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Thread: Lt. gov. nominee Jackson says ‘no apologies’ for past comments on gays, abortion

  1. #91
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    Re: Lt. gov. nominee Jackson says ‘no apologies’ for past comments on gays, abortion

    Quote Originally Posted by Amadeus View Post
    So the problem is actually very minimal is what you're saying, since we've established that lazy make up a small portion of welfare recipients.
    No, you established this "small portion" not me. Let me ask you, should someone who is able to work but is too lazy to actually do it be fed and cared for by those who do?

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    Re: Lt. gov. nominee Jackson says ‘no apologies’ for past comments on gays, abortion

    Quote Originally Posted by Texmex View Post
    No, you established this "small portion" not me. Let me ask you, should someone who is able to work but is too lazy to actually do it be fed and cared for by those who do?
    I'm not making that argument, and it's not my place to decide who is eligible for welfare.

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    Re: Lt. gov. nominee Jackson says ‘no apologies’ for past comments on gays, abortion

    Quote Originally Posted by Amadeus View Post
    I'm not making that argument, and it's not my place to decide who is eligible for welfare.
    I bet you were a dodge ball camp back in school.

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    Re: Lt. gov. nominee Jackson says ‘no apologies’ for past comments on gays, abortion

    Quote Originally Posted by Texmex View Post
    No, you established this "small portion" not me. Let me ask you, should someone who is able to work but is too lazy to actually do it be fed and cared for by those who do?
    Welfare requires people who are able to work to work or they lose their benefits

    Most people on welfare are children
    Quote Originally Posted by matchlight View Post
    Justice Thomas' opinions consistently contain precise, detailed constitutional analyses.
    Quote Originally Posted by jaeger19 View Post
    the vast majority of folks that need healthcare are on Medicare.. both rich and poor..

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    Re: Lt. gov. nominee Jackson says ‘no apologies’ for past comments on gays, abortion

    Quote Originally Posted by Texmex View Post
    I bet you were a dodge ball camp back in school.
    I said I wasn't making that argument. Would you like me to type slower?

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    Re: Lt. gov. nominee Jackson says ‘no apologies’ for past comments on gays, abortion

    Quote Originally Posted by nota bene View Post
    What it has to do with is daring to be both black and conservative. This cannot be allowed.

    Nothing wrong with being both black and conservative.
    But neither of those gives him licence to be an jerk about gays.
    That's some pretty mean things he's said about them.

    I'm a black card carrying member of the G.O.P,and I find his remarks about gays to be unprofessional,and yes , reprehensible.
    But that's just my opinion.
    I have a gay daughter.
    But I also understand that he has a right to his opinions.
    But if I lived in Virginia I wouldn't probably would vote for the guy if I thought there were other better candidates.
    I don't have to vote for a candidate just because he's black, now do I?

    Jackson seems a little too conservative for for my tastes.
    I prefer my candidates to be more concerned with fixing the economy the fixing the "gay problem".
    Let them gays married so we can move on to creating jobs.
    Maybe it's just my opinion,but I think is more important that people like Bob and Joe have good jobs and contribute to our economy,rather than preventing Bob and Joe from getting married.

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    Re: Lt. gov. nominee Jackson says ‘no apologies’ for past comments on gays, abortion

    Quote Originally Posted by Fisher View Post
    Sure, the op is constantly trying to denigrate the BLACK Va Lt. Governor nominee with slavery quotes because he a republican who doesn't tow the PC line and I am the one playing the race card; and nice to assume that all Christians would agree with him--that is so open-minded of you
    Really dude?

    Just give up.
    He touched her over her bra and underpants, she says, and guided her hand to touch him over his underwear
    Quote Originally Posted by Lutherf View Post
    We’ll say what? Something like “nothing happened” ... Yeah, we might say something like that.

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    Re: Lt. gov. nominee Jackson says ‘no apologies’ for past comments on gays, abortion

    Quote Originally Posted by Kal'Stang View Post
    Not to defend this guy or what he says but...why should he have to apologize? Those are his views and he has a right to stick to them. Just as you have your own views and you have a right to stick to them also. Would you apologize for something that you believed in? If not then why the hell should this guy? And whether they are right or wrong to you is of no consequence and irrelevent. I would hope that you would at least recognize that this person, and every other person on this planet has a right to their views and calling him a "demented fool" just shows that you are being no better than what you are trying to claim him as. Remember, whenever you point a finger at someone you have 3 more fingers pointing at you.
    I think he should not be Lt Governor is the point, and those who vote for him are no better. Sorry, but hate grounded in religion is still hate. No free pass.

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    Re: Lt. gov. nominee Jackson says ‘no apologies’ for past comments on gays, abortion

    Quote Originally Posted by Bronson View Post
    Homosexuality was diagnosed as a mental disorder and part of the DSM criteria until it was removed for political reasons
    This is completely untrue. I JUST posted the information that completely debunks this idiotic and untrue position less than 2 weeks ago. I suppose I will now need to do it again.

