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Thread: IRS apologizes for inappropriately targeting conservative political groups[W:484,732]

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    Re: IRS apologizes for inappropriately targeting conservative political groups [W:484

    Quote Originally Posted by justabubba View Post
    hey, nick
    this was the IRS
    YES, it has to do with taxes

    in this case the matter was about organizations who sought TAX EXEMPTION status from the irs
    once the application was received the irs then had to determine whether the applicant's circumstance complied with the regulations
    thee regulations prevented tax exempt status for those organizations whose PRIMARY undertaking was involvement in political campaigns
    so, those applicants whose applications provided an indication that their PRIMARY activity MIGHT entail involvement in political campaigns were pushed into one pile for deeper examination to determine the degree of their political campaign involvement ... whether it was primary or secondary
    in the meantime, those who were charged with making those decisions asked the higher ups in irs for definition, a benchmark, to use to make such determinations
    the senior management displayed incompetence by dragging their collective feet in providing such much-requested technical guidance

    the majority of applicants who were placed in the deeper review stack were not organizations with names which would be assumed from conservative groups
    the irs commissioner at the time this occurred was a george w bush appointee
    the IG testified - under oath - that there was NO indication of political partisanship in the irs' actions, nor did he find white house or other agency involvement in this circumstance

    given that, you are going to be hard pressed to show us EVIDENCE of political hackery by the irs in this matter
    Now it's random stacks of paper?

    When are the excuses going to end? even the fracking president apologized and people are being fired over this scandal yet progressives are attempting to defend it?

    Funny how progressive organization weren't targeted.... So I suppose our government sorts paper via political ideology - democrats and republicans.

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    Re: IRS apologizes for inappropriately targeting conservative political groups [W:484

    Quote Originally Posted by Guy Incognito View Post
    Lolwut?


    Easy. Facebook posts can be very informative on the political plans of a group looking for tax exempt status. If they claim to be an issue advocacy group but their Facebook page does nothing but promote a candidate, that is grounds for denying the tax smelt status.

    You will just defend democrats no matter what.

    My facebook posts is none of the government ****ing business, that and they don't have ANY FINANICAL BENEFIT TO THE GOVERNMENT.

    I suppose what I post speaks volumes for where I stand on the political spectrum and that is what the IRS wants to know.

    This scandal isn't about taxes - it never was and everyone except the democrat fanboys realizes this.

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    Re: IRS apologizes for inappropriately targeting conservative political groups [W:484

    Ace of Spades HQ

    The Democrats only want to discuss whether the 501(c)4 rules should be tightened, that is, they don't want to talk about politically targeting at all. They are coming very, very close to flat-out justifying Obama's IRS' actions.

    Some small news: Steve Miller now admits the question asked of Lori Lerner was planted, walking back his previous ambiguity.

    The author of the IG Report notes that the IRS staffers who denied a political motivation in their targeting did so not under oath.

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    Re: IRS apologizes for inappropriately targeting conservative political groups [W:484

    When will people realize the governments interest is self preservation? and that they will takeout anyone and everyone that threatens their preservation?

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    Re: IRS apologizes for inappropriately targeting conservative political groups [W:484

    The author of the IG Report notes that the IRS staffers who denied a political motivation in their targeting did so not under oath.
    i remember him offering that observation
    effectively answering a question which had not been posed
    which betrayed his objectivity
    which may explain why he, in his IG report, characterized the setting aside of applications with politically indicative names as "targeting" which the acting commissioner, miller, did not
    and his lean is further demonstrated when the IG was asked if he found any hint of political partisanship in the IRS' employee actions - and he testified - under oath - that no such political partisanship was evident. so, it is difficult for me to then find that "targeting" actually happened


    now, back to the matter of the employees not answering the IG's questions under oath. had they not been federal employees, that may have been significant. however, federal employees who lie when asked for a response by a higher graded civil servant are subject to discipline for such lying, which discipline can include termination of employment and referral of the matter to DoJ for prosecution

    which then causes me to recognize that the 'not under oath' distinction of the IG was not a significant one. in fact, the IG, while conducting the investigation and questioning the veracity of answers provided by the employees, possessed the authority to then place them under oath and again ask the question. he did not do so, which tells me he accepted the legitimacy of the answers
    unfortunately, the D congressmen on the ways and means panel did not have the insight to ask the IG why he opted NOT to place any employee under oath where a concern about the truth existed. another wasted opportunity to expose the IG's bias for public viewing
    we are negotiating about dividing a pizza and in the meantime israel is eating it
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    Re: IRS apologizes for inappropriately targeting conservative political groups [W:484

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr.Nick View Post
    You will just defend democrats no matter what.

