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Thread: IRS official Lois Lerner to take the Fifth

  1. #231
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    Re: IRS official Lois Lerner to take the Fifth

    Quote Originally Posted by ocean515 View Post
    Exactly, trial and error. Can't say I'd be ready to sautee some more while viewing my dead friend next to the table.

    I trust all is well with you Jack.
    Very well indeed. You?
    "It's always reassuring to find you've made the right enemies." -- William J. Donovan

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    Re: IRS official Lois Lerner to take the Fifth

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Hays View Post
    Very well indeed. You?
    All is well thanks.

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    Re: IRS official Lois Lerner to take the Fifth

    the law still states that a 501(c)(4) group must be engaged EXCLUSIVELY in social welfare
    exactly

    just like ofa

    OFA, Obama Outside Group, Raises $4.8 Million In First Quarter 2013 - HuffPo

    indeed a half million dollar gift to this 501c4 devoted exclusively to social welfare gets you regular attendance at those white house quarterly meetings

    how exciting!

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    Re: IRS official Lois Lerner to take the Fifth

    Quote Originally Posted by trfjr View Post
    "It is well established that a witness, in a single proceeding, may not testify voluntarily about a subject and then invoke the privilege against self-incrimination when questioned about the details. See Rogers v. United States, 340 U.S. 367, 373 (1951#. The privilege is waived for the matters to which the witness testifies, and the scope of the “waiver is determined by the scope of relevant cross-examination,” Brown v. United States, 356 U.S. 148, 154—155 #1958). “The witness himself, certainly if he is a party, determines the area of disclosure and therefore of inquiry,” id., at 155. Nice questions will arise, of course, about the extent of the initial testimony and whether the ensuing questions are comprehended within its scope, but for now it suffices to note the general rule."

    Self-Incrimination legal definition of Self-Incrimination. Self-Incrimination synonyms by the Free Online Law Dictionary.
    Thank You
    This Reform Party member thinks it is high past time that we start electing Americans to congress and the presidency who put America first and their political party further down the line. But for way too long we have been electing Republicans and Democrats who happen to be Americans instead of Americans who happen to be Republicans and Democrats.

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    Re: IRS official Lois Lerner to take the Fifth

    mcclatchy yesterday

    Scandal draws questions about IRS role in enforcing Obamacare | McClatchy

    The blossoming IRS scandal over the targeting of conservative groups is provoking new scrutiny and terse questions about the agency’s role in shaping and implementing the controversial new national health care law, with the biggest changes set to begin next year.

    The Internal Revenue Service is an important cog in the implementation of the Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act of 2010, commonly shorthanded as Obamacare. The tax agency must act on 47 provisions of the new law, more than half of those already in effect, including the more controversial ones taking effect in 2014 such as the requirement that nearly all non-elderly adults have health care coverage.
    choo choo!

    Max Baucus, Obamacare's Lead Author, Sees "Huge Train Wreck Coming" - YouTube

    all aboard!

    embarrassed yet?

  6. #236
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    Re: IRS official Lois Lerner to take the Fifth

    lois lerner personally signed letters to 15 conservative organizations represented by attorney jay sekulow in april, 2012, four days AFTER then commissioner shulman testified adamantly to ways and means that such treatment of obama's political opponents was absolutely not going on

    A series of letters suggests that senior IRS official Lois Lerner was directly involved in the agency’s targeting of conservative groups as recently as April 2012, more than nine months after she first learned of the activity.

    Lerner, the director of the IRS exempt organizations office in Washington, D.C., signed cover letters to 15 conservative organizations currently represented by the American Center for Law and Justice (ACLJ) between in March and April of 2012. The letters, such as this one sent to the Ohio Liberty Council on March 16, 2012, informed the groups applying for tax-exempt status that the IRS was “unable to make a final determination on your exempt status without additional information,” and included a list of detailed questions of the kind that a Treasury inspector general’s audit found to be inappropriate. Some of the groups to which Lerner sent letters are still awaiting approval.

    Lerner has denied involvement in the targeting, which she has blamed on a few “front-line people” in the agency’s Cincinnati field office. “I have not done anything wrong,” she told members of the House oversight committee on Wednesday. However, she then refused to answer any questions, citing protection under the Fifth Amendment. She has since been placed on (paid) administrative leave, and the committee may call her to testify again.

    “One thing is clear: this correspondence shows [Lerner’s] direct involvement in the scheme,” wrote Jay Sekulow, chief counsel for the ACLJ. “Further, sending a letter from the top person in the IRS Exempt Organization division to a small Tea Party group also underscores the intimidation used in this targeting ploy.”

    The letters coincide with former IRS commissioner Douglas Shulman’s March 2012 testimony before Congress, in which he said there was “absolutely no targeting” of conservative groups at the agency. Two months later, an internal IRS investigation concluded that the agency had engaged in such targeting. Obama-administration officials have insisted the targeting stopped in May 2012, although a number of ACLJ clients have received similar requests for information from the IRS within the past year, according to chief counsel Jay Sekulow.
    Lois Lerner Directly Involved in IRS Targeting, Letters Show | National Review Online

    ms lerner is a liar, she's repeatedly testified falsely to congress at the very least...

    she's gonna have to tell us what we want her to tell us or we're gonna throw her in jail

    stay tuned, for months and months and months

    have a nice memorial day weekend

    look at one of lerner's little love letters for yourself:

    http://media.aclj.org/pdf/lois-lerne...-3-16-2012.pdf
    Last edited by The Prof; 05-24-13 at 10:45 PM.