    Dispelling the myth of Pro-Gay Politicizing of the APA
    Reproduced, with permission from CaptainCourtesy

    Part I

    Homosexuality has been seen in a negative light for centuries. Early on, it was completely due to the interpretation of Bible passages and because of religious and moral beliefs. Genesis's description of "Sodom" coined the word "sodomy" which by the 18th century, came to describe an act that the Church saw as "unnatural' or "crimes against nature". Homosexuality, bestiality, masturbation, oral and anal sex were all included in this definition. There was zero research or evidence that any homosexual was disordered in any way. This was a moral stance, completely baseless in empirical evidence. No substance, just value judgements.

    Karl Westphal, a German physician, was one of the first medical professionals to examine homosexuals, observationally. He concluded from these observations that homosexuality was a "condition "contrary sexual sensation" and claimed it was congenital. As such, he argued, it should come under psychiatric care rather then legal prosecution." He was the first, I believe, to argue that gays should be looked at as having a disorder. Note, this was based, purely on observation and his own theory and beliefs, probably based on the attitudes of the time (19th Century). No research was done. Jean-Martin Charcot, a teacher of Freud's and considered the founder of modern neurology, considered homosexuality to be a hysteric disorder, which, translated to 21st century vernacular, would be a psychiatric ailment. Charcot based this belief on the, at the time, widely accepted theory of "hereditary degeneration". This was a theory, expoused by Benedict Augustin Morel in the 19th Century. It is somewhat technical, but the essence of the theory is that any issue or disease that was deemed incurable, would be degenerative through heredity and damage future generations. Tuberculosis, hysteria, homosexuality, alcoholism, and cretinism were all issues that Morel determined were heredity based, untreatable, and those who had these issues should be placed in assylums and prevented from reproducing. Again, there was no research or evidence into any of these claims. Looking at the list of issue, we know now that this theory is ridiculous, but based on Morel's morals and the lack of knowledge about medicine and heredity at the time. Interestingly enough, the Nazi's used some of Morel's theories to justify placing Jews in concentration camps.

    In the 20th Century,Richard von Krafft-Ebing and Havelock Ellis' theories of sexual inversion, the belief that "homosexuality was an inborn reversal of gender traits. Interestingly enough, early on, Krafft-Ebing saw homosexuality as a severe hereditary degeneration (see above), but as he met more homosexuals, he saw it as a normal sexual varient, and not a disorder. Ellis also felt this way.

    No discussion of psychology can be conducted without discussing Sigmund Freud. Freud did not view homosexuality as an illness, but rather as the unconflicted expression of an innate instinct based on trauma. He believed that all of us had both hetero- and homosexual traits, but under normal and non-traumatic circumstances, one would act like one's anatomical sex. He also saw homosexuality as an immature, but not pathological expression of sexuality. As with all of Freud's theories, there was not empirical research done; his belief was based on theory and observation, and the tenor of the times.

    Late in life, Freud wrote this to a mother, asking him to "cure" her son's homosexuality: "Homosexuality is assuredly no advantage, but it is nothing to be ashamed of, no vice, no degradation; it cannot be classified as an illness".

    Continued in Part II...
    "Never fear. Him is here" - Captain Chaos (Dom DeLuise), Cannonball Run

    ====||:-D

    Quote Originally Posted by Wiseone View Post
    This is what I hate about politics the most, it turns people in snobbish egotistical self righteous dicks who allow their political beliefs, partisan attitudes, and 'us vs. them' mentality, to force them to deny reality.

    Quote Originally Posted by Navy Pride View Post
    You can't paint everone with the same brush.......It does not work tht way.


    Quote Originally Posted by Wessexman View Post
    See with you around Captain we don't even have to make arguments, as you already know everything .
    Quote Originally Posted by CriticalThought View Post
    Had you been born elsewhere or at a different time you may very well have chosen a different belief system.
    Quote Originally Posted by ernst barkmann View Post
    It a person has faith they dont need to convince another of it, and when a non believer is not interested in listening to the word of the lord, " you shake the dust from your sandels and move on"

  10. #100
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    Re: Lt. gov. nominee Jackson says ‘no apologies’ for past comments on gays, abortion

    Part II

    In the mid-20th Century. two theorists/researchers theories propelled homosexuality far further into the realm of pathology. And both were based on flawed beliefs/research.

    Sandor Rado argued that Freud's theory of homosexuality was based on a flawed 19th Century theory: embryonic hermaphroditism (the belief that all embryos had the potential to be either male or female). He was correct about this. His error in logic was to then assume that heteosexuality was the only non-pathological alternative. He did no reasearch or provided evidence of his theory.

