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Thread: Boston Marathon bombing suspect caught after day-long manhunt

  1. #141
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    Re: Boston Marathon bombing suspect caught after day-long manhunt

    Quote Originally Posted by Crosscheck View Post
    But I disagree this might embolden other terrorists when they realize we will do everything possible to catch you ass even if it means shutting down a town.
    What about terrorists that don't care about getting caught and that just want to cause chaos and terror towards their political goals? It says to them: "come to America with a friend, make a pipe bomb, and shut down a major city for a day".

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    Re: Boston Marathon bombing suspect caught after day-long manhunt

    Quote Originally Posted by Moot View Post
    No, you're the one demanding proof and having this all wrapped like it was a CSI episode. You're claiming the lock down was over reacting because they didn't have any evidence. And yet, they knew they had at least two bombers on the loose and no idea for a motive. It's what they didn't know that demanded caution. Who were they, were they connected to a larger terror cell, did they have accomplices, were there more bombs planted throughout the city, how heavily armed were they, etc? You're trying to say that being cautious before the facts come in and protecting the public translates into the bad guys winning. You couldn't be more wrong, eco.

    If the cops weren't doing everything they could to catch those two and they killed more people, who do you think the public would blame? On another thread, the OP is already trying to blame the FBI and HS for not catching them "before" they commited the crime.
    You're confused. I do not need evidence to make a negative claim. Lacking evidence otherwise, it is entirely reasonable to claim they were untrained. That's basic logic.

    I don't know what the FBI knew then and I cannot speculate to such. I'm merely stating the facts as they stand or (perhaps, we'll see) stood.
    Last edited by ecofarm; 04-21-13 at 02:32 AM.

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    Re: Boston Marathon bombing suspect caught after day-long manhunt

    Quote Originally Posted by ecofarm View Post
    What about terrorists that don't care about getting caught and that just want to cause chaos and terror towards their political goals? It says to them: "come to America with a friend, make a pipe bomb, and shut down a major city for a day".
    The words I bolded show that even you realize that "creating terror" is not their goal, but just a means to an end.
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    Re: Boston Marathon bombing suspect caught after day-long manhunt

    Quote Originally Posted by ecofarm View Post
    You're confused. I do not need evidence to make a negative claim. That's basic logic. Lacking evidence otherwise, it is entirely reasonable to claim they were untrained. You can't refute logic.
    You didn't make a negative claim. You claimed that the authorities over-reacted. That's a positive claim

    The facts show that they didn't over-react.
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  5. #145
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    Re: Boston Marathon bombing suspect caught after day-long manhunt

    Quote Originally Posted by sangha View Post
    The words I bolded show that even you realize that "creating terror" is not their goal, but just a means to an end.
    It's a goal.

    For example: Someone's goal can be to build a house. And their goal this week could be to get the walls up. Just because the walls do not complete the house does not mean that completeing the walls is not a goal. Your attempt at semantic BS is weak sauce.

    One thing we know about terrorists is that one of their goals, if not the end goal, is to create terror.

  6. #146
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    Re: Boston Marathon bombing suspect caught after day-long manhunt

    Quote Originally Posted by sangha View Post
    You didn't make a negative claim. You claimed that the authorities over-reacted. That's a positive claim

    The facts show that they didn't over-react.
    You've confused two different claims. My negative claim was that the guy and his kid brother were not trained. As I had not seen any evidence to the contrary, it was a perfectly logical and reasonable claim to make.

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    Re: Boston Marathon bombing suspect caught after day-long manhunt

    Quote Originally Posted by ecofarm View Post
    You've confused two different claims. My negative claim was that the guy and his kid brother were not trained. As I had not seen any evidence to the contrary, it was a perfectly logical and reasonable claim to make.
    There is more evidence to suggest the older brother, Tamerlan may have had some kind of training than there is that he didn't....

    "...In early 2011, a foreign government asked the FBI for information about Tamerlan Tsarnaev. The request stated that it was based on information that he was a follower of radical Islam and a strong believer, and that he had changed drastically since 2010 as he prepared to leave the United States for travel to the country’s region to join unspecified underground groups.....
    FBI — Updates on Investigation Into Multiple Explosions in Boston


    "...Police said last night (FRI) they were carrying out at least one controlled explosion on Norfolk Street, in Cambridge, not far from where the bombers reportedly share a home.

