how he'll survive. Btw, he paid his loans off rather fast with the money he was making.

    Hell, they would possibly even do better if we went single payer. Doctors enjoy good livings nearly everywhere.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

  5. #405
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    Re: Obamacare: Is a $2,000 deductible 'affordable?'

    Quote Originally Posted by ttwtt78640 View Post
    Ah! But that is the beauty of PPACA. I cannot be turned away should I choose to buy an exchange policy at any time. I can then simply bop on down to the federal PPACA exchange (or mybe just apply online) and get a "gold plan" whenever I feel the need, get the required expensive treatment that I desire and then cancel the policy. Once you have removed that pesky "pre-existing condition barrier" (gone as of 1/1/2014) there is no reason not to do so. Mooching liberals want the gov't to do the subsidizing, but who needs a subsidy for 2 months of medical insurance premiums per year? That newfound ability to "rent" medical care insurance for a short term, in and of itself, is an 84% discount, is it not?
    As I've pointed out numerous times, how would you go and sign up for health insurance while in the back of an ambulance? It's a stupid argument. Yes people could wait unitl they are sick to get insurance, and if too many people do that then we'll have to bump up the penalty for not buying to counteract that effect. And even then that only prevents you from paying for something that can wait. It won't protect you from paying for emergency services.

    You live in a fairy tail if you actually believe the crap your spewing.
    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    uh that is so small as to be stupid. Do you want registration? given less than 3% of criminals get their guns from private sales, its pretty much a waste of resources
    **Thirty Minutes Later**
    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    you are confused. I never denied that many criminals get guns in private sales.

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    Re: Obamacare: Is a $2,000 deductible 'affordable?'

    Quote Originally Posted by roughdraft274 View Post
    As I've pointed out numerous times, how would you go and sign up for health insurance while in the back of an ambulance? It's a stupid argument. Yes people could wait unitl they are sick to get insurance, and if too many people do that then we'll have to bump up the penalty for not buying to counteract that effect. And even then that only prevents you from paying for something that can wait. It won't protect you from paying for emergency services.

    You live in a fairy tail if you actually believe the crap your spewing.

    I see that you have plans for PPACA part two even before it has taken effect.

    BTW just who is included in "we'll"? PPACA received no support of any Republican in congress, and the Medicaid expansion mandate portion was rejected outright by the SCOTUS as balckmailing the states. Perhaps you dream of some transformation to UHC, but that is not what PPACA is or ever will be. Face it that PPACA was cobbled together in an extreme rush to get it passed when the make-up of congress allowed it. Much of it was written long after the initial bill (largely unread) was passed.

    Ask "your friend" if he/she was denied needed emergency services or if they feel that their life's credit is now ruined. Most poor folks have neither a decent chance at getting credit nor the expectation of using it. Lack of money/assets is all it takes prevent actually paying for any emergency medical care received, with or without PPACA or Medicaid.
    “The reasonable man adapts himself to the world: the unreasonable one persists to adapt the world to himself.
    Therefore all progress depends on the unreasonable man.” ― George Bernard Shaw, Man and Superman

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    Re: Obamacare: Is a $2,000 deductible 'affordable?'

    Quote Originally Posted by roughdraft274 View Post
    As I've pointed out numerous times, how would you go and sign up for health insurance while in the back of an ambulance? It's a stupid argument. Yes people could wait unitl they are sick to get insurance, and if too many people do that then we'll have to bump up the penalty for not buying to counteract that effect. And even then that only prevents you from paying for something that can wait. It won't protect you from paying for emergency services.

    You live in a fairy tail if you actually believe the crap your spewing.
    So what happens to the person who doesn't buy health insurance and gets sick? Do they get taken care of anyway or do we just leave them to die?
    There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences.
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  8. #408
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    Re: Obamacare: Is a $2,000 deductible 'affordable?'

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    Oh, don't exaggerate. They are not going to go broke. They're aren't even going to notice a significant change. I think my brother-law said he'd likely go from 300 k to 298 k. I don't know how he'll survive. Btw, he paid his loans off rather fast with the money he was making.

    Hell, they would possibly even do better if we went single payer. Doctors enjoy good livings nearly everywhere.
    Well, I am happy for your Bro in Law....But, contrary to his anecdotal, and my guess less than genuine proclamation of dropping only $2k off some substantial salary he is making, or making up, I have supplied you with many articles, studies, and government based predictive tools that show that the rate of incoming doctors to general practice is way down, and of those doctors currently practicing many are likely to get out when this ramps up....Thus, leaving a shortage.

    Now you try to shrug it off because your brother in law, whom may or may not exist, supposedly tells you that all is well so you say, eh, it's true because he said so? Get outta here.....
    Americans are so enamored of equality that they would rather be equal in slavery than unequal in freedom.

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  9. #409
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    Re: Obamacare: Is a $2,000 deductible 'affordable?'

    Quote Originally Posted by ttwtt78640 View Post
    I see that you have plans for PPACA part two even before it has taken effect.

    BTW just who is included in "we'll"? PPACA received no support of any Republican in congress, and the Medicaid expansion mandate portion was rejected outright by the SCOTUS as balckmailing the states. Perhaps you dream of some transformation to UHC, but that is not what PPACA is or ever will be. Face it that PPACA was cobbled together in an extreme rush to get it passed when the make-up of congress allowed it. Much of it was written long after the initial bill (largely unread) was passed.

    Ask "your friend" if he/she was denied needed emergency services or if they feel that their life's credit is now ruined. Most poor folks have neither a decent chance at getting credit nor the expectation of using it. Lack of money/assets is all it takes prevent actually paying for any emergency medical care received, with or without PPACA or Medicaid.
    1. The healthcare bill was the most widely disseminated, widely studied bills that's ever passed. There are plenty of very large bills that pass every year that garner much less attention. To act as though it was rushed through after over a year of debate is silly at best.

    2. Yes, no republicans voted for it. That doesn't mean that they have to be ignorant and not make it better in the future. Look at all the GOP governors tat understand how that medicaid expansion would help out their states.

    3. Emergency surgeries weren't denied but his credit will be ruined. And that doesn't seem like a big deal til he goes out to try to buy a house or a car. The simple truth is he'd be better off if this were 2014 and he had insurance or was on medicaid.
    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    uh that is so small as to be stupid. Do you want registration? given less than 3% of criminals get their guns from private sales, its pretty much a waste of resources
    **Thirty Minutes Later**
    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    you are confused. I never denied that many criminals get guns in private sales.

  10. #410
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    Re: Obamacare: Is a $2,000 deductible 'affordable?'

    Quote Originally Posted by Heebie Jeebie View Post
    So what happens to the person who doesn't buy health insurance and gets sick? Do they get taken care of anyway or do we just leave them to die?
    Where have I ever argued to change the current law and let people die?

    Yes, they get taken care of, but at least they've paid extra taxes to make up for the hospital losing money on their treatment.
    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    uh that is so small as to be stupid. Do you want registration? given less than 3% of criminals get their guns from private sales, its pretty much a waste of resources
    **Thirty Minutes Later**
    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    you are confused. I never denied that many criminals get guns in private sales.

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