• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

'Soldier beheaded' in Woolwich machete attack: latest

Fallenangel said:
FYI - Salafi, Wahhabi, The Muslim Brotherhood, Hezbollah, Hamas (and Ezzedeen Al-Qassam Brigades), Hizb ut-Tahrir, Al-Qaeda, Maghreb Al-Qaeda, Boko Haram...need more examples?


Ah and this:




Fallen.
Click to expand...


Iran, Iraq, Iraq, Afghanistan, Libya, etc.
 
Quik said:
Iran, Iraq, Iraq, Afghanistan, Libya, etc.
Click to expand...

You just listed several countries where Muslims have been slaughtering Muslims forever. And still are. So...try again to divert responsibility for terrorist acts.
 
VanceMack said:
You just listed several countries where Muslims have been slaughtering Muslims forever. And still are. So...try again to divert responsibility for terrorist acts.
Click to expand...

And where America has been slaughtering Muslims with terrorist attacks.
 
Fallenangel said:
....And how any of these have to do with the rise of Salafi/Wahhabi movements, for instance?

Fallen.
Click to expand...

They have to do with our imperialist foreign policy. That include the rise of Wahhabism in the first place via our "great ally" Saudi Arabia.
 
Quik said:
And where America has been slaughtering Muslims with terrorist attacks.
Click to expand...

And in your mind that justifies fundamentalist terrorist actions. You believe Obama the war criminal is justification for slaughtering men women and children.
 
VanceMack said:
And in your mind that justifies fundamentalist terrorist actions.
Click to expand...

Nope, just puts them into context, rather than the vacuum that you live in.

You believe Obama the war criminal is justification for slaughtering men women and children.
Click to expand...

No, I don't think it's ok to murder innocent people, which is why I don't make excuses for the US government.
 
Quik said:
Nope, just puts them into context, rather than the vacuum that you live in.



No, I don't think it's ok to murder innocent people, which is why I don't make excuses for the US government.
Click to expand...
And again....you should start a thread calling for Obama to be dragged before a war crimes tribunal. Instead you look like a fool answering the actions of a murderous terrorist scumbag with "yeah...but you guys..."
 
Quik said:
They have to do with our imperialist foreign policy. That include the rise of Wahhabism in the first place via our "great ally" Saudi Arabia.
Click to expand...

...And you're done.

US is Saudi Arabia's and (Qatar) ally - and they continue to get radicalized and export, endorse terror.
US is/was at war with Afghanistan, Iraq - and they continue to get radicalized, export and spawn terror.

Doesn't matter what US does, Muslims are still being radicalized.

Fallen.
 
Fallenangel said:
...And you're done.

US is Saudi Arabia's and (Qatar) ally - and they continue to get radicalized and export, endorse terror.
US is/was at war with Afghanistan, Iraq - and they continue to get radicalized, export and spawn terror.

Doesn't matter what US does, Muslims are still being radicalized.

Fallen.
Click to expand...

Interesting logic you have there. The United States invades and destroys the secular dictatorship of Iraq, which then gets replaced by a fundamentalist "democracy." The US funds a fundamentalist Islamic insurgency that overthrows the secular, socialist government of Afghanistan. The United States overthrows the democratically elected, socialist government of Iran under Mossagdeh.

On the other hand, we have the United States propping up the most fundamentalist regime on Earth in Saudi Arabia.

You're absolutely right, no matter what our government does, they get radicalized, because our government does everything in it's power to achieve that end.
 
Quik said:
What about the guy who killed the Sikhs, do his actions reflect upon Christianity?
Click to expand...

Quik, an obvious point you might be overlooking is that there is a difference between someone merely being christian/jew/hindu and committing a crime, and someone who injects that identity into the crime itself. It's a rather obvious distinction that you seem intent on ignoring as you list inane comparisons.

Also, while there is certainly christian inspired violence, it doesn't hold the same amount of representation it does within the islamic world. Which tends towards violent fundamentalism, in general
 
VanceMack said:
And again....you should start a thread calling for Obama to be dragged before a war crimes tribunal. Instead you look like a fool answering the actions of a murderous terrorist scumbag with "yeah...but you guys..."
Click to expand...

Has to be put into context. We kill innocent people every day but you don't seem to mind. You justify that senseless killing by the existence of Muslims committing senseless killings.

It's ironic because it is YOU who tries to justify the killing of innocents, not me. I think it's wrong in all cases.
 
Quik said:
Has to be put into context. We kill innocent people every day but you don't seem to mind. You justify that senseless killing by the existence of Muslims committing senseless killings.

It's ironic because it is YOU who tries to justify the killing of innocents, not me. I think it's wrong in all cases.
Click to expand...

We get it. You believe a British citizen was justified in killing another British citizen because barrack Obama is a murderous scumbag.
 
Dr. Chuckles said:
Quik, an obvious point you might be overlooking is that there is a difference between someone merely being christian/jew/hindu and committing a crime, and someone who injects that identity into the crime itself. It's a rather obvious distinction that you seem intent on ignoring as you list inane comparisons.

Also, while there is certainly christian inspired violence, it doesn't hold the same amount of representation it does within the islamic world. Which tends towards violent fundamentalism, in general
Click to expand...

Ok, then let's talk about what we do kill innocent people for, like "spreading democracy" or "spreading western values." Is this an indictment of of democracy or western values? Yes or no. We've killed a lot more people than the Muslims have.
 