    As well as the two bombs that killed three people at the Marathon, authorities will carefully analyse the latest explosives to figure out how they were built and whether the brothers received help from outside.

    The analysis is likely to take place at the government's specialist lab at Quantico, Virginia...."
    Boston bombs: the 'small arsenal' of weapons suspects 'used against police' - Telegraph


    "...A source close to the investigation said: “We have no doubt the brothers were not acting alone. The devices used to detonate the two bombs were highly sophisticated and not the kind of thing people learn from Google.

    “They were too advanced. Someone gave the brothers the skills and it is now our job to find out just who they were. Agents think the sleeper cell has up to a dozen members and has been waiting several years for their day to come.”...
    Boston bombers: FBI hunting 12-strong terrorist


    Where would he have tested his bomb making skills?

  8. #148
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    Re: Boston Marathon bombing suspect caught after day-long manhunt

    Quote Originally Posted by Moot View Post
    There is more evidence to suggest the older brother, Tamerlan may have had some kind of training than there is that he didn't....

    "...In early 2011, a foreign government asked the FBI for information about Tamerlan Tsarnaev. The request stated that it was based on information that he was a follower of radical Islam and a strong believer, and that he had changed drastically since 2010 as he prepared to leave the United States for travel to the country’s region to join unspecified underground groups.....
    FBI — Updates on Investigation Into Multiple Explosions in Boston


    "...Police said last night (FRI) they were carrying out at least one controlled explosion on Norfolk Street, in Cambridge, not far from where the bombers reportedly share a home.

    As well as the two bombs that killed three people at the Marathon, authorities will carefully analyse the latest explosives to figure out how they were built and whether the brothers received help from outside.

    The analysis is likely to take place at the government's specialist lab at Quantico, Virginia...."
    Boston bombs: the 'small arsenal' of weapons suspects 'used against police' - Telegraph


    "...A source close to the investigation said: “We have no doubt the brothers were not acting alone. The devices used to detonate the two bombs were highly sophisticated and not the kind of thing people learn from Google.

    “They were too advanced. Someone gave the brothers the skills and it is now our job to find out just who they were. Agents think the sleeper cell has up to a dozen members and has been waiting several years for their day to come.”...
    Boston bombers: FBI hunting 12-strong terrorist


    Where would he have tested his bomb making skills?
    The first citation I had not seen or heard of in terms of "unspecified underground groups"; I had only seen that the older brother (or both?) had been to Chechnya recently. The second I had not seen and it does not really claim there was training (it speculates so, based on the home-made bombs). The last citation I did not see prior to making the claim that they were untrained (and it's from a UK tabloid).

    Obviously, we are still waiting for what, if any, training they received. While we cannot be sure they had significant training, I would not make the claim that they were completely untrained in light of those citations (though the last hardly counts as a source in general and is only considerable due to the other citations).

    At any rate, I was speaking of training in combat operations (and they may have had some of that as well, we'll see).
    Last edited by ecofarm; 04-21-13 at 04:16 AM.

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    Re: Boston Marathon bombing suspect caught after day-long manhunt

    Quote Originally Posted by Crosscheck View Post
    Does it really look like these two brothers won?

    Locking down the city prevented an escape of the criminal by blending in with "the crowd".


    it cost an estimated 333 million to close Boston down for the day not to mention the disruption it would of caused businesses, commuters etc all to capture a 19 year old kid who had no where to go, of course the terrorists won they caused maximum political and economic damage with 2 small bombs.
    ‘This is not peace, it is an armistice for 20 years.’ (Ferdinand Foch. After the Treaty of Versailles, 1919).

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    Re: Boston Marathon bombing suspect caught after day-long manhunt

    Quote Originally Posted by Higgins86 View Post
    it cost an estimated 333 million to close Boston down for the day not to mention the disruption it would of caused businesses, commuters etc all to capture a 19 year old kid who had no where to go, of course the terrorists won they caused maximum political and economic damage with 2 small bombs.
    Don't forget the cost of 3 dead and over 160 people maimed and injured....and two dead police officers.

    I note that the Boston police didn't call in the state police and national guard until one of their own was killed.
    Last edited by Moot; 04-21-13 at 09:49 AM.

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