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Thread: Florida Man Charged with Murder for Killing Ex-Girlfriend's FETUS[W330;338]

  1. #501
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    Re: Florida Man Charged with Murder for Killing Ex-Girlfriend's FETUS[W330;338]

    Quote Originally Posted by Gaugingcatenate View Post
    Well, I have hardly read everything you have ever written, no disrespect intended. Why don't you reference your "debunking" so I can have a little look see myself, not that I don't trust you... or that I do trust you. I just like to measure things myself, to verify. How does paternity work in your estimation? No legal obligation? You only have responsibility for the child if you signed something agreeing to it beforehand, is that how paternity law goes? Men are off the hook if they don't have a formal contract, is that it?

    Wow...Methinks someone is much mistaken...
    It was in this thread.

    Quote Originally Posted by Viktyr Gehrig View Post
    No. This argument is a fat stupid sack of fail. Contracts do not work that way. You cannot make contracts work that way. Contracts are by their very nature explicit and deliberate and mutual. You cannot accidentally enter into a contract and you cannot enter into a contract without knowing the terms. A contract involves very specifically agreeing, with full informed consent, that you are going to do a specific thing in exchange for specific remuneration. You are trying to argue that the woman is entering into a contract with a being before it exists, without its consent, which is not now and not ever expected to provide compensation, on the basis of performing an act with a third party that does not in every case or even the majority of cases result in that being existing. There is no possible way under any system of contract law as it is understood by any civilization, regardless of its laws concerning abortion, that having sex can be construed as agreeing to any kind of contract with the unborn child to provide gestation.
    As for how paternity works in my estimation, it works like a criminal scheme by the State to save money on welfare programs by extorting men into supporting children that they may or may not even be the biological fathers of-- the State doesn't care who is forced to be responsible for the child's upkeep, as long as it saves money. The fact that men have their money stolen by the State and given to the mothers of their (supposedly) biological children doesn't make them fathers, doesn't make them morally responsible for those children, and doesn't provide any kind of sound moral basis for employing similar coercive measures against women. You're arguing that one wrong justifies another.

  2. #502
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    Re: Florida Man Charged with Murder for Killing Ex-Girlfriend's FETUS[W330;338]

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    'Implied Contracts Although contracts that are implied in fact and contracts implied in law are both called implied contracts, a true implied contract consists of obligations arising from a mutual agreement and intent to promise, which have not been expressed in words...'
    Mutual agreement and intent to promise. Those are requirements for an implied contract. They do not exist here. Do you even read your own arguments?

  3. #503
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    Re: Florida Man Charged with Murder for Killing Ex-Girlfriend's FETUS[W330;338]

    Quote Originally Posted by Gaugingcatenate View Post
    Pregnancy does start when the female egg is fertilized with the male sperm...the pregnancy continues with implantation...
    According to the scientific community and long standing federal policy pregnancy begins with implantantion.

    According to both the scientific community and long-standing federal policy, a woman is considered pregnant only when a fertilized egg has implanted in the wall of her uterus;
    < SNIP>

    Since the 1970s, the Department of Health and Human Services has had an official definition of pregnancy for purposes of establishing certain safeguards when federally funded research involves pregnant women.
    <SNIP>
    Like the proposed Clinton regulation, however, the rules promulgated by the Bush administration, which remain in effect today,
    say that pregnancy "encompasses the period of time from implantation until delivery."


    < SNIP>
    The Implications of Defining When a Woman Is Pregnant
    Last edited by minnie616; 05-27-13 at 08:15 PM.
    When it comes to matters of reproduce health, Politicians and the religious dogma of another faith should never interfere with religious liberty of an individual or her faith.

  4. #504
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    Re: Florida Man Charged with Murder for Killing Ex-Girlfriend's FETUS[W330;338]

    Quote Originally Posted by Viktyr Gehrig View Post
    Mutual agreement and intent to promise. Those are requirements for an implied contract. They do not exist here.
    Do you believe that anyone refutes the fact that engaging in intercourse carries the probability that a pregnancy could occur as a result of the act?