    My facebook posts is none of the government ****ing business, that and they don't have ANY FINANICAL BENEFIT TO THE GOVERNMENT.

    I suppose what I post speaks volumes for where I stand on the political spectrum and that is what the IRS wants to know.

    This scandal isn't about taxes - it never was and everyone except the democrat fanboys realizes this.
    I am not defending the government because I like the IRS. I am calling out your absurd and baseless accusations because I believe in truth over partisanship.

    There is no scandal here. And I hate to break it to you but the minute you apply for tax exempt status your Facebook page is fair game.

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    Re: IRS apologizes for inappropriately targeting conservative political groups [W:484

    Quote Originally Posted by OpportunityCost View Post
    Things left out.

    How many of the 74 of the 202 overscrutinized were right leaning.
    BOLO was the terminology for tea party, 9/12 etc type groups, they specifically looked for them to examine.

    Foot note 19 :


    All I can add is that this entire document was created by the Treasury who may be culpable for the fallout from the bad policy decisions. So Im going to say its not reliable enough to place your entire argument upon. There are a lot of statistics at work but there are also a lot of factors we dont know about.
    There's a phenomenon called selection bias. It's where we ignore or excuse evidence that we don't like because we don't like it. The IG report lists the facts as we know them now. You can't discard the IG report and expect anyone to take you seriously. This whole "scandal" is based on the IG report.

    First, the foot note you're referencing is 18, not 19. Second, it probably would have been useful to examine where it was referenced. In context it means that they were not able to determine which of the tea party cases were identified because they used the name tea party, and which were identified because of political activity. Let me repeat that, your footnote states that the IG was not able to identify any tea party groups which were improperly investigated based solely on the inappropriate criteria in the "Be on the Lookout" list.

    However, it is certainly the type of sentence someone who had a bad case of selection bias might latch on to. The kind of thing someone would pick up on when the didn't want to face the reality of the report.

    Third, your question (How many of the 74 of the 202 overscrutinized were right leaning) makes no sense.
    79 of 96 tea party groups were properly scrutinized
    17 of 96 tea party groups were improperly scrutinized.
    128 of 202 non tea party groups were properly scrutinized.
    74 of 202 non tea party groups were improperly scrutinized.

    I gave you the report. I gave you the page numbers, I pulled the relevent sections out, then I highlighted the numbers, then I walked you through the calculations. It's fine that you're not interested in them. But if you're going to ask someone to go through that much effort, you kind of owe it to them to at least think about what you asked for.

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    Re: IRS apologizes for inappropriately targeting conservative political groups in 201

    Quote Originally Posted by joko104 View Post
    Apology is not sufficient. Anyone involved should be criminally prosecuted for civil rights violations and official oppression. The IRS should be sued for civil damages.
    That is ridiculous. The singling out of conservative groups for review is arguably unconstitutional, but it is not criminal. And the IRS likely has sovereign immunity to civil claims in this case.

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    Re: IRS apologizes for inappropriately targeting conservative political groups in 201

    Quote Originally Posted by joko104 View Post
    Apology is not sufficient. Anyone involved should be criminally prosecuted for civil rights violations and official oppression. The IRS should be sued for civil damages.
    that someone who posts such ignorant bull**** wears a badge is of concern
    but ally my concern
    share with us evidence of civil rights violations and official oppression
    we are negotiating about dividing a pizza and in the meantime israel is eating it
    once you're over the hill you begin to pick up speed

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    Re: IRS apologizes for inappropriately targeting conservative political groups in 201

    Quote Originally Posted by justabubba View Post
    that someone who posts such ignorant bull**** wears a badge is of concern
    but ally my concern
    share with us evidence of civil rights violations and official oppression
    That's part of the investigation isn't it?
    "He who does not think himself worth saving from poverty and ignorance by his own efforts, will hardly be thought worth the efforts of anybody else." -- Frederick Douglass, Self-Made Men (1872)
    "Fly-over" country voted, and The Donald is now POTUS.

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