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Gosnell guilty of 3 counts of murder

trfjr said:
this is what a 25 week old fetus looks like, its a baby it is an alive human being not some dam glob of cell
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What does it look like at 12 weeks? Because that is when over 99% of abortions occur.
 
Last time I checked, this thread was about Gosnell being convicted of murdering three live babies.
 
tererun said:
they were abortions. No one wanted them to be born, and the mothers chose to abort. Your misrepresentation of facts and reality are noted.
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Abortions are done inside the womb. He did three of them after live birth. What facts did I misrepresent?
 
tererun said:
they were abortions, not murders. Though if his negligence lead to the deaths of a mother or two then I could see actually being guilty of murder. Separate is not equal. Since a fetus does not ahve the rights of a human, and it should never have them, it cannot be considered murder or homicide to kill one. but good try for backdooring in precedent. I do hope that attempt doesn't ruin this on appeals for you.
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Mein gott. You're so completely wrong about so many things in such a short bit of text.

a) When a child is born, it has rights and legal protection under the law as it stands right now. I may think it's stupid, and I do, but that is what the law is as it stands right now, nationwide.

b) It is always homicide to kill a human. It isn't always murder to kill a human in aggression, unfortunately - see abortion.

c) SAT analogy question reference time.... Fetus : neonate :: magma : lava. If birth has happened, even if that birth was induced through medication, you don't call the human a fetus any longer. Premature neonates come out before they have had the usual entire fetal stage of growth and development inside the womb, that is why they have such a hard time.


tererun said:
they were abortions. No one wanted them to be born, and the mothers chose to abort. Your misrepresentation of facts and reality are noted.
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Stop talking about things you clearly know nothing about. Yes, their disgusting wretches of mothers wanted them dead, they hired a serial killer to make them dead, and then that serial killer stepped outside the boundaries of his legal protection to perform his professional role. He can only kill human beings when they are inside the mother's womb, but even then, he killed them so late-term that he was violating state law. He didn't even stop there, though, he violently killed them outside of the womb - not fetuses, but born neonates.

By killing the kids after they were born, he became a murderer under the law as it stands right now anywhere in the nation. In addition to being a serial killer of humans in the fetal stage of life, he crossed the line into becoming a murderer of children. There really shouldn't be a difference, but there is.

I'm not sure how anyone stumbles into an abortion debate without understanding the most basic elements of that debate... how was that ambiguous to you before today? The current standard, long standing, is that a human has legal rights and those rights are protected at birth.
 
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fmw said:
Abortions are done inside the womb. He did three of them after live birth. What facts did I misrepresent?
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Tererun shows the real problem brought out by this conviction....The pro abortion people have gotten by for decades by telling themselves all kinds of falsehoods to ease their own conscience over what it is truly that they advocate for...Gosnell brings that question to the forefront....For instance, people recoil at the disregard for life when a person like Gosnell talks of snipping the neck of a baby that is laying on a table, but then have to reconcile that to their own acceptance of killing the same baby an hour, or a week earlier just because it is still inside the womb....

I can see this situation starting to change peoples perceptions about what it is that they are for.
 
j-mac said:
Tererun shows the real problem brought out by this conviction....The pro abortion people have gotten by for decades by telling themselves all kinds of falsehoods to ease their own conscience over what it is truly that they advocate for...Gosnell brings that question to the forefront....For instance, people recoil at the disregard for life when a person like Gosnell talks of snipping the neck of a baby that is laying on a table, but then have to reconcile that to their own acceptance of killing the same baby an hour, or a week earlier just because it is still inside the womb....

I can see this situation starting to change peoples perceptions about what it is that they are for.
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It is hard for me to imagine the whole thing. Here is a man who went through years of education and training to earn an MD degree and practice medicine. That is a very difficult thing to do. And instead of applying that training and skill to the betterment of the human condition, he hides a way in a filthy, rundown clinic, doing illegal abortions and even murders. Something went wrong somewhere. Before Roe V Wade, the people who did this weren't MD's. I have a difficult time with people supporting this. Tererun thinks it is OK to end a life simply because someone wants it to be so. Murderers murder because they want it to be so. Something went wrong somewhere.
 
fmw said:
It is hard for me to imagine the whole thing. Here is a man who went through years of education and training to earn an MD degree and practice medicine. That is a very difficult thing to do. And instead of applying that training and skill to the betterment of the human condition, he hides a way in a filthy, rundown clinic, doing illegal abortions and even murders. Something went wrong somewhere. Before Roe V Wade, the people who did this weren't MD's. I have a difficult time with people supporting this. Tererun thinks it is OK to end a life simply because someone wants it to be so. Murderers murder because they want it to be so. Something went wrong somewhere.
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For Gosnell, it was the money. He ran a pill-mill by day, and this is what finally busted him. So greedy was he that he went to work on Sundays with only his wife to assist (including assisting in destroying records), and only God knows--unless his wife ever talks--what "challenging" medical events occurred on those Sundays.
 
tererun said:
No, they were abortions, though you worked yourself up into an emotional frenzy over it. Seriously, what do you think an abortion is? The mothers are not willing to have or raise the child so they terminate the pregnancy. That will involve an early fetus that is still developing. The fetus doesn't just stop working because the mother chooses to abort. It is removed and that ends whatever cellular functions it has which cause it to be a living part of the mother. What you are claiming is that had he just left the glob on the floor to die it would not be murder, but because he made extra specially sure to help destroy the glob of cells and put a quick end to any functions that might be going on he becomes a murderer. It is an abortion and is not a murder. If you want to have strict and harsh penalties like in murder for abortion doctors who perform later term abortions then make those punishments into law. if you want to lump this in somewhere completely different i hope it gets turned over on appeals because it is a dangerous precedent and gives much more power to the government to try you for crimes you never committed.
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The murders he was convicted of involved 3 BABIES born alive. They were living human beings until the good doctor's scissors was used to sever their spinal chords. At which time they became dead human beings. Not dead globs of cells but dead human beings. This is a rather simple concept for most to grasp... killing another human being is murder. Maybe you have to be human first in order to understand?
 
nota bene said:
Gosnell's been given three life sentences with no hope of parole, more merciful sentences than he gave innocent babies whose only crime was being conceived. Here's a local link to what the jurors thought: Gosnell Sentenced to 3 Life Terms, Jurors Open Up | NBC 10 Philadelphia
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Its sad we have to go to local news to find any information on the sentencing, but the Jody Arias had national coverage for months

Only way late term will stay legal if the pro choice keeps the truth about it from the public
 
I was reading earlier today an AP article in which the hope was expressed that the Gosnell trial could be the beginning of a dialogue between both sides of the abortion issue:

"The Gosnell case could serve as a fulcrum for more dialogue about abortion, said O. Carter Snead, a University of Notre Dame bioethicist and law professor.

'I would hope that people on both sides of the abortion debate, after this Gosnell atrocity ... would sit down and say we have to find a way to talk about this.... The fact that we've got such a paralyzed political system when it comes to this question leads to attorneys general, governors and others not doing anything in the face of obvious harm to the public...This is a grotesque wakeup call for us to sit down and have a hard conversation about a very difficult question."

Gosnell Case Fuels Bitter US Abortion Debate - ABC News

And then I read that it's not just DC with another "house of horrors." There may be one in Houston too:

Houston doctor accused of illegal abortions - Houston Chronicle
 
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