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Thread: Florida Man Charged with Murder for Killing Ex-Girlfriend's FETUS[W330;338]

  1. #351
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    Re: Florida Man Charged with Murder for Killing Ex-Girlfriend's FETUS[W330;338]

    Quote Originally Posted by Hatuey View Post
    The anti-choicers will claim that the founders didn't really own slaves, they just stored them.
    All the founders? None of them were against slavery? Why then did they limit the power of the South with the 3/5s compromise, why did they impose a ban on the future importation of slaves that went into effect Jan 1, 1808, why were some number, like Franklin, against slavery, in a time when it was absolutely just the norm worldwide, maybe similar to a person owning a private plane today, if you could afford to own slaves to do just that, probably inherited and not much thought given...Yet in 1787 Ben Franklin began to serve as President of the Pennsylvania Society for Promoting the Abolition of Slavery...

    Seems a little sour, this attitude against those who risked all and have provided us with a framework of national governance that has brought much joy, much good transformation and prosperity.

  2. #352
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    Re: Florida Man Charged with Murder for Killing Ex-Girlfriend's FETUS[W330;338]

    Quote Originally Posted by Grant View Post
    Do you not understand what the word "poisoned" means? Even in your own summary of what happened you fail to use the term.
    Are we seriously going to quibble over the semantic difference between the word "drugged" and the word "poisoned"? Is that what your argument consists of?

    Quote Originally Posted by Grant View Post
    I agree that an assault took place, which is the crime he should be charged with. The problem for the abortionists is that using the term "murder" implies that this baby was a 'person', a term groups such as Planned Parenthood want to avoid.
    Yes. Which is the entire purpose these anti-feticide laws were passed in the first place. They're intended as an end-run around Roe v Wade by establishing legal precedence of fetuses as people.

    Quote Originally Posted by Grant View Post
    If this goes to court it could change abortion laws dramatically and could again visit the Supreme Court. Perhaps that's what all this is really about.
    That's a fair point. I suppose I might be less interested in seeing this guy get what he deserves and more interested in making sure women get to keep what they deserve, but I still refuse to get morally outraged over a man getting what he deserves regardless of how incorrect the process is which gives it to him.

  3. #353
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    Re: Florida Man Charged with Murder for Killing Ex-Girlfriend's FETUS[W330;338]

    Quote Originally Posted by sangha View Post
    The constitution only protects the lives of persons. The unborn are not persons
    Go ahead, prove to us "again" that the Constitution says that the unborn... or... only the born, are persons....only the born can have rights...

    Oh yeah, it doesn't say that, says nothing of the sort... or even close. As many times as you say that I will try to get in the true, the correct view so not as many that may not be informed as they should can be led in a wrong direction.

    Oh, and what about the proof regarding your opinion about the Supreme Court and where the Constitution expressly states their powers on how to apply the Constitution in such cases. Like the non existent " only born persons" have rights in the Constitution per your tilted interpretation, the Constitution is silent also on how the Supreme Court is to to apply its power in this situation.

  4. #354
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    Re: Florida Man Charged with Murder for Killing Ex-Girlfriend's FETUS[W330;338]

    Quote Originally Posted by Viktyr Gehrig View Post
    Are we seriously going to quibble over the semantic difference between the word "drugged" and the word "poisoned"? Is that what your argument consists of?
    As they mean two different things, I suppose we might. Of course you could withdraw the term 'poisoned' and say he had given her drugs instead. Specific words have specific meanings.

    Yes. Which is the entire purpose these anti-feticide laws were passed in the first place. They're intended as an end-run around Roe v Wade by establishing legal precedence of fetuses as people.
    It seems that may be re-visited because the definition of a person seems to change from one law to the next.

  5. #355
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    minnie616's Avatar
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    Re: Florida Man Charged with Murder for Killing Ex-Girlfriend's FETUS[W330;338]

    Quote Originally Posted by Grant View Post
    ?..
    It seems that may be re-visited because the definition of a person seems to change from one law to the next.
    And if it is revisited the feticide laws will most likely be struck down.
    When it comes to matters of reproduce health, Politicians and the religious dogma of another faith should never interfere with religious liberty of an individual or her faith.

  6. #356
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    Re: Florida Man Charged with Murder for Killing Ex-Girlfriend's FETUS

    Quote Originally Posted by Gaugingcatenate View Post
    .
    .
    Well bless your misguided little heart....