    The Bieber study is often used to prove the pathology of homosexuals, by showing that they could be "cured". The two major outcomes of his study was to show that 27% of homosexuals, treated, were "cured" and in identifying the familial traits of the families of homosexuals. Biber's study had major methodological flaws, and has been widely criticized and debunked. Firstly, he only used subjects that were already under psychiatric care. Secondly, no long term follow-up was done to determine if the result remained. Thirdly, Bieber was unable to produce even one of his subjects he claimed to have cured. Lastly, Biebers conclusions about the familial structure of a homosexual's family have been debunked by the 1981 study of a much larger, nonpatient gay population, a study that is methodologically sound. In essence, the Bieber study, often the cornerstone of the anti-gay agenda, has been shown to be completely flawed and invalid when studying this issue.

    The Bieber study was a response to the Kinsey study. Alfred Kinsey, the well-known sex researcher, created the Kinsey scale, through extensive research. Kinsey was one of the first to do evidence based research on a nonpatient population. What he found was that people varied on a scale from "exclusive heterosexual" to "exclusive homosexual" and variations in between. His research showed that at any given time throughout history, 3%-7% of the population was gay. His theories showed that homosexuality was both natural and widespread. Though this had an impact on non-pathologizing homosexuality, as Kinsey's reasearch did not, specifically address this issue, it did not confirm it. The Hooker study, however, did.

    Evelyn Hooker's study was published in 1956, and throughout the '60s gained more and more recognition, as more and more studies reproduced here findings, accurately. Here is a great brief description of Hooker's studyu and findings:

    Psychologist Evelyn Hooker's groundbreaking study compared the projective test results from 30 nonpatient homosexual men with those of 30 nonpatient heterosexual men. The study found that experienced psychologists, unaware of whose test results they were interpreting, could not distinguish between the two groups. This study was a serious challenge to the view that homosexuality was always associated with psychopathology.
    This was the first study that examined, psychologically, nonpatients; the opposite was a serious methological flaw in past studies. Experienced psychologists saw NO difference.

    When the first DSM came out in 1952, homosexuality was classified as a mental illness, not only matching with the societal attitudes of the time, and throughout the ages, but matching with the volume of research, all of which, as can be seen, above, was based on poor methodology, research based on observation only, morals, or opinions.

    By 1973, the Hooker study, replicated studies showing the same results, and many other studies showing the non-pathology of homosexuality had been published. Yet, in spite of this evidence, the APA held onto it's position that homosexuality would remain a disorder, and many on committees had never seen much of the research proving this inaccurate. It was only when the gay activists, including gay psychiatrists/psychologists pressed the APA to review and examine the research, that they did. When the APA saw the volume of research that showed that homosexuality was not an illness, and examined the methological issues with the research that showed that it was, further discussions were had in order to determine whether homosexuality would be declassified or not.

    When the APA voted, 58% voted to declassify homosexuality, which it was. Why only 58% if the research was so conclusive? For the same reason that we see here, at DP, that no matter how much conclusive research is presented that shows that homosexuality is not a disorder, some still hold onto that fallacious belief: bigotry, prejudice, inflexible thinking, morals over logic, and probably some other illogical reasons. Even Bieber, when presented with the evidence, and seeing his own study debunked because of methological reasons, refused to alter his belief. Why? Well, he was described as someone who would not admit he was wrong, even when proven so. Sounds like some folks around here. On this thread, even.

    So, was the APA decision to declassify homosexuality as a disorder politically motivated? The politics involved was to force the APA to look at and examine, objectively, research showing that homosexuality was not a disorder, and that the research that showed it was, was flawed. As I said earlier, the concept of politicizing this issue has been misrepresented by the anti-gay side of this issue to appear as if it were something it was not. One can compare this, to some extent, to the black civil rights movement. Was that political? Yes, but not in the way a bigot would make it.
    "Never fear. Him is here" - Captain Chaos (Dom DeLuise), Cannonball Run

    ====||:-D

    Quote Originally Posted by Wiseone View Post
    This is what I hate about politics the most, it turns people in snobbish egotistical self righteous dicks who allow their political beliefs, partisan attitudes, and 'us vs. them' mentality, to force them to deny reality.

    Quote Originally Posted by Navy Pride View Post
    You can't paint everone with the same brush.......It does not work tht way.


    Quote Originally Posted by Wessexman View Post
    See with you around Captain we don't even have to make arguments, as you already know everything .
    Quote Originally Posted by CriticalThought View Post
    Had you been born elsewhere or at a different time you may very well have chosen a different belief system.
    Quote Originally Posted by ernst barkmann View Post
    It a person has faith they dont need to convince another of it, and when a non believer is not interested in listening to the word of the lord, " you shake the dust from your sandels and move on"

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