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    Re: IRS official Lois Lerner to take the Fifth

    the examiner yesterday:

    Top IRS officials, whose agency was under investigation for targeting conservative groups, visited the Obama White House more than 100 times over two years while the probe was going on, far more often than in previous administrations and frequently enough that Republicans suspect White House officials knew about the targeting.

    Lawmakers now investigating the Internal Revenue Service practice zeroed in on those nearly weekly White House meetings to determine whether an IRS official — or someone higher up in the administration — had approved the targeting and whether it was politically motivated.

    The frequent meetings also raised questions about the White House's claims that it couldn't have instigated the targeting of conservative groups because it took a hands-off approach to the tax agency, going so far as to describe it as independent of the administration even though it's part of the Treasury Department.

    Former Internal Revenue Service Commissioner Doug Shulman visited the White House 118 times between 2010 and 2011. Acting Director Steven Miller, who took over at the IRS in November, also made numerous visits to the White House, though variations in the spelling of his name in White House visitor logs makes it difficult to determine exactly how many times.

    The frequent trips to the White House under Obama far outnumbered the times other administrations felt the need to meet with the IRS, according to Mark Everson, who led the IRS under former President George W. Bush. Everson said he remembers making only one trip to the White House between 2003 and 2007 and said he felt like he'd "moved to Siberia" because of the isolation.

    Shulman said he couldn't remember why he went to the White House so frequently, though some of the visits were probably about the IRS' role in implementing Obama's health care reforms, he told a congressional committee. Logs show Shulman met with two West Wing officials working on health care.

    But while the health care-related visits were explained in the logs, many others included no explanation. Other sources said the IRS and White House were also talking at the time about an investigation into excessive IRS spending on employee conferences, travel and awards.
    Lawmakers zero in on IRS meetings at White House | WashingtonExaminer.com

    118 visits, huh?

    shulman "adamantly" testified falsely in congress too...

    stay tuned

  8. #238
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    Re: IRS official Lois Lerner to take the Fifth

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    Yeah, I saw that on Colbert too...Not sure if that is indeed the case...But let me just ask you something....

    What possible relevance in determining someones tax exempt status could a question like, "How many times does your group pray together, and what is said in those prayers"?

    How is that the IRS's business in determination?
    It is not something I saw on Colbert last night. I learned this during my research on the issue and have been posting this for about a week. You do not have to apply for 501(c)(4) status; you simply declare.

    The reason these groups have been applying to the IRS is not because they have to get tax exempt status, but they want a determination letter. The reason Tea Party want this AND the reason they are scrutinized is because these groups are tweaners; they do not fully qualify because of their political nature. They want to qualify, because it allows them to raise money with disclosing donors. Alternatively, they could apply or be deemed 527 groups. It makes sense the the IRS singles them out for scrutiny as their applications are, by nature, questionable (after all, they are political organizations... and to be a 501(c)(4), politics must be secondary)

    501(c)4 vs 501(c)3 vs 527

    http://www.debatepolitics.com/breaki...post1061836806
    Last edited by upsideguy; 05-24-13 at 11:23 PM.

  9. #239
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    Re: IRS official Lois Lerner to take the Fifth

    Quote Originally Posted by Dickieboy View Post
    That is true (eventually) but a large majority (63% - 188 of 296) of the sample group were not approved timely:


    IG report linked previously.

    Some delayed over TWO ELECTION CYCLES! Why would you presume this was the case if NOT for political reasons?...especially considering that 'progressive' groups were expeditiously approved...
    They do not have to be approved... they can simply self declare. The reason they petition the IRS is because they are questionable to achieve 501(c)(4) status because of their political activity. 501(c)(4) groups need to be primarily social welfare - education groups. They want the 501(c)(4) status as they would not have to disclose donors with this status.... these two factors (borderline qualification; blind donors) are the very reason they got extra scrutiny. The right wing groups got most of it, because the Tea Party organizations were all being formed in the time frame. This all makes logical sense as being benign.

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    Re: IRS official Lois Lerner to take the Fifth

    Quote Originally Posted by nota bene View Post
    If you think that this IRS scandal is nothing, then you are the one in denial.
    It is much to do about nothing. I actually have a decent understanding of what is happening here and most do not. It is actually quite comical how politicians and their constituencies are falling all over themselves crying for jail time, firings, impeachment, etc. When this all shakes out, people are going to feel quite foolish and those that tried to tell us how this was the greatest scandal since (well, the last greatest scandal) are going to look quite foolish.

    The emperor has no clothes. The Cons will wish they spent this time and attention on Benghazi (or better yet, the AP scandal).
    Last edited by upsideguy; 05-24-13 at 11:39 PM.

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