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Thread: Gates: Some Benghazi critics have "cartoonish" view of military capability

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    Re: Gates: Some Benghazi critics have "cartoonish" view of military capability

    Quote Originally Posted by mak2 View Post
    The jets are just one example of the lies from the right. The RWers have not proof the jets were ready to fly and the RW have presented none. They merely keep repeating the lie there were planes available. If Faux and the RWers lie about the jets, why do you believe anything they say? The fact you have heard there were jets over head really should make you wonder. I heard all kinds of stuff on faux from jets and armed drones overhead to units of Marines offshore that obama held back.
    Clearly America has jets flying around constantly with people always awaiting orders to quell any uprising we don't like or approve. Also, marines are sitting in hidden bunkers worldwide just waiting for the president to give them to "go" order.

    If people in the military tell you it's not probable we could have stopped an attack, they probably know what they're talking about. We can't stop every bad thing from happening to Americans abroad. Hell, we can't stop Americans from harming Americans with a police force that's at the ready 24hr a day 7 days a week.
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    Re: Gates: Some Benghazi critics have "cartoonish" view of military capability

    Quote Originally Posted by mak2 View Post
    I commented a while back I read in Janes the US was the only country in the world that could put firepower on any point in the world today (as in a 24 hour period) having boots 2-4 hours away from anywhere is almost impossible. There is only a limited amout of resources. Beef up one spot they attack another.
    The only real limit on our resources is our countries commitment to make resources available. We could and should have a greater availability of resources.

    Proper prioritization of resources is also a Leadership function. Our resources are not that limited. Unfortunately for us, for the last 20 years or so, politically and for Senior Officers, we have had a severe, self-induced lack of Quality leadership and ass-kissing is the number one skill determining an Officers ability to get promoted.
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    Re: Gates: Some Benghazi critics have "cartoonish" view of military capability

    Quote Originally Posted by mak2 View Post
    The jets are just one example of the lies from the right. The RWers have not proof the jets were ready to fly and the RW have presented none. They merely keep repeating the lie there were planes available. If Faux and the RWers lie about the jets, why do you believe anything they say? The fact you have heard there were jets over head really should make you wonder. I heard all kinds of stuff on faux from jets and armed drones overhead to units of Marines offshore that obama held back.
    You just dodged most of my post. Even if it were a lie perpetrated by the right, unlikely as it is, that doesn't dismiss the points I've made.
    Even if you don't believe these things, you have to admit that the rest of this is really fishy. I find the fact that so many people complain that these things are being noticed and acknowledged by the right disturbing because seriously, an obviously premeditated attack on a U.S. consulate on the anniversary of Sept. 11th was blamed on a trailer for a shoddy movie? Followed by very few details? Then threatening whistle-blowers? I believe that Obama personally, (that would just be silly) ordered the threatening of whistle-blowers, but his admin is, and he is responsible for the actions of his admin.

    This isn't just about the military action or inaction, this is more about the cover-up than anything.
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    Re: Gates: Some Benghazi critics have "cartoonish" view of military capability

    If the planes are not true, why should I believe anything else? I am not dodging, but not a lot else needs to be said. The rest, like the jets are probably made up so why discuss it further?
    Quote Originally Posted by Indeed View Post
    You just dodged most of my post. Even if it were a lie perpetrated by the right, unlikely as it is, that doesn't dismiss the points I've made.
    Even if you don't believe these things, you have to admit that the rest of this is really fishy. I find the fact that so many people complain that these things are being noticed and acknowledged by the right disturbing because seriously, an obviously premeditated attack on a U.S. consulate on the anniversary of Sept. 11th was blamed on a trailer for a shoddy movie? Followed by very few details? Then threatening whistle-blowers? I believe that Obama personally, (that would just be silly) ordered the threatening of whistle-blowers, but his admin is, and he is responsible for the actions of his admin.

    This isn't just about the military action or inaction, this is more about the cover-up than anything.
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    Re: Gates: Some Benghazi critics have "cartoonish" view of military capability

    Quote Originally Posted by mak2 View Post
    If the planes are not true, why should I believe anything else? I am not dodging, but not a lot else needs to be said. The rest, like the jets are probably made up so why discuss it further?
    Yes, you are dodging. You said that this was all to make obama look bad. Saying that if one thing is wrong then the rest must be wrong is a logical fallacy. Back your accusation or withdraw it.
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    Re: Gates: Some Benghazi critics have "cartoonish" view of military capability

    Oh great. Another Benghazi thread. *sigh*

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    Re: Gates: Some Benghazi critics have "cartoonish" view of military capability

    Quote Originally Posted by Tettsuo View Post
    Clearly America has jets flying around constantly with people always awaiting orders to quell any uprising we don't like or approve. Also, marines are sitting in hidden bunkers worldwide just waiting for the president to give them to "go" order.

    If people in the military tell you it's not probable we could have stopped an attack, they probably know what they're talking about. We can't stop every bad thing from happening to Americans abroad. Hell, we can't stop Americans from harming Americans with a police force that's at the ready 24hr a day 7 days a week.
    The military's ability to perform is reliant upon planning. Piss Poor Planning leads to Piss Poor Performance.

    All Gates addresses is the conditions of situation at the time it occurred, he does not address why those conditions existed in the first place. Since there is an investigation into a cover-up, then clearly someone, in the halls of power also assumes that improper actions were taken, otherwise, there would be no need for the cover-up.

    Comparison to crime is really misleading. True we cannot prevent bad things from happening, but when you have indications and intelligence indicating the possibility of something bad happening, that is not the same as a totally random act. It is also not surprising that many crimes are not a "surprise" to law enforcement. For any criminal act, most local law enforcement can give you a rather short list of who probably committed that particular crime. Some are indeed surprising and random, but far more often, the police already know ahead of time that such crimes will be committed and who will do them, they just have no legal means of preventing them.
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    Re: Gates: Some Benghazi critics have "cartoonish" view of military capability

    Quote Originally Posted by Unitedwestand13 View Post
    The problem was that no one knew the exact situation on the ground so there was not enough information to make a feasible plan.
    The problem with that notion, is that military operations are dangerous by their very nature. Special operators join special operations units knowing this and accepting the danger involved in being a member of a special operations team.

    That being said, you don't stand down your forces, because it's dangerous, or because someone might get hurt, or killed.

    No one is under the illusion that our servicemen are super human, or that they have no limitations. However, in the case of Benghazi, there wasn't ANY attempt made to relieve our people that were being attacked on the ground.

    The flaw that exists there, is made up of timidity and indecisiveness; shortcomings that will become a scurge on any fighting force.
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    Re: Gates: Some Benghazi critics have "cartoonish" view of military capability

    Quote Originally Posted by Unitedwestand13 View Post
    I can already hear the complaints about Gates being a turncoat.
    Gates is well known to be a "yes man." That's why Obama had him stay on the job for another four years. Leon Panetta is also known as being a "yes man." Both are capable of feeling at home under a Republican administration or a Democrat administration.

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    Re: Gates: Some Benghazi critics have "cartoonish" view of military capability

    Quote Originally Posted by fmw View Post
    Yes, good intelligence isn't always available. What they did know, however, is that an American facility was under attack. To do nothing was inexcusable. Period.
    It was under attack but they did not know exactly how many attackers there were or how well armed they were.

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