Jason Collins (NBA Center) announces that he is gay, altering the landscape of sports

Re: Jason Collins (NBA Center) announces that he is gay, altering the landscape of sp

ChrisL said:

What's especially annoying to me is that we have a "war" going on in Afghanistan, we have problems with NK, Iran, etc., children are abducted, missing, abused, killed, yet THIS is one of the top stories on the news? Really? :roll:

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Liberals are an incredibly needy me-me-me lot. Acceptance and equality isn't the real goal of the gay community as much as just making sure they're on stage 24/7. (Certainly, there is a more lowkey faction of the gay community, but they don't get the pub and press.)

But you're spot on. The world is at a very critical juncture right now, and all hell is going to break loose in the not-to-distance future. We're in for some violent times, both within the U.S., and across the globe. And yet, the headlines are grabbed by gay NBA players, gun control, Kim Kardashian, and Lindsey Lohan.

Re: Jason Collins (NBA Center) announces that he is gay, altering the landscape of sp

AGENT J said:

already done, read the post, there was no instrument needed nor is there (strawman) only the words of ex and current players some of the top players and the words of the coaches, owners and president of the league.

The debate is "was there an impact, was there change" the answer is YES
he tried to reframe this a lot, just like you are trying now but it failed.

Try to understand for the impact not to be true all those people would have to be wrong a lying, who gets to determine if there was an impact or not if not them LOL their feelings make the impact true. Or maybe its conspiracy theory. Maybe the NBA planned 9/11, faked Obamas birth certificate and framed the boston bombers too. LOL

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So there was an impact? A few vocal in support of Collins coming out, but what of the 100's perhaps 1000's that laughed and scoffed with friends privately? What about the few brave enough to vocalize that Collins coming out will have deleterious effects in locker rooms, hazing, teasing etc.. So my question is a legitimate one. Was the impact generally positive or negative, and how do you know? Additionally, you say there was change? What changed? Can you articulate any of what your saying to any degree of credibility using logic and sound reasoning?


Tim-

Re: Jason Collins (NBA Center) announces that he is gay, altering the landscape of sp

Erod said:

Liberals are an incredibly needy me-me-me lot. Acceptance and equality isn't the real goal of the gay community as much as just making sure they're on stage 24/7. (Certainly, there is a more lowkey faction of the gay community, but they don't get the pub and press.)

But you're spot on. The world is at a very critical juncture right now, and all hell is going to break loose in the not-to-distance future. We're in for some violent times, both within the U.S., and across the globe. And yet, the headlines are grabbed by gay NBA players, gun control, Kim Kardashian, and Lindsey Lohan.

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I just think about all of the things that are happening in the world right now and all of the problems that we are facing as a nation, and it disgusts me that a lot of headlines should actually be in tabloid magazines and NOT included in our nightly news, etc.

Re: Jason Collins (NBA Center) announces that he is gay, altering the landscape of sp

Hatuey said:

The biggest myth perpetuated by homophobes is that gay men have any interest in looking at straight dicks in a changing room. It's the same kind of egotistical thinking that allows hormonally weak men to pretend that women want to see them naked in nonsexual circumstances.

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I don't think it's ego as much as it's just guys being...well...guys and being ignorantly short sighted to think people don't all think like they do.

Go up to 100 straight males. Tell them they can change in the lockerroom with women in good physical shape. Ask them if they'll be taking peaks at all the tits.

I'm going to guess that, if answered honestly, you'd get an overwhelming majority that would say "yes".

So most likely it's less ego and more a guy going "Well...if I was in a lockerroom with athletic people of the sex I was attracted to, I'd look. So that means a gay guy in a locker room with athletic people of the sex he's attracted to will probalby look too".

Now, there's probably some ego involved in thinking the guy would be looking SPECIFICALLY at the person...but the general notion isn't one of ego, but just simple projection.

Re: Jason Collins (NBA Center) announces that he is gay, altering the landscape of sp

I don't know about you guys and gals, but knowing what Jason Collins likes to do with his penis has really changed my opinion of him as a basketball player...

