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Thread: Former IRS chief Shulman reportedly visited White House at least 157 times [W:243]

  1. #211
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    Re: Former IRS chief Shulman reportedly visited White House at least 157 times

    Quote Originally Posted by pbrauer View Post
    I'm not inside their heads, so I don't know the answer to any of those questions. Why do innocent people confess to crimes they didn't commit? Whether any of us like it, it's the job of the IRS to prevent fraud. How exactly were Republicans / conservatives impacted y what happened?
    If this came out when it was first known it might have had an effect on the election.
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    Re: Former IRS chief Shulman reportedly visited White House at least 157 times

    Quote Originally Posted by azgreg View Post
    If this came out when it was first known it might have had an effect on the election.
    I doubt that very much, the IRS is hated by everyone.

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    Re: Former IRS chief Shulman reportedly visited White House at least 157 times

    Quote Originally Posted by pbrauer View Post
    I doubt that very much, the IRS is hated by everyone.
    You're living in denial

    Ofcourse the IRS being used by the corrupt Obama Administration like the Gestapo to target Obama's political enemies had an effect on the election. It's why Obama managed to get elected. A lot of the grass roots opposition against him was effectively sidelined by his fascist goons during the campaign. This allowed him to use resources that otherwise would have been spent countering such groups on campaign blitzes during the summer trashing Romney as some evil dog murdering tax cheat.

    The Left have sold their souls to Obama. They shamelessly try to defend and rationalize fascism. It's disgusting.

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    Re: Former IRS chief Shulman reportedly visited White House at least 157 times

    Quote Originally Posted by Bronson View Post
    You're living in denial

    Ofcourse the IRS being used by the corrupt Obama Administration like the Gestapo to target Obama's political enemies had an effect on the election. It's why Obama managed to get elected. A lot of the grass roots opposition against him was effectively sidelined by his fascist goons during the campaign. This allowed him to use resources that otherwise would have been spent countering such groups on campaign blitzes during the summer trashing Romney as some evil dog murdering tax cheat.

    The Left have sold their souls to Obama. They shamelessly try to defend and rationalize fascism. It's disgusting.
    :

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    Re: Former IRS chief Shulman reportedly visited White House at least 157 times

    Quote Originally Posted by pbrauer View Post
    I'm not inside their heads, so I don't know the answer to any of those questions.
    So, when you bring up all these insinuations that the IRS did nothing wrong, you refuse to consider those statements, and facts that show that they did anything wrong....

    Why do innocent people confess to crimes they didn't commit?
    So, you do think that the IRS did nothing wrong in ideologically targeting political opponents. This is why we have been saying that progressives like you are dangerous to the country.

    Whether any of us like it, it's the job of the IRS to prevent fraud.
    This is a fine example of why the tax code as it exists now needs to be tossed for a flat tax.

    How exactly were Republicans / conservatives impacted by what happened?
    How? You're kidding right? Did you watch any of the testimony yesterday be these various groups? Intimidation, harassment, potential donors scared off for fear of their personal, and business information being made public to political opponents, etc...IOW, true disenfranchisement....

    But, you've already stated it pretty clearly Pete, you don't see anything wrong with that as long as it is happening to people you hate. How sad.
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    Re: Former IRS chief Shulman reportedly visited White House at least 157 times

    The question that far too many are failing to ask: Did the IRS 'target' other, non-conservative groups? The record seems to say YES

    IRS Has History of Extra Scrutiny of Groups - WSJ.com
    The Internal Revenue Service unit under fire for its reviews of conservative organizations has a long history of targeting groups with extra scrutiny, including foreclosure-assistance charities, credit-counseling services and New York Jewish charities, interviews with current and former employees show.

    The scrutiny has included such tactics as listening to telephone calls between groups and their clients, according to one group's lawyer. In the case of tea-party organizations, IRS officials studied social-media postings to gauge political activity.

    Sometimes the tactic of extra scrutiny for particular kinds of groups seeking tax exemptions helped manage a flood of entities in areas where abuse was common; other times it snagged innocent parties, subjected applicants to long delays and even made IRS employees feel uncomfortable.
    It does certainly look like some of those who are shouting the loudest today about IRS oppression, may need to begin hiring attorneys for defense against charges of violating the federal regs governing 501(C)(4) tax exemptions
    Groups Targeted by I.R.S. Tested Rules on Politics
    When CVFC, a conservative veterans’ group in California, applied for tax-exempt status with the Internal Revenue Service, its biggest expenditure that year was several thousand dollars in radio ads backing a Republican candidate for Congress.

    The Wetumpka Tea Party, from Alabama, sponsored training for a get-out-the-vote initiative dedicated to the “defeat of President Barack Obama” while the I.R.S. was weighing its application.

    <snip>

    Representatives of these organizations have cried foul in recent weeks about their treatment by the I.R.S., saying they were among dozens of conservative groups unfairly targeted by the agency

    But a close examination of these groups and others reveals an array of election activities that tax experts and former I.R.S. officials said would provide a legitimate basis for flagging them for closer review.

    “Money is not the only thing that matters,” said Donald B. Tobin, a former lawyer with the Justice Department’s tax division who is a law professor at Ohio State University. “While some of the I.R.S. questions may have been overbroad, you can look at some of these groups and understand why these questions were being asked.”
    Testimony from the Inspector General does call out some employees for doing a poor job but in some instances, the poor job was because they didn't do enough questioning.

    Republican Hearings Backfire As IRS Testifies That More Groups Need To Be Investigated
    The lesson Republicans should have taken from Monday’s IRS hearings is “be careful what you wish for.” One of the recommendations based on the audit is “to conduct a review to assess how the IRS monitors I.R.C. sections 501(c)(4)(6) organizations to ensure that political campaign intervention does not constitute their primary activity.” On top of that, the audit revealed that there were many groups whose political intervention in campaigns should have flagged them for a review.

