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Thread: Obamacare: Is a $2,000 deductible 'affordable?'

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    Re: Obamacare: Is a $2,000 deductible 'affordable?'

    Quote Originally Posted by Neomalthusian View Post
    The health insurance system, public and private, created the cost problem by enabling too much access. Access to other people's money allows costs to rise because people don't care what the cost is. Providing even more access is counterproductive at this stage of the game.
    What is too much access? How many fires put out is too many? How many crimes solved or people protected us too many? Health care had a bleed over effect on all of us, and it is something all people need sooner or later. You said we didn't have an access issue. I showed we did. Your not really addressing the point.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Obamacare: Is a $2,000 deductible 'affordable?'

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    What is too much access? How many fires put out is too many? How many crimes solved or people protected us too many? Health care had a bleed over effect on all of us, and it is something all people need sooner or later.
    The only reason it has a bleed over effect is because of the way the system entitles people to outside funds to provide for their medical care. That's the bleed over.

    You said we didn't have an access issue. I showed we did. Your not really addressing the point.
    The point is that access is a problem because there's too much of it and has been for decades. Too much access allows costs to rise until eventually it festers so bad that it all catches up to us.

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    Re: Obamacare: Is a $2,000 deductible 'affordable?'

    Quote Originally Posted by Neomalthusian View Post
    The only reason it has a bleed over effect is because of the way the system entitles people to outside funds to provide for their medical care. That's the bleed over.



    The point is that access is a problem because there's too much of it and has been for decades. Too much access allows costs to rise until eventually it festers so bad that it all catches up to us.
    Wring again. If we simply refused to treat those who can pay, there illnesses. And decaying health would bleed over in others. One way or another, the health of the community effects more than just the individual who can't pay.


    Again, I ask you to define too much. I can't respond without knowing how you're defining too much.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: Obamacare: Is a $2,000 deductible 'affordable?'

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    Yes, more access means less choice. That's logical.
    That's but one of the lies.
    Americans are so enamored of equality that they would rather be equal in slavery than unequal in freedom.

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    Re: Obamacare: Is a $2,000 deductible 'affordable?'

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    That's but one of the lies.
    Really, more people covered isn't greater access? Who knew.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: Obamacare: Is a $2,000 deductible 'affordable?'

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    Really, more people covered isn't greater access? Who knew.
    When you don't have additional access points, no, access is not greater, it is reduced. Think funnel effect.
    Building block or stumbling block.... choose.

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    Re: Obamacare: Is a $2,000 deductible 'affordable?'

    Quote Originally Posted by GottaGo View Post
    When you don't have additional access points, no, access is not greater, it is reduced. Think funnel effect.
    Not true. Say there was only 1 access point. But before only x number could gain access there, but we double the number who can now access, access would be greater. Even in a funnel. However, I think if we did a count, you'd find there really are more access points.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: Obamacare: Is a $2,000 deductible 'affordable?'

    Quote Originally Posted by roughdraft274 View Post
    It's insurance. You can't just look at a single year and say "see you're over paying!" Because then you overlook that one year where you needed emergency surgery with a short stay in the ICU, where you shelled out a few thousand but didn't have to pay the other hundred thousand dollars of your bill. Do you really not understand that or are you being intentionally thick headed?
    That "emergency" care cannot be denied whether you have insurance or not. If you are wealthy, only then is that major a concern, otherwise they write off the bad debt just as they now do and your credit rating still sucks.
    “The reasonable man adapts himself to the world: the unreasonable one persists to adapt the world to himself.
    Therefore all progress depends on the unreasonable man.” ― George Bernard Shaw, Man and Superman

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    Re: Obamacare: Is a $2,000 deductible 'affordable?'

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    Not true. Say there was only 1 access point. But before only x number could gain access there, but we double the number who can now access, access would be greater. Even in a funnel. However, I think if we did a count, you'd find there really are more access points.
    Simplified example:

    If you start with 100 people going to a doctor per week, over the period of 5 days, he/she is seeing 20 people per day, about a half an hour per patient, with an hour break for lunch.

    Suddenly, there are now 200 patients, which only allows 15 per patient. Access has been reduced.

    They haven't opened up any clinics, hospitals or increased the number of GPs to handle the influx. Have you tried recently to get an appointment with a GP? 4 week wait, minimum in my area, even with an infection.
    Building block or stumbling block.... choose.

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    Re: Obamacare: Is a $2,000 deductible 'affordable?'

    Quote Originally Posted by GottaGo View Post
    Simplified example:

    If you start with 100 people going to a doctor per week, over the period of 5 days, he/she is seeing 20 people per day, about a half an hour per patient, with an hour break for lunch.

    Suddenly, there are now 200 patients, which only allows 15 per patient. Access has been reduced.

    They haven't opened up any clinics, hospitals or increased the number of GPs to handle the influx. Have you tried recently to get an appointment with a GP? 4 week wait, minimum in my area, even with an infection.
    You assume constant numbers. Two things will prevent that: 1) more creative use of personnel which has already begun, and 2) increasing the physician pool, which the legislation encourages and demand will push along.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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