Re: Jason Collins (NBA Center) announces that he is gay, altering the landscape of sp

Hatuey said:

You still can't comprehend what you're reading. I'm saying that if you feel gay men are chasing you, it's probably because you've grown up to believe that women are also chasing you. When in reality, it's far from the truth and nobody is chasing you. In the end, it adds up. The majority of people against gay marriage are low class, protestants. Not higher class intellectuals. So they're trying to pretend that their failure in intellectual, social circles don't exist by claiming that everyone who could be attracted to them will be attracted to them.



We can't compare investment portfolios? Check stubs? What about income?

Gay Couples More Educated, Higher-Income Than Heterosexual Couples - US News and World Report



Gay people earn more, owe less - Dec. 6, 2012

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You're making a strawman argument regarding men feeling like they're the targets of gay men. That's simply not true. It's the sexual genetic deviance itself that is the gorilla in the room - or locker room in this instance - not a perceived "threat". Homosexuality is not normal, as much as you desperately want it to be. It's a mutation for some, a choice for others, but it's not normal. THAT is what weirds sexually normal people out, some more than others.

I know and like a few gay people. But that doesn't mean I recognize or accept their lifestyle as everyday ho-hum normal.

Regarding your obsession with this idiotic educational/financial concoction of a "study", think about how utterly preposterous it is to (1) believe an accurate "study" is even possible of something like this, and (2) that a sexual mutation like this can translate into higher education and financial responsibility. LOL

That's a PRIME example of engineering a study to exactly what you want it to reflect, then feeding it to the needy who desperately want it to be true. Today's "scientific studies" are most often predetermined opinions added to manipulated data.

How you use your anus doesn't mean you understand quantum physics and the stock market better. LOL

Re: Jason Collins (NBA Center) announces that he is gay, altering the landscape of sp

TheNextEra said:

LOL I love conservatives, they complain about two gay guys, but then quickly go in the back of their house and masterbate to two women going at it. go figure.

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Eh, again...kind of like the locker room thing...this is another of those instances where people are so invested in this that they must reject reason or the desire to honestly think and instead must go full on "belittle the other side". Not your specific statement, but many like it I've heard.

It's funny that in a conversation about sexual orientation and what people find attractive, some people flip their **** and immeidetely go to bigotry if someone finds two guys kissing to be unattractive or a turn off or gross. For some people, sure, it MAY be a moral thing. For other people it may simply be a matter of what's visually appealing.

I enjoy seeing two women kiss now. About a decade ago, it was one of the biggest turn offs possible and disgusted me. My high school girlfriend had gone off to an all girls college and cheated on me with a girl, ending our relationship. However, my "disgust" at the sight wasn't a moral disdain for lesbianism....it was a visual cue to the negative feelings of that relationship.

I don't particularly enjoy the sight of two guys kissing passionately. Then again, I don't particularly enjoy the sight of my parents pashionately kissing either. Nor do I enjoy the sight of two significantly large or unattractive people kissing passionately. Or a really old person passionately kissing a really young one. All of those ellicite a similar "meh" to "eww" response to me. Does that mean I hate gays or my parents? Or is it because I don't find it visually appealing in an aesthetic or sexual way and thus have a negative reaction to it?

Similar to my issues with the race discussion...I think FAR to often there is great over reach, massive over reaction, and intense stereotyping on the PRO side of things that it basically damages and weakens the ability to actually go after the reasonable and real problems when they come up. So many seem to exhibit a full on scorched earth policy where all things someone that disagrees with you says must be made out to be born of the most negative and harmful of intentions so that the person can claim their full moral superiority to themselves.

TheNextEra said:

Well you might be right there. I refer to gays as homosexuals, but that's just me. Either way I still think its funny that conservatives complain about how acting on homosexuality is such a sin, but they have no problem masterbating to lesbians. Just saying.

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It's funny that you go with the blatant, across the board, prejudice towards conservatives by declaring what "they" complain about in a post seemingly based around your unhappiness with bigotry born of prejudice.