    One can always pick out those who do not like their myths questioned... its almost as if its against their religion.
    There is nothing mythical about SCOTUS decisions. They have the force of law because of the powers that the constitution grants them.
    Quote Originally Posted by matchlight View Post
    Justice Thomas' opinions consistently contain precise, detailed constitutional analyses.
    Quote Originally Posted by jaeger19 View Post
    the vast majority of folks that need healthcare are on Medicare.. both rich and poor..

  7. #357
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    Re: Florida Man Charged with Murder for Killing Ex-Girlfriend's FETUS[W330]

    Quote Originally Posted by Gaugingcatenate View Post
    Well...there you go again...going to that very same dry well you could not get " only a born person" out of... pesky document, for some anyhow, our Constitution. Why don't you show all of us exactly where in the Constitution , "... the part where the constitution gives SCOTUS the power to determine how to apply the constitution." Just quote to us where it says anything of the sort in Article III. My quick impression is that you do not seem to have studied the Constitution in any particular detail from all these loose, at best, assertions you make about it and what this framework for our governance "says".
    There is no need to show you exactly where in the Constitution. That is just a dodge

    The constitution doesn't mention immigration either. Do you deny that the govt has the power to regulate immigration?

    And if you're going to insist on quotes from the constitution, then please quote exactly where the constitution says the unborn are "persons"
    Quote Originally Posted by matchlight View Post
    Justice Thomas' opinions consistently contain precise, detailed constitutional analyses.
    Quote Originally Posted by jaeger19 View Post
    the vast majority of folks that need healthcare are on Medicare.. both rich and poor..

  8. #358
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    Re: Florida Man Charged with Murder for Killing Ex-Girlfriend's FETUS[W330;338]

    Quote Originally Posted by Gaugingcatenate View Post
    We, on the right, seem to be the only ones who know very much about our Constitution. Not the made up stuff, the real Constitution.
    Where does the constitution say that the govt has the power to protect the unborn?
    Quote Originally Posted by matchlight View Post
    Justice Thomas' opinions consistently contain precise, detailed constitutional analyses.
    Quote Originally Posted by jaeger19 View Post
    the vast majority of folks that need healthcare are on Medicare.. both rich and poor..

  9. #359
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    Re: Florida Man Charged with Murder for Killing Ex-Girlfriend's FETUS[W330;338]

    Quote Originally Posted by Gaugingcatenate View Post
    Go ahead, prove to us "again" that the Constitution says that the unborn... or... only the born, are persons....only the born can have rights...

    Oh yeah, it doesn't say that, says nothing of the sort... or even close. As many times as you say that I will try to get in the true, the correct view so not as many that may not be informed as they should can be led in a wrong direction.

    Oh, and what about the proof regarding your opinion about the Supreme Court and where the Constitution expressly states their powers on how to apply the Constitution in such cases. Like the non existent " only born persons" have rights in the Constitution per your tilted interpretation, the Constitution is silent also on how the Supreme Court is to to apply its power in this situation.
    GO ahead, prove that the constitution says that the unborn are persons...that the unborn have rights...

    Oh yeah, it doesn't say that, says nothing of the sort...or even close. As many times as you say that I will try to get in the true, the correct view so not as many that may not be informed as they should can be led in the wrong direction

    Oh, and what about the proof regarding your opinion about the Supreme Court and where the Constitution expressly states their powers on how to apply the Constitution in such cases. Like the non existent " includes unborn persons" have rights in the Constitution per your tilted interpretation, the Constitution is silent also on how the Supreme Court is to to apply its power in this situation.
    Quote Originally Posted by matchlight View Post
    Justice Thomas' opinions consistently contain precise, detailed constitutional analyses.
    Quote Originally Posted by jaeger19 View Post
    the vast majority of folks that need healthcare are on Medicare.. both rich and poor..

  10. #360
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    Re: Florida Man Charged with Murder for Killing Ex-Girlfriend's FETUS[W330;338]

    Quote Originally Posted by sangha View Post
    Notice how even the girls lawyer is not arguing that the fetus had any rights. Instead, he is arguing that the girl was deprived of her right to choose whether or not to have a child.

    No matter how hard you try to twist the facts, the truth is that this case is supported by the pro-choice philosophy.
    So the "pro-choice philosophy" states that it's only murder when the mother wants the baby? This is more or less your position, minus all the mental acrobatics.

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