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Thread: Unfit For Work: The Startling Rise Of Disability In America

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    Re: Unfit For Work: The Startling Rise Of Disability In America

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    If you believe that supports his point, you've misread it. Fixing the problems are costly, difficult, and often requiring more then elected leaders. So it has little to do with his claim. Having people dependent for votes s not what that is saying.
    First off, "see point 2" was to redirect you to the subsistence of my argument, rather then swerving off into your rhetorical talking points. I have yet to see you address what I am actually saying, and rather you instead are trying to undermine me (or other posters) using greedy reductionism. Reducing my argument to "vilifying people" or "jumping overboard" or any of your other ridiculously vague statements is childish. And if you say you aren't reducing my argument, then you are simply saying such things unsolicited and are talking past me. Either way, its subtraction by addition.

    Now to the specifics.

    Like I said, I agree with him that Democrats are sympathetic to more lax standards for disability benefits. It is a major component of their base that they wouldn't risk pissing off, but at the same time I don't know if I think they are rigging the system strictly to win votes.

    The article does show that there has been quite a steady rise in disability benefits for working age citizens. Also having to "prove you cannot function in a working place environment" means absolutely nothing when the standards for the words "prove" and "cannot" are ambiguous and can be exaggerated.

  2. #102
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    Re: Unfit For Work: The Startling Rise Of Disability In America

    Quote Originally Posted by ReformCollege View Post
    First off, "see point 2" was to redirect you to the subsistence of my argument, rather then swerving off into your rhetorical talking points. I have yet to see you address what I am actually saying, and rather you instead are trying to undermine me (or other posters) using greedy reductionism. Reducing my argument to "vilifying people" or "jumping overboard" or any of your other ridiculously vague statements is childish. And if you say you aren't reducing my argument, then you are simply saying such things unsolicited and are talking past me. Either way, its subtraction by addition.

    Now to the specifics.

    Like I said, I agree with him that Democrats are sympathetic to more lax standards for disability benefits. It is a major component of their base that they wouldn't risk pissing off, but at the same time I don't know if I think they are rigging the system strictly to win votes.

    The article does show that there has been quite a steady rise in disability benefits for working age citizens. Also having to "prove you cannot function in a working place environment" means absolutely nothing when the standards for the words "prove" and "cannot" are ambiguous and can be exaggerated.
    If I'm not addressing what you're saying. It seem to respond to our discussing concerning the political discussion I was having with TD.

    And his point was more Han sympathetic to, but spoke to motivation, wanting votes. We would also likely disagree about the motivations of those (overall) going on disability. I tred to show that with what I linked.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: Unfit For Work: The Startling Rise Of Disability In America

    Quote Originally Posted by Northern Light View Post
    When an unacceptable number of our
    population has become fat and stupid, it's no mystery why so many people are on disability. Our health care system is defunct, it's cheaper to buy junk food than real food thanks to subsidies, and with unions disappearing and proposals to slash minimum wage people have to work longer hours for the privilege of remaining poor.

    You call it the gravy train, I call it the necessary outcome of a corporate slavery mentality. Just keep outsourcing the jobs and destroying worker rights, and more and more people will keep turning to the government tit.

    But yeah... keep blaming the disenfranchised for being disenfranchised. In the land of America, ignorance is strength, and slavery is freedom.
    Your'e blaming the rise in obesity and all the health issues that come along with it on "subsidies" and corporations ?

    Wow, how twisted the fringe has become ?

    Unions have themselves to blame for their decline, as they continue to support the politicians who kill jobs and economic activity with their stupidity.

    Corporations seem to have become the generic boogry man as of late because to mention the unthinkable ( people need to be more responsible ) is just to dificult to do.

    There is value in humility.

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    Re: Unfit For Work: The Startling Rise Of Disability In America

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    You may want to read what I responded to closer. TD makes the statement that in effect says democrats allow abuses for political gain, winning elections. That part f his post I challenged and called it bs. I called it that because it is bs.
    Really? It's BS?

    A record 5.4 million workers and their dependents have signed up to collect federal disability checks since President Obama took office, according to the latest official government data, as discouraged workers increasingly give up looking for jobs and take advantage of the federal program.