    I think that covers both your Mutual agreement, and Intent to promise wording you are using here....

    Do you even read your own arguments?
    Oh I see, you really didn't want to discuss anything, but are more than willing to insult...Well, I guess I should have expected it, from you that is.
    Americans are so enamored of equality that they would rather be equal in slavery than unequal in freedom.

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    Re: Florida Man Charged with Murder for Killing Ex-Girlfriend's FETUS[W330;338]

    Quote Originally Posted by minnie616 View Post
    According to the scientific community and long standing federal policy pregnancy begins with implantantion.


    The Implications of Defining When a Woman Is Pregnant
    Ah, a new use for the same argument that GW's use....Guttmacher...pfft! Do you ever use anything other than sources totally biased to your own point of view?
    Americans are so enamored of equality that they would rather be equal in slavery than unequal in freedom.

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    Re: Florida Man Charged with Murder for Killing Ex-Girlfriend's FETUS[W330;338]

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    Do you believe that anyone refutes the fact that engaging in intercourse carries the probability that a pregnancy could occur as a result of the act?

    I think that covers both your Mutual agreement, and Intent to promise wording you are using here....
    And you accuse me of mental gymnastics. THAT IS NOT WHAT WORDS MEAN. The fact that something is a possibility does not mean that a person agrees to it, and does not confer any obligation whatsoever to perpetuate the situation.

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    Re: Florida Man Charged with Murder for Killing Ex-Girlfriend's FETUS[W330;338]

    Quote Originally Posted by Viktyr Gehrig View Post
    And you accuse me of mental gymnastics. THAT IS NOT WHAT WORDS MEAN. The fact that something is a possibility does not mean that a person agrees to it, and does not confer any obligation whatsoever to perpetuate the situation.
    Is the sex engaged in not consensual?
    Americans are so enamored of equality that they would rather be equal in slavery than unequal in freedom.

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    Re: Florida Man Charged with Murder for Killing Ex-Girlfriend's FETUS[W330;338]

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    Ah, a new use for the same argument that GW's use....Guttmacher...pfft! Do you ever use anything other than sources totally biased to your own point of view?
    Oh ...you would like another source?
    Ask ...and I will happily provide another source:

    Contra-Contraception

    By RUSSELL SHORTO

    Published: May 7, 2006
    According to the American College of Obstetricians and Gynecologists, however, pregnancy begins not at fertilization but at implantation.
    The medical thinking behind this definition has to do with the fact that implantation is the moment when a woman's body begins to nurture the fertilized egg.
    The roughly one-half of all fertilized eggs that never attach to a uterine wall are thus not generally considered to be tiny humans — ensouled beings — that died but rather fertilized eggs that did not turn into pregnancies.
    Federal regulations enacted during the Bush administration agree with this, stating,
    "Pregnancy encompasses the period of time from implantation until delivery."
    http://www.nytimes.com/2006/05/07/ma...anted=all&_r=0
    When it comes to matters of reproduce health, Politicians and the religious dogma of another faith should never interfere with religious liberty of an individual or her faith.

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    Re: Florida Man Charged with Murder for Killing Ex-Girlfriend's FETUS[W330;338]

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    Just a question for sangha....Are you in favor of late term abortion? Or even "post birth"?
    I would never have an abortion
    Quote Originally Posted by matchlight View Post
    Justice Thomas' opinions consistently contain precise, detailed constitutional analyses.
    Quote Originally Posted by jaeger19 View Post
    the vast majority of folks that need healthcare are on Medicare.. both rich and poor..

  10. #510
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    Re: Florida Man Charged with Murder for Killing Ex-Girlfriend's FETUS[W330;338]

    Quote Originally Posted by Scrabaholic View Post
    The fact remains that they weren't 'leftys' as you claim they were.
    Lefties, or useful idiots, i don't care which. I'd like to see your proof they weren't lefties. Being appointed by someone means nothing. Your ill-informed opinion is what it is.

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