Re: Jason Collins (NBA Center) announces that he is gay, altering the landscape of sp

RGIII chimes in...

RGIII: Americans ‘Held Hostage By The Tyranny Of Political Correctness’ « CBS DC

Bravo from a Cowboys fan.

Re: Jason Collins (NBA Center) announces that he is gay, altering the landscape of sp

Hicup said:

What I find odd with the people honoring this mans brave announcement is the seemingly total disregard for the character that he must be to date a women for 7 years only to ditch her hopes and dreams for the spotlight of gay-come-outism.

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So you find it odd that people don't react based off you baseless assumption stated as fact?

Man, a lot of things must appear "odd" to you.

As to the actual issue...hard to say without knowing stuff about the woman. Not to mention the enormous complexity mentally that would go into a situation like his. By the sounds of his admission, it seemed he's been fighting with his feelings and views for some time. By the sounds of it once he came to an understanding of what he was feeling and who he was, he ended the relationship. That seems to be a rather reasonable and responsible way of handling it.

Re: Jason Collins (NBA Center) announces that he is gay, altering the landscape of sp

Good for him - very gutsy, imo.

It would have been even more gutsy if he was near the beginning of his career and not near the end (he is 34 and - I believe - currently not under contract to any team)...but that is nit picking.

Hopefully, this will make things much easier for gays/lesbians in sports.

Re: Jason Collins (NBA Center) announces that he is gay, altering the landscape of sp

Erod said:

RGIII chimes in...

RGIII: Americans ‘Held Hostage By The Tyranny Of Political Correctness’ « CBS DC

Bravo from a Cowboys fan.

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ALRIGHT...was waiting for this to come up.

No....no RG3 did not CHIME in. What we have here is an issue of Scrotie McBoogerballs

His comment was in a string of comments relating to a stupid story pushed by NFL.com in the past few days.

While at the Draft Day party...in front of fans and not seemingly national media...RG3 was asked about what games were most memorable. He brought up the division clinching final game, and also the thanksgiving game. He made a reference to the chants of "RG3" at Texas Stadium when the crowd at Fedex started to chant it, and made a statement along the lines that during the Thanksgiving game the Redskins made "Dallas their home".

An NFL.com writer heard about it and wrote a story on it...which got a TON of hate from Cowboy fans in the comments wishing injury on RG3 and people criticizing him for saying it or giving "bulletin board material".

Here was the entire exchange on Twitter

Robert Griffin III ‏@RGIII
You ever say something & people interpret it a certain way but you didn't mean it that way but meant it how you said it??? Yea...

Brent ‏@BRCope81
@RGIII like making Dallas home?

Robert Griffin III ‏@RGIII
@BRCope81 Exactly lol among others

Robert Griffin III ‏@RGIII
In a land of freedom we are held hostage by the tyranny of political correctness

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It just unfortunate that people happen to see the single quote and ran with it. I've seen people state that RG3 was talking about everything from Jason Collins to the dumbass Washington Councilman who wants the Skins to change their name to the "Redtails". However, in context, it's clearly in relation to the reaction to his quote about Dallas.

Re: Jason Collins (NBA Center) announces that he is gay, altering the landscape of sp

jmotivator said:

I don't know about you guys and gals, but knowing what Jason Collins likes to do with his penis has really changed my opinion of him as a basketball player...

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Well, we all know what Michael Jordan likes to do with his....

Re: Jason Collins (NBA Center) announces that he is gay, altering the landscape of sp

tererun said:

It will be nice when the rush of gay people in sports comes out. Really, most sports boil down to the completely gay male concept of trying to play grabby with your opponents balls anyway. Still, it should lead to a number of other players coming out as long as he doesn't get tebowed. There will be a backlash that will help illustrate the bigotry and hate in america more and more and show how sad and pathetic hating gays really is.

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So I guess they'll have to paint pink lillies on the court. :mrgreen:

Re: Jason Collins (NBA Center) announces that he is gay, altering the landscape of sp

OscarB63 said:

he was a terrible player. the fact that he is gay is irrelevent.

