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Thread: IRS officials in Washington were involved in targeting of conservative groups

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    Re: IRS officials in Washington were involved in targeting of conservative groups

    Quote Originally Posted by jonny5 View Post
    Its not dishonest at all. They meet the definition the IRS set forth. Perhaps your issue is with the label the IRS puts on it instead. Furthermore, disclosing donors leads to widespread political corruptions as seen by this story. The IRS agents are wanting orgs to expose their donors so they can harrass them. Which is why donors dont want to disclose. I see no reason why the IRS needs to know that I gave money to a private group who advocates for an issue.
    What evidence do you have that anyone was harrased because of political donations? The only harrassment that you could possibly be talking about is that donations given to a tax exempt 501(c)(4) organization are not in fact tax exempt, even though many people incorrectly claim them.

    Also, according to the report, all donor lists were destroyed upon completion of the investigation.
    Last edited by Mithros; 05-15-13 at 02:53 PM.

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    Re: IRS officials in Washington were involved in targeting of conservative groups

    “I wish there was more GOP interest when I raised the same issue during the Bush administration, where they audited a progressive church in my district in what look liked a very selective way,” California Democratic Rep. Adam Schiff said on MSNBC Monday. “I found only one Republican, [North Carolina Rep. Walter Jones], that would join me in calling for an investigation during the Bush administration. I’m glad now that the GOP has found interest in this issue and it ought to be a bipartisan concern.”

    The well-known church, All Saints Episcopal in Pasadena, became a bit of a cause célèbre on the left after the IRS threatened to revoke the church’s tax-exempt status over an anti-Iraq War sermon the Sunday before the 2004 election. “Jesus [would say], ‘Mr. President, your doctrine of preemptive war is a failed doctrine,’” rector George Regas said from the dais.

    The church, which said progressive activism was in its “DNA,” hired a powerful Washington lawyer and enlisted the help of Schiff, who met with the commissioner of the IRS twice and called for a Government Accountability Office investigation, saying the IRS audit violated the First Amendment and was unduly targeting a political opponent of the Bush administration. “My client is very concerned that the close coordination undertaken by the IRS allowed partisan political concerns to direct the course of the All Saints examination,” church attorney Marcus Owens, who is widely considered one of the country’s leading experts on this area of the law, said at the time. In 2007, the IRS closed the case, decreeing that the church violated rules preventing political intervention, but it did not revoke its nonprofit status.

    And while All Saints came under the gun, conservative churches across the country were helping to mobilize voters for Bush with little oversight. In 2006, citing the precedent of All Saints, “a group of religious leaders accused the Internal Revenue Service yesterday of playing politics by ignoring its complaint that two large churches in Ohio are engaging in what it says are political activities, in violation of the tax code,” the New York Times reported at the time. The churches essentially campaigned for a Republican gubernatorial candidate, they alleged, and even flew him on one of their planes.

    Meanwhile, Citizens for Ethics in Washington filed two ethics complaints against a church in Minnesota. “You know we can’t publicly endorse as a church and would not for any candidate, but I can tell you personally that I’m going to vote for Michele Bachmann,” pastor Mac Hammond of the Living Word Christian Center in Minnesota said in 2006 before welcoming her to the church. The IRS opened an audit into the church, but it went nowhere after the church appealed the audit on a technicality.

    And it wasn’t just churches. In 2004, the IRS went after the NAACP, auditing the nation’s oldest civil rights group after its chairman criticized President Bush for being the first sitting president since Herbert Hoover not to address the organization. “They are saying if you criticize the president we are going to take your tax exemption away from you,” then-chairman Julian Bond said. “It’s pretty obvious that the complainant was someone who doesn’t believe George Bush should be criticized, and it’s obvious of their response that the IRS believes this, too.”

    In a letter to the IRS, Democratic Reps. Charles Rangel, Pete Stark and John Conyers wrote: “It is obvious that the timing of this IRS examination is nothing more than an effort to intimidate the members of the NAACP, and the communities the organization represents, in their get-out-the-vote effort nationwide.”

    Then, in 2006, the Wall Street Journal broke the story of a how a little-known pressure group called Public Interest Watch — which received 97 percent of its funds from Exxon Mobile one year — managed to get the IRS to open an investigation into Greenpeace. Greenpeace had labeled Exxon Mobil the “No. 1 climate criminal.” The IRS acknowledged its audit was initiated by Public Interest Watch and threatened to revoke Greenpeace’s tax-exempt status, but closed the investigation three months later.



    When the IRS targeted liberals - Salon.com


    Of course you never heard about this because they didn't have fox noise and right-wing hate shows on the radio whining day and night. The tea party are the biggest bunch of crybabies on the face of the earth.

