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Thread: 'Soldier beheaded' in Woolwich machete attack: latest

  1. #431
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    Re: 'Soldier beheaded' in Woolwich machete attack: latest

    Quote Originally Posted by Dr. Chuckles View Post
    3)We withdrew our involvement in Afghanistan after the soviets left. In fact, such is usually faulted for the **** hole it turned into
    I've identified the problem.

    It's like explaining to a kid why he shouldn't dump oil onto the road. A motorcycle runs into the oil and crashes. You try to explain to the kid how he helped cause the crash. He replies that he didn't cause the biker to go fast, he did that on his own.

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    Re: 'Soldier beheaded' in Woolwich machete attack: latest

    Quote Originally Posted by Quik View Post
    Yes, you see the key operator term "INCLUDES" meaning that I mentioned it specifically in the context of our greater imperialist foreign policy. You somehow confused Saudi Arabia's very different reasons with Iraq and Afghanistan. What you did not pick up for some reason however, is that all are the result of American intervention.

    There is the key word, once again! The reason it has become such a large, international movement and the main export besides oil, is because we have propped up that regime for decades. Saddam could have easily crushed Saudi Arabia, or at least embroiled them both in a long drawn out insurgency. We should never have gotten involved, and our interventions continue to bring misery to our country.
    First, I"ll try to ignore your obviously "very wise" suggestions to me and to US foreign policy makers (last paragraph) and concentrate on your argument.

    Second, I did not confuse a thing, I asked you a specific question about specific movements (e.g Wahhabi/Salafi) that represent and support a lot of the current terrorist organisations, and how they we're exactly caused by US intervention.

    You - "Iran, Iraq, Iraq, Afghanistan, Libya, etc."
    Me - ....And how any of these have to do with the rise of Salafi/Wahhabi movements, for instance?
    You -"They have to do with our imperialist foreign policy. That include the rise of Wahhabism in the first place via our "great ally" Saudi Arabia."


    Which I showed you to be false, already twice, the rise of extreme Salafism began before any intervention anywhere - from within Saudi Arabia during mid 20th century, btw these extreme fractions also fought against the house of Saud.
    It was only amplified by people who wanted to amplify it and vilify the west, for their political/religious agendas during the later wars etc.

    EDIT: It doesn't mean that US should support Saudi Arabia in any way.
    However, but to categorically assert like you do, that the only reason for the rise of Muslim extremists is US's intervention and support is, well, bs.

    Fallen.
    Last edited by Fallenangel; 05-26-13 at 11:45 AM.
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  3. #433
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    Re: 'Soldier beheaded' in Woolwich machete attack: latest

    Quote Originally Posted by Quik View Post
    We bombed the **** out of them, did you forget?
    bombing people isn't imperialism in any sense



    LMFAO! Have you heard of the Soviet War in Afghanistan, the Mujahideen, and the resulting power vacuum that was left after Soviet troops withdrew? Is this some kind of joke? You can't be serious right now right?
    What about it? The US withdrew it's funding and influence when the soviets withdrew. Years later, the taliban rose up



    [/quote]All over the Middle East. Iraq, Afghanistan, etc. Nobody would have approved of the invasion of a European country after 9/11. Muslim country like Iraq? No problem! [/quote]

    None of those conflicts involve killing people for being muslim



    And what is the "moral" or "ethical" argument you have for killing innocent Muslims? I guess I'm just like 3 steps ahead of you so I will try to slow it down a bit.
    can you cite this policy of targeting innocent muslims?

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    Re: 'Soldier beheaded' in Woolwich machete attack: latest

    Quote Originally Posted by Quik View Post
    Yes that is correct Einstein. Now, for 400, can you explain why the Taliban came to power AFTER the Soviet Union withdrew, or why they withdrew in the first place?
    wait, so now interventionism is a good thing? Again, you're all over the place here, mate

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    Re: 'Soldier beheaded' in Woolwich machete attack: latest

    Quote Originally Posted by Dr. Chuckles View Post
    Again, you're all over the place here, mate
    ^ That pretty much sums-up his posts here so far.
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    Re: 'Soldier beheaded' in Woolwich machete attack: latest

    Quote Originally Posted by The Prof View Post
    afp last saturday, may 18:



    Bombs targeting Iraqi Sunnis kill 67
    They are apparently continuing what they have done for a thousand years...randomly killing anyone who doesn't agree with their interpretation of religion, which influences their politics. I guess it's easier and more deadly now with modern weaponry.

    Good morning, Prof!

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    Re: 'Soldier beheaded' in Woolwich machete attack: latest

    Quote Originally Posted by Quik View Post
    And what caused that chaotic social and political environment? Our intervention! Man oh man, I think I have identified the problem. We are like 10 steps ahead of you and so it's too hard for you to keep up.
    actually the Afghan rural population (85% of the population at the time) were at odds with the urban elite and were resisting their efforts to extend influence and policy from Kabul after the revolution. In fact, the whole warlord culture developed in the late 70's during the revolution

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    Re: 'Soldier beheaded' in Woolwich machete attack: latest

    Quote Originally Posted by Quik View Post
    I've identified the problem.

    It's like explaining to a kid why he shouldn't dump oil onto the road. A motorcycle runs into the oil and crashes. You try to explain to the kid how he helped cause the crash. He replies that he didn't cause the biker to go fast, he did that on his own.
    we took advantage of circumstances in Afghanistan, we didn't create them

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    Re: 'Soldier beheaded' in Woolwich machete attack: latest

    Quote Originally Posted by Dr. Chuckles View Post
    we took advantage of circumstances in Afghanistan, we didn't create them
    Our intervention caused the Soviet Union to withdraw from Afghanistan, leading to the rise of the Taliban.

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    Re: 'Soldier beheaded' in Woolwich machete attack: latest

    Quote Originally Posted by Dr. Chuckles View Post
    actually the Afghan rural population (85% of the population at the time) were at odds with the urban elite and were resisting their efforts to extend influence and policy from Kabul after the revolution. In fact, the whole warlord culture developed in the late 70's during the revolution
    And we took sides with the Islamists. Are you noticing a pattern here or do I have to spell it out for you? Interventionism leads to unintended consequences.

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