VanceMack said:
We get it. You believe a British citizen was justified in killing another British citizen because barrack Obama is a murderous scumbag.
Click to expand...

No, I don't believe the killing was justified, that's just the straw man that you've created and beat to death.
 
Quik said:
Interesting logic you have there. The United States invades and destroys the secular dictatorship of Iraq, which then gets replaced by a fundamentalist "democracy." The US funds a fundamentalist Islamic insurgency that overthrows the secular, socialist government of Afghanistan. The United States overthrows the democratically elected, socialist government of Iran under Mossagdeh.
On the other hand, we have the United States propping up the most fundamentalist regime on Earth in Saudi Arabia.
You're absolutely right, no matter what our government does, they get radicalized, because our government does everything in it's power to achieve that end.
Click to expand...

Just showed you no matter, what US does Muslims are still being radicalized.
If your "logic" was correct, and only US intervention radicalizes Muslims - Saudi Arabia and Qatar are supposed to be secular states by now.

Fallen.
 
Fallenangel said:
Just showed you no matter, what US does Muslims are still being radicalized.
If your "logic" was correct, and only US intervention radicalizes Muslims - Saudi Arabia and Qatar are supposed to be secular states by now.

Fallen.
Click to expand...

Facepalm.

Interesting logic you have there. The United States invades and destroys the secular dictatorship of Iraq, which then gets replaced by a fundamentalist "democracy." The US funds a fundamentalist Islamic insurgency that overthrows the secular, socialist government of Afghanistan. The United States overthrows the democratically elected, socialist government of Iran under Mossagdeh.

On the other hand, we have the United States propping up the most fundamentalist regime on Earth in Saudi Arabia.

You're absolutely right, no matter what our government does, they get radicalized, because our government does everything in it's power to achieve that end.

You do realize that propping up dictators is a form of interventionism, right?
 
Quik said:
Ok, then let's talk about what we do kill innocent people for, like "spreading democracy" or "spreading western values."
Click to expand...

What do you mean by "innocent people"? Do you mean innocents that we are specifically targeting, like various public bombinb campaigns carried out by actual terrorist organizations, or are you talking about collateral damage, that is born out of the necessities for waging war and is clearly accepted within such documents as the geneva convention?

Is this an indictment of of democracy or western values? Yes or no.
Click to expand...

Depends on what you are exactly talking about. You're posts seem rather vague and based on various faulty assumptions. So they are hard to address in any substantial manner.

Secondly, support for radicalism and fundamentalism (in the context of executing gays and apostates) is rather widespread in the islamic world. And while I don't think that makes islam and muslims inherently bad, there are certain trends within the religion that helps fuel those rather large bad elements. With the big one being the lack of distinction between godly and earthly law

Of course, that is not to say there isn't a reaction to foreign policy going on here, either. But as problematic as it is, the hindu nationalist movement has largely moderated, while the Deobondi school of islam is still fueling the Taliban, ideologically.


We've killed a lot more people than the Muslims have.
Click to expand...

So what? If I have a hundred people storm my home to rape my children, and kill 60 before running them off, and they don't have an opportunity to kill anyone, that doesn't make my attempt at defense any less morally right, and their attack and intentions any less morally wrong.
 
Quik said:
Facepalm.

Interesting logic you have there. The United States invades and destroys the secular dictatorship of Iraq, which then gets replaced by a fundamentalist "democracy." The US funds a fundamentalist Islamic insurgency that overthrows the secular, socialist government of Afghanistan. The United States overthrows the democratically elected, socialist government of Iran under Mossagdeh.
On the other hand, we have the United States propping up the most fundamentalist regime on Earth in Saudi Arabia.
You're absolutely right, no matter what our government does, they get radicalized, because our government does everything in it's power to achieve that end.
You do realize that propping up dictators is a form of interventionism, right?
Click to expand...

You can keep facepalming yourself more if you want, because you just showed that you do not know what you are talking about.

The radicalization of Saudi Sunnis began in mid 20th century, long before Iraq/Afghanistan, it continued and was only amplified by anti-western rhetoric during the wars, but it began long before that.

Btw the house of Saud isn't the most radical part of Saudi Arabia, nor of the world - it doesn't mean that they are any good either.

Wanna try and come up with another theory?

Fallen.
 
Where else in the world are Jews, Buddhists or Christians suicide bombing innocents or cutting people heads off? Sounds to me like one particular religion is off the farm.
 
Skunked_Ape said:
Where else in the world are Jews, Buddhists or Christians suicide bombing innocents or cutting people heads off? Sounds to me like one particular religion is off the farm.
Click to expand...

Burma and africa. But it's more a question of degree, not non-existence
 
Quik said:
IRONY!

Newtown doesn't represent all Christians but for some bizarre, Alice in Wonderland reason, this man represents all Muslims?
Click to expand...

Did the Newtown shooter do his deed in the name of Jesus?

For your logic to make sense, this shooter would have attacked the Newtown school because they were not Christians. Do you have anything showing this to be a fact?
 
Skunked_Ape said:
Where else in the world are Jews, Buddhists or Christians suicide bombing innocents or cutting people heads off? Sounds to me like one particular religion is off the farm.
Click to expand...

The majority of followers of Islam are not off killing everyone. Instead of bashing an entire religion, why not bash just those that commit atrocities in the name of said religion?
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom