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Thread: NRA unveils plan for armed guards in schools it says 'will save lives'

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    Re: NRA unveils plan for armed guards in schools it says 'will save lives'

    Quote Originally Posted by Slyfox696 View Post
    Yes, I did. I explained it, it's not my fault if you didn't read it.
    I'm in the process of going back through our entire exchange on this thread...so far I haven't seen you give me any explanation of how a student/teacher relationship is harmed....

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    Re: NRA unveils plan for armed guards in schools it says 'will save lives'

    Quote Originally Posted by Slyfox696 View Post
    Because we were talking about the relationship between teacher and student, and how a gun changes that. It had nothing to do with a school intruder, only the every day relationship between student and teacher.
    Quote Originally Posted by Slyfox696 View Post
    We were not discussing gun control, we were discussing whether we arm teachers and the change it would cause to the relationship dynamic.
    Quote Originally Posted by Slyfox696 View Post
    Again, you dishonestly change the context of my comment. My statement was in response to what kids know and how it relates to the relationship I have with the student. I said I cannot control certain factors which might impact that relationship, but I can control whether or not the relationship between the student and me involves a gun.
    Quote Originally Posted by Slyfox696 View Post
    But bring a firearm into the equation and the dynamic in the relationship changes dramatically
    Quote Originally Posted by Slyfox696 View Post
    A big part of my job is forming quality relationships with students which allows me to teach them and for them to learn from me. Not every relationship has to be friendly, but all need to include respect. And the respect needs to be for me, not the gun.
    You haven't given an explanation of how that's true, but that's ok because I'm not arguing that you should be required to carry a gun. I support SD's Sentinel program in part because it's completely voluntary. If you feel that you having a gun on your person will interfere with your ability to teach in any way, you are free to not carry a gun. Other teachers have the freedom to make a different choice.

    Additionally, SD's Sentinels aren't only teachers, but any district employee at all. A Sentinel could be a mechanic from the Bus Yard who was called because a bus had a problem while waiting to pick up the evening children. A Sentinel could be a lunch lady washing dishes in the back of the kitchen. A Sentinel could be an accountant from the district office who came by to pick up the proceeds from a charity drive. It's unreasonable to assume that a given Sentinel would have any kind of relationship with a given student in the first place.

    Also, just because you enroll in the Sentinel program does not mean you have to carry a gun all the time. You can choose to not carry a gun while teaching your everyday class, yet choose to carry a gun while attending a foot-ball game or field trip. That's ok. We want to give educators options and flexibility. You simply have more options now. You can still elect not to partake.

    Quote Originally Posted by Slyfox696 View Post
    Oh really? So when the law allows Adam Lanza's mother to purchase the weapons which killed those children, you don't support those laws?
    That rifle was perchesed during CT's last Assault Weapons Ban and was Assault Weapons Ban Compliant. No, I do not support Assault Weapon Bans.
    That rifle was registered to Ms. Lansa. No, I do not support registration.
    Last edited by Jerry; 04-06-13 at 12:10 AM.

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    Re: NRA unveils plan for armed guards in schools it says 'will save lives'

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry View Post
    It's just so much safer/cheaper/easier for folks to keep their gun on their person. We just skip past all the liability and lock-boxes and code words etc and cut right to it.

    You want to add all this red tape and it just not called for.
    Again normal people generally don't want to be around weapons that can kill or maim you. Funny that.

    Now if you're saying boomsticklovers aren't normal, I tend to agree with you. We just shouldn't indulge them.

    Again, go to Starbucks and strut around with a gun. Maybe you can be a Starbuck's Sentinel. It's better than a school.

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    Re: NRA unveils plan for armed guards in schools it says 'will save lives'

    Quote Originally Posted by head of joaquin View Post
    Again normal people generally don't want to be around weapons that can kill or maim you. Funny that.

    Now if you're saying boomsticklovers aren't normal, I tend to agree with you. We just shouldn't indulge them.

    Again, go to Starbucks and strut around with a gun. Maybe you can be a Starbuck's Sentinel. It's better than a school.
    You tried those lines already. It's not doin it for me. I'm left-handed, so I'm abnormal by default. I can change my eye color at will, that also makes me abnormal. I guess I just don't care if I'm 'normal' or not. I've been in the Guard for 3 years, a year of that over seas where weapons were literally everywhere. Normal people don't join the service. Only about 1% does, and that by definition isn't 'normal'.

    Owning at least one gun in SD is very normal, though, as is carrying a concealed gun on your person normal in SD.
    Last edited by Jerry; 04-06-13 at 01:29 AM.

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    Re: NRA unveils plan for armed guards in schools it says 'will save lives'

    The bottom line is: gun control is going down in flames despite the Sandy Hook massacre.

    Thank-God.

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    Re: NRA unveils plan for armed guards in schools it says 'will save lives'

    Quote Originally Posted by Robert Morrow View Post
    The bottom line is: gun control is going down in flames despite the Sandy Hook massacre.

    Thank-God.
    Good news everyone.....
    Pro-Gun Laws Gain Ground

    Arkansas eliminated prohibitions on carrying firearms in churches and on college campuses. South Dakota authorized school boards to arm teachers. Tennessee passed a law allowing workers to bring guns to work and store them in their vehicles, even if their employer objects. Kentucky shortened the process for obtaining licenses to carry a concealed gun......This year, five states have passed seven laws that strengthen gun restrictions, while 10 states have passed 17 laws that weaken them, according to the Law Center to Prevent Gun Violence, which tracks and promotes gun-control laws.