In other headline-making, earth shattering, landscape of sport altering news... NASCAR pit crew tire changer Christmas Abbott comes out and admits she is female

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1. A terrible player doesn't stay in the NBA for over a decade. He's not a superstar, but he's been a solid role player filling a role most teams like to have...big man depth.

2. The fact he's gay is irrelevant to the type of player he is. That doesn't mean the fact he's gay is irrelevent in and of itself however

Also, I get your attempt at a joke at the end but it's highlighting the problem in your argument here. The fact this IS making headlines and is getting talked about and has been getting such attention means it's at least somewhat note worthy within the public consiousness. I don't think it will have a lasting impact or a sizable mark in history due to him being quasi-active at this point, on the very tail end of his career at best, and not a "sexy" name or even a well known one. But that doesn't mean the immediete impact and scope isn't at least buzz generating and of some note.

Re: Jason Collins (NBA Center) announces that he is gay, altering the landscape of sp

DA60 said:

Good for him - very gutsy, imo..

It would have been even more gutsy if he was near the beginning of his career and not near the end (he is 34 and - I believe - currently not under contract to any team).

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Gutsy? How about opportunistic posturing. Self-serving.

He just went from an NBA no-name to a HUGE celebrity right before his playing days are over.

Re: Jason Collins (NBA Center) announces that he is gay, altering the landscape of sp

American said:

So I guess they'll have to paint pink lillies on the court. :mrgreen:

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I'm thinking fuschia or avacado green.

Re: Jason Collins (NBA Center) announces that he is gay, altering the landscape of sp

Zyphlin said:

ALRIGHT...was waiting for this to come up.

No....no RG3 did not CHIME in. What we have here is an issue of Scrotie McBoogerballs

His comment was in a string of comments relating to a stupid story pushed by NFL.com in the past few days.

While at the Draft Day party...in front of fans and not seemingly national media...RG3 was asked about what games were most memorable. He brought up the division clinching final game, and also the thanksgiving game. He made a reference to the chants of "RG3" at Texas Stadium when the crowd at Fedex started to chant it, and made a statement along the lines that during the Thanksgiving game the Redskins made "Dallas their home".

An NFL.com writer heard about it and wrote a story on it...which got a TON of hate from Cowboy fans in the comments wishing injury on RG3 and people criticizing him for saying it or giving "bulletin board material".

Here was the entire exchange on Twitter



It just unfortunate that people happen to see the single quote and ran with it. I've seen people state that RG3 was talking about everything from Jason Collins to the dumbass Washington Councilman who wants the Skins to change their name to the "Redtails". However, in context, it's clearly in relation to the reaction to his quote about Dallas.

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OK, he didn't chime in. My bad. But his comment was universally true.

Re: Jason Collins (NBA Center) announces that he is gay, altering the landscape of sp

Tucker Case said:

He's not a professional basketball player now?

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He is in a technical sense. Then again, Kordell Stewart was technically a professional football player until 2012 and Terrell Owens still is technically one.

It's being made out he's an active player. His team's season is over and he's not under contract for next year. The notion of "active" is a rather thin one. And I think has the potential for good but ALSO the potential for bad in terms of moving forward, because I believe it sets up the potential for people to start screaming about him being black balled for being gay if he's not picked up next year which I don't think will actually help matters if it happens.

Again, I hope he inspires others to come out if they're in the closet and in pro sports. It would suck to live life that way. I'm happy he's able to be honest now and do think this will have some short term impact. But for all the desire to point out the "first" to break a barrier, I just don't think this is going to have the lasting and magnitude of impact some people think it will because of the way the American public generally is in terms of sports, causes, and stories. That doesn't mean I think he shouldn't have came out, or that I blame Sports Illustrated for running a story...but I also don't think this is going to by the guy whose essentially looked at as the homosexual equivilent of Jackie Robinson. If that ignorantly makes me a homophobe, then so be it. If it doesn't, then it speaks to your prejudice in this thread broadly suggesting everyone talking about his stats are just homophobes who dislike "faggots" getting "uppity"

Re: Jason Collins (NBA Center) announces that he is gay, altering the landscape of sp

Erod said:

Gutsy? How about opportunistic posturing. Self-serving.