    Read More At Investor's Business Daily: Disabled America: 5.4 Million Join Social Security Disability Insurance Rolls Under Obama - Investors.com
    Follow us: @IBDinvestors on Twitter | InvestorsBusinessDaily on Facebook
    Wow, 5.4 million people all of the sudden became disabled? That's amazing....We'd better find out what's hurting our workers....But it's all BS right?
    Americans are so enamored of equality that they would rather be equal in slavery than unequal in freedom.

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    Re: Unfit For Work: The Startling Rise Of Disability In America

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    Really? It's BS?



    Wow, 5.4 million people all of the sudden became disabled? That's amazing....We'd better find out what's hurting our workers....But it's all BS right?
    The trouble is you think that somehow proves his point. It doesn't. The reasons for this likely have nothing to do with who is president. And the loss of jobs started long before Obama was elected something else not controlled by presidents). So, yes, it is BS. Silly, partisan, BS.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: Unfit For Work: The Startling Rise Of Disability In America

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    The trouble is you think that somehow
    proves his point. It doesn't. The
    reasons for this likely have nothing to do with who is president. And the loss of jobs started long before Obama was elected something else not controlled by presidents). So, yes, it is BS. Silly, partisan, BS.
    Now THATS BS.

    Still blaming Bush for Obama's failure.

    Truth is "elections have consequences, and the consequence of Obama's election is perpetual unemployment far above the manipulated 7.9 unemployment numbers BO's administration hangs their hat on.

    Its what happens when you let the least informed Vote.

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    Re: Unfit For Work: The Startling Rise Of Disability In America

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    The trouble is you think that somehow proves his point. It doesn't. The reasons for this likely have nothing to do with who is president. And the loss of jobs started long before Obama was elected something else not controlled by presidents). So, yes, it is BS. Silly, partisan, BS.
    I don't know why you seem to buy that personal hardship is justification for disability enrollment. It isn't, that's not the point of the program. For the fourth time.

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    Re: Unfit For Work: The Startling Rise Of Disability In America

    There are a ton of people currently drawing disability checks who don't need it. But that doesn't necessarily mean that they are playing the system. I grew up in poverty and have a lot of friends and family who are in the welfare/disability systems. Even today, while no longer in poverty, I volunteer with groups that work with people wrapped up in the system that fairly often receive these benefits. Due to my experience in these systems and working with and being close with people in these systems I can honestly say that I believe that most Americans on disability, even for the dumbest and frivolous of reasons, truly believe they are disabled. And it is not entirely their fault. Our culture in America has become one of finding faults, blaming something, getting out of things. We have kids that we as society have been telling since they are little kids that there is something wrong with them. That they need these meds, and these, and no matter what they do its not their fault. Those kids we were doing this to 15-20 years ago and more are becoming adults. And those adults have been told since they were little these things. They have it engrained into their heads that they are defective and cannot work. We are raising generation after generation this way and this trend is going to continue. Even as adults who could be working, they are being told over and over and over by people that they can't. And when enough people tell you something enough times, and over a long enough period of time, you are going to believe it. If we want to fix the problems of people abusing the system, then we need to be teaching kids work ethic and accountability throughout their lives rather than they are broken.
    “Most people do not listen with the intent to understand; they listen with the intent to reply.”
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    Re: Unfit For Work: The Startling Rise Of Disability In America

    Quote Originally Posted by Fenton View Post
    Now THATS BS.

    Still blaming Bush for Obama's failure.

    Truth is "elections have consequences, and the consequence of Obama's election is perpetual unemployment far above the manipulated 7.9 unemployment numbers BO's administration hangs their hat on.

    Its what happens when you let the least informed Vote.
    You do realize that's not what I did. I said regardless of president, so no blame was put on Bush.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: Unfit For Work: The Startling Rise Of Disability In America

    Quote Originally Posted by ReformCollege View Post
    I don't know why you seem to buy that personal hardship is justification for disability enrollment. It isn't, that's not the point of the program. For the fourth time.
    I believe it has been a contributing factor to what has happened, and so did the article linked in op. So, it likely is. And no one argues it is the point of the program. Many things function beyond their reason for being. This is neither new nor unusual. But fixing the problem I believe requires that we look at it realistically and honestly.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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