    ....and this is what I've been talking about:
    South Dakota, SD H 1087: Authorizes school boards to allow the arming of school employees or security personnel after obtaining the consent of local law enforcement.
    Last edited by Jerry; 04-06-13 at 02:28 AM.

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    Re: NRA unveils plan for armed guards in schools it says 'will save lives'

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry View Post
    You said it was so, but you didn't explain how, you didn't offer supporting links, nothing.
    Yes, I did. Post 242.

    Quote Originally Posted by MadLib View Post
    And it's not like the shooter's gonna teleport into the classroom as soon as he starts attacking. A guard will see him on the security cameras, and the PA will announce "The superintendent is in the building." Teachers unlock their guns and lock the door. They'll be well-prepared to shoot the maniac the moment he enters the door.
    Actually, schools are going away from the codeword to just simply announcing what is happening. The codeword is kind of pointless, if you really stop to think about it (for example, the shooter is usually pretty certain where he/she is). It's much better to be descriptive of what is happening and where, so everyone can plan their response appropriately, not to mention, it will not be confusing for any substitute teachers and other personnel who may be in the building.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry View Post
    Other teachers have the freedom to make a different choice.
    Which comes at the expense of the student's education. As I've explained.

    Additionally, SD's Sentinels aren't only teachers, but any district employee at all. A Sentinel could be a mechanic from the Bus Yard who was called because a bus had a problem while waiting to pick up the evening children. A Sentinel could be a lunch lady washing dishes in the back of the kitchen. A Sentinel could be an accountant from the district office who came by to pick up the proceeds from a charity drive. It's unreasonable to assume that a given Sentinel would have any kind of relationship with a given student in the first place.
    If they are not a teacher, then my argument against teachers having guns becomes irrelevant. However, the idea of random person A being entrusted with a gun in a school opens up a completely different set of objections. But since our debate is about arming teachers, I won't get into those issues I have now.

    We want to give educators options and flexibility.
    And I want to preserve the child's education. We have other options than hindering the educational experience. To argue otherwise is stupid.

    That rifle was perchesed during CT's last Assault Weapons Ban and was Assault Weapons Ban Compliant. No, I do not support Assault Weapon Bans.
    That rifle was registered to Ms. Lansa. No, I do not support registration.


    But you do support the laws which allowed her to purchase the weapon, do you not? You have been incredibly dishonest in this debate, do you realize this?

    Quote Originally Posted by Robert Morrow View Post
    The bottom line is: gun control is going down in flames despite the Sandy Hook massacre.

    Thank-God.
    It really makes a person wonder just how crazy Americans are, doesn't it? Or maybe the more accurate statement is just how powerful the gun manufacturers/NRA is in brainwashing people. The irrationality of our country's gun love is the only time Americans actively reject solutions which address the problem of dead children. It just amazes me.

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    Re: NRA unveils plan for armed guards in schools it says 'will save lives'

    You didn't give me any explanation in post 242, they aren't 'random people' but employees of the district who by the nature of being employees have already passed mental stability and FBI background checks, and this isn't only about teachers but 'guards' of any kind.

    As I said, if you feel that having a gun interferes with your ability to teach in any way, you are free not to have a gun. If you don't like abortion, you don't have to have one. If you don't like same-sex marriage, you don't have to marry someone of the same sex. Same logic. No one's forcing you to participate in any kind of Sentinel program.
    Last edited by Jerry; 04-06-13 at 08:17 AM.

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    Re: NRA unveils plan for armed guards in schools it says 'will save lives'

    Quote Originally Posted by Slyfox696 View Post
    But you do support the laws which allowed her to purchase the weapon, do you not?
    Everything you've posted in this thread has been either irrelevant liberal debating tactics, tortured rationalizations or insults...except this question. This question perfectly illustrates your mindset from which all your other posts flow.

    Now, think about it...what law allowed Lanza's mother to purchase a weapon? Hmmm?
    TANSTAAFL

    “An armed society is a polite society.”
    ― Robert A. Heinlein, Beyond This Horizon

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    Re: NRA unveils plan for armed guards in schools it says 'will save lives'

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry View Post
    You didn't give me any explanation in post 242
    Yes, I did.

    they aren't 'random people' but employees of the district who by the nature of being employees have already passed mental stability and FBI background checks, and this isn't only about teachers but 'guards' of any kind.
    They are not employees of the school district until they are hired, and before they are hired, they are still "random people".

    As I said, if you feel that having a gun interferes with your ability to teach in any way, you are free not to have a gun.
    I'm not talking about me, I'm talking about education in general.

    Your inability to keep up with a conversation shows you to be either very confused or intentionally misleading. Either way, this will likely be my last post to you, not because you made offensive comments, but because I'm tired of holding your hand.
    Quote Originally Posted by Mycroft View Post
    Everything you've posted in this thread has been either irrelevant liberal debating tactics, tortured rationalizations or insults
    Do you realize how little respect I have for you and any one else who resorts to such ridiculous statements like "liberal debating tactics"? You just sound as if you're completely brainwashed by "conservative" media. It's one thing to say it once, but when you use the same stupid statement in nearly every post you make, it reflects incredibly poorly upon you.

    Whenever you feel like having a civil discussion, and not one with generic insults which don't even make sense, let me know. Then I'll happily answer your question.

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