He just went from an NBA no-name to a HUGE celebrity right before his playing days are over.

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Maybe, maybe not.

I am going to give him the benefit of the doubt until I have unbiased, factual evidence to the contrary.

And unless you know him personally AND he told you why he did it...you cannot know what his motives were. You can only guess.


But even if his motives were less then honorable - who cares.

He has probably helped other gays in sports - so good for him (whatever his motives).

Re: Jason Collins (NBA Center) announces that he is gay, altering the landscape of sp

Erod said:

OK, he didn't chime in. My bad. But his comment was universally true.

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LOL. No problem. In the immortal words of TO..."That's my quarterback"...had to just make sure the record was set straight

Re: Jason Collins (NBA Center) announces that he is gay, altering the landscape of sp

StillBallin75 said:

I'd say it's a 50-50 tossup that he's back in an NBA uniform next season.

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Based on his declining minutes (he's averaging half the amount of time he played at the start of his career), his age, and the fact he was latched onto one of the worst franchises in the league this year I'd probably put it a little less than 50-50. But yeah, it's not unreasonable odds to think he'd be back next year or be at home REGARDLESS of him coming out. Which was my point earlier in terms of bringing up stats..it wasn't a clear likelihood that he'd be back even before he came out, so I'm not looking forward to the potential cries of "bigotry" if he's not signed and people lamenting how it's a sign America hasn't really moved forward.

Re: Jason Collins (NBA Center) announces that he is gay, altering the landscape of sp

Zyphlin said:

So you find it odd that people don't react based off you baseless assumption stated as fact?

Man, a lot of things must appear "odd" to you.

As to the actual issue...hard to say without knowing stuff about the woman. Not to mention the enormous complexity mentally that would go into a situation like his. By the sounds of his admission, it seemed he's been fighting with his feelings and views for some time. By the sounds of it once he came to an understanding of what he was feeling and who he was, he ended the relationship. That seems to be a rather reasonable and responsible way of handling it.

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And you believe that? Instead he didn't go to her first, NO, she found out just like everyone else did FROM THE NEWS!!

So now who's making assumptions, Zyph? Don't shoot down my more astute assumption with your reckless one's and expect acquiescence from me.


Tim-

Re: Jason Collins (NBA Center) announces that he is gay, altering the landscape of sp

Tucker Case said:

He did alter the landscape of sports. A landscape that had no openly gay players in it now has one openly gay player in it.

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Well...."alter the landscape of [the big four men's] sport."

I can't lie, I chuckled seeing someone say Britney Griner is still the most talented gay basketball player. It was a good twitter zing.

Re: Jason Collins (NBA Center) announces that he is gay, altering the landscape of sp

Hicup said:

And you believe that? Instead he didn't go to her first, NO, she found out just like everyone else did FROM THE NEWS!!

So now who's making assumptions, Zyph? Don't shoot down my more astute assumption with your reckless one's and expect acquiescence from me.

Tim-

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Notice where I'm saying it's hard to say without knowing the enormous complexity going on mentally in his situation? And how I used words like "seemed" to suggest that what I was saying was my guess based off his words? Yes, I made an assumption...and PRESENTED it and stated it in a way that made it clear it was an assumption.

Now go back to your post where you state your assumption as if it's a fact. That's the issue. You want to make an assumption and a guess as to why he did it and provide evidence to back it up? Sure, go ahead. I may disagree with you as may others, but that's what we're all doing here...speculating. But if you ignorantly want to proclaim your assumption as some kind of actual truth and then muse how "odd" it is that people aren't reacting the same way to you, as if your view of it is somehow the unquestioned truth, then yeah...I'll call bull****.

But thanks for the sad attempt to equate what I posted to what you posted...it was good for a laugh.

Re: Jason Collins (NBA Center) announces that he is gay, altering the landscape of sp

rocket88 said:

Well, we all know what Michael Jordan likes to do with his....

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It was better when we didn't.