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    Re: IRS officials in Washington were involved in targeting of conservative groups

    Quote Originally Posted by Passenger View Post
    ...Of course you never heard about this because they didn't have fox noise and right-wing hate shows on the radio whining day and night. The tea party are the biggest bunch of crybabies on the face of the earth.
    Oh this is rich! We never heard this because 'fox noise' is the ONLY news network...? Why didn't the other MSM sources cover this past issue similar to the way 'fox noise' is the current issue?

    Further, please explain how you crying about 'fox noise' and 'right-wing hate shows on the radio whining day and night' is EXACTLY THE SAME THING...mirror anyone?
    "The fact that we are here today to debate raising America's debt limit is a sign of leadership failure" - 2006 Senator Obama...leadership failure indeed!

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    Re: IRS officials in Washington were involved in targeting of conservative groups

    Quote Originally Posted by Mithros View Post
    What evidence do you have that anyone was harrased because of political donations? The only harrassment that you could possibly be talking about is that donations given to a tax exempt 501(c)(4) organization are not in fact tax exempt, even though many people incorrectly claim them.

    Also, according to the report, all donor lists were destroyed upon completion of the investigation.
    The purpose of these IRS agents focusing on Tea Party groups was to prevent them from being able to influence politics. The purpose of exposing private peoples interactions with these groups is to stifle their speech. There is simply no reason that the govt needs to know who gave money to a political group.

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    Re: IRS officials in Washington were involved in targeting of conservative groups

    Quote Originally Posted by Passenger View Post

    Of course you never heard about this because they didn't have fox noise and right-wing hate shows on the radio whining day and night. The tea party are the biggest bunch of crybabies on the face of the earth.
    Good to know that you support fox noise in exposing corruption.

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    Re: IRS officials in Washington were involved in targeting of conservative groups

    Quote Originally Posted by jonny5 View Post
    The purpose of these IRS agents focusing on Tea Party groups was to prevent them from being able to influence politics. The purpose of exposing private peoples interactions with these groups is to stifle their speech. There is simply no reason that the govt needs to know who gave money to a political group.
    In a lot of ways you're totally correct. The entire purpose of the application process was to determine if the groups were excessivly engaged in politics, which is prohibited for any organization seeking 501(c)(4) status. Free speech is not the same as unlimited anonymous speech.

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    Re: IRS officials in Washington were involved in targeting of conservative groups

    Quote Originally Posted by Mithros View Post
    In a lot of ways you're totally correct. The entire purpose of the application process was to determine if the groups were excessivly engaged in politics, which is prohibited for any organization seeking 501(c)(4) status. Free speech is not the same as unlimited anonymous speech.
    And can you explain why they singled out only conservative groups? According to the report, 100% of the Tea Party groups were singled out. Seeing any abuse at all yet?

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    Re: IRS officials in Washington were involved in targeting of conservative groups

    Quote Originally Posted by Anthony60 View Post
    And can you explain why they singled out only conservative groups? According to the report, 100% of the Tea Party groups were singled out. Seeing any abuse at all yet?
    Incompetence is not the same as abuse.

    The report said that of the 4510 applications processed by the EO office, 207 were correctly submitted to a team of specialists, 144 had strong indications of political involvement but were approved, and 91 were subject to potentially unessasary investigation. Those 91 were not broken down by political lean, but appear to be a more of a result of a poor understanding of the types of political actions that may be taken by 501(c)(4)s.

    It may be that conservative groups were subjected to statistically more scrutiny than other groups with political leanings. Certainly the language used had the appearance of bias. However, there has not been any statistial evidence presented yet that indicates that conservatives were targeted at a higher rate.

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    Re: IRS officials in Washington were involved in targeting of conservative groups

    Quote Originally Posted by Mithros View Post
    Incompetence is not the same as abuse.

    The report said that of the 4510 applications processed by the EO office, 207 were correctly submitted to a team of specialists, 144 had strong indications of political involvement but were approved, and 91 were subject to potentially unessasary investigation. Those 91 were not broken down by political lean, but appear to be a more of a result of a poor understanding of the types of political actions that may be taken by 501(c)(4)s.

    It may be that conservative groups were subjected to statistically more scrutiny than other groups with political leanings. Certainly the language used had the appearance of bias. However, there has not been any statistial evidence presented yet that indicates that conservatives were targeted at a higher rate.
    They searched out groups who had names with "Tea Party", "Patriots", "9/12", etc... in it. Gee, you think there was bias? I guess the head of the IRS doesn't agree with you, that they didn't go far enough, he just resigned.

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    Re: IRS officials in Washington were involved in targeting of conservative groups

    Quote Originally Posted by Erod View Post
    So you equate terrorism to unfair tax breaks.

    OK.
    So you think racial profiling is far less serious than political profiling.

    OK.
    He touched her over her bra and underpants, she says, and guided her hand to touch him over his underwear
    Quote Originally Posted by Lutherf View Post
    We’ll say what? Something like “nothing happened” ... Yeah, we might say something like that.

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