    The Honorable J. Russell George, Treasury Inspector General for Tax Administration, testified Monday in a House Appropriations Subcommittee on Financial Services and General Government hearing on the IRS “scandal”. George based his testimony on an audit in which they found a few things that don’t bode well for conservatives’ “social welfare groups”, since they outspent liberals 34-1 via nonprofits on political issues. Namely, the IRS needs to investigate more of these groups that are “intervening” in political campaigns, not less.

    <snip>

    George explained that of the 296 cases singled out for review, the majority had indications of significant political campaign intervention. 91 cases did not (31%). Of those 91, only 17 involved Tea Party, Patriots, or 9/12 groups.

    The rest were “targeted” but were not Tea Party/Patriot/9/12 groups.

    <snip>

    Furthermore, nearly three-quarters of the groups “targeted” for inspection were not identified as opponents of the White House, so that blows the idea of being targeted for being a political enemy out of the water.

    It was also pointed out that 3,357 applications were made in 2012 compared with 1,735 in 2010, before Citizens United.

    George mentioned that inappropriate criteria were used by agents in Ohio, due to a lack of oversight, which was attributable to human challenges (read: lack of funding, and thank a Republican).

    The recommendations make the gist of the issue clear. This is not a political scandal, this is a government agency that is understaffed and underfunded, tasked with dealing with a huge influx of “social welfare” groups seeking tax exempt status post Citizens United. These groups were often intervening in political campaigns. The IRS workers were unclear as to how much political work these groups could be doing and still qualify as non profits.
    I hope readers notice that ever so insignificant bit about "three-quarters of the groups targeted . . . were not dentified as opponents of the White House"
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    Re: Former IRS chief Shulman reportedly visited White House at least 157 times

    Quote Originally Posted by Erod View Post
    Just chatting about the NCAA tournament, eh Mr. President?
    Do you really think it would take 157 visits for Obama to tell him to go after tea party groups? Lol.

    This argument, that we must assume wrong doing based on many visits, is dumb at best.
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    uh that is so small as to be stupid. Do you want registration? given less than 3% of criminals get their guns from private sales, its pretty much a waste of resources
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    you are confused. I never denied that many criminals get guns in private sales.

  8. #218
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    Re: Former IRS chief Shulman reportedly visited White House at least 157 times

    We have cell phones now days too. I think 157 is funny too. It kinda goes without saying.
    Quote Originally Posted by roughdraft274 View Post
    Do you really think it would take 157 visits for Obama to tell him to go after tea party groups? Lol.

    This argument, that we must assume wrong doing based on many visits, is dumb at best.
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    Re: Former IRS chief Shulman reportedly visited White House at least 157 times

    Quote Originally Posted by Bronson View Post
    You're living in denial

    Ofcourse the IRS being used by the corrupt Obama Administration like the Gestapo to target Obama's political enemies had an effect on the election. It's why Obama managed to get elected. A lot of the grass roots opposition against him was effectively sidelined by his fascist goons during the campaign. This allowed him to use resources that otherwise would have been spent countering such groups on campaign blitzes during the summer trashing Romney as some evil dog murdering tax cheat.

    The Left have sold their souls to Obama. They shamelessly try to defend and rationalize fascism. It's disgusting.
    I agree..

    Also I think the typical progressive IMO is ignorant, brainwashed or stubborn. I wouldn't hold those opinions if they were baseless.

    The communists were quite clear on how they managed to obtain an authoritarian socioeconomic socialist model and which tactics they used to obtain their Animal Farm.

    Presently we're in the desensitization process - government is good, the government gives some of us free stuff - anyone who opposes is bad.

    I suppose getting free stuff from one party is enough to hate the opposition and enough to trust the hand that feeds you?

    In short our present government is like the really nice stranger in the park that gives kids candy and gives them rides to school in his nice big brown 1979 G-van with tinted windows and progressives are the "kids" that take the candy and go for a ride to Wally World.

  10. #220
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    Re: Former IRS chief Shulman reportedly visited White House at least 157 times

    Quote Originally Posted by pbrauer View Post
    LOL, this might be one of the few times
    when the GOP criticizes people for doing their job. It's unreal.

    IRS tax scandal in US: new evidence undermines political bias claims | World news | guardian.co.uk

    Nearly three-quarters of the political groups subjected to extra tax inspection during a recent IRS scandal were not identifiably opponents of the White House, officials have revealed.

    Republicans have called for a special prosecutor to investigate what they call "attacks on American democracy" after it emerged that rightwing groups were singled out for special treatment by the Inland Revenue Service.

    But in testimony before Congress, two senior civil servants brought in to clean up after the affair gave evidence that suggests the reality may have been more complex than a simple case of political bias.

    The IRS office in Cincinnati which decides whether to exempt such groups from income tax singled out 72 of them for scrutiny because they were openly affiliated with the Tea Party movement, together with 24 others whose names included associated labels such as "patriot".

    To qualify for tax exempt status such groups have to show they are not directly backing a political candidate but they are allowed to campaign on general "civic issues".

    However a further 226 other political groups were also placed in the same review whose affiliations were not immediately apparent from their name alone, which is often the case among liberal campaign groups. It remains unknown how many of these were in fact Democrat-leaning groups, partly because individual names cannot be publicly released under IRS confidentiality laws.
    It was the IRS's job to
    illegally release donor information ?

    I mean why would the IRS APOLOGIZE for doing their job ?

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