Page 17 of 25 FirstFirst ... 71516171819 ... LastLast
Results 161 to 170 of 245

Thread: Steubenville High School football players found guilty of raping 16-year-old [W:245]

  1. #161
    Sage
    apdst's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Bagdad, La.
    Last Seen
    Today @ 09:17 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Very Conservative
    Posts
    76,445

    Re: Steubenville High School football players found guilty of raping 16-year-old girl

    Quote Originally Posted by calamity View Post
    Friends don't let friends rape drunk girls.

    Maybe this verdict will help get that message out.
    If my kids found themselves in a situation where they witnessed something like this and didn't stop it, or get their ass kicked trying to stop it, they would get one hell of a message when I got my hands on them.
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

  2. #162
    User Dustmop's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Location
    New Mexico
    Last Seen
    08-13-17 @ 05:26 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Very Liberal
    Posts
    128

    Re: Steubenville High School football players found guilty of raping 16-year-old girl

    Quote Originally Posted by Mathematician View Post
    How about you tell lions and sharks not to attack humans while you're at it?
    ...yes, because, you know, humans have the intellectual and moral capacity of wild predatory animals.

    Rape culture is why the people testifying in this case didn't think it was rape because the girl was unconscious.
    Rape culture is why these boys joked with each other about the "dead girl" being "so raped" and didn't think there would be any consequences.
    Rape culture is why people see rape as being a less violent crime if the victim is too weak, incapacitated, or terrified to fight back.
    Rape culture is why the victim in this case is being harassed on twitter and getting death threats.

    Education to combat rape culture isn't JUST telling men not to rape women. It's teaching men to respect women's bodies. It's teaching them that the rule isn't "no means no"; the rule is "only consent given when NOT incapacitated means yes, and that person reserves the right and any time to retract that consent". It's teaching men that women are not a conquest to be taken and bragged about, that men are fully capable of controlling their actions no matter what a woman looks like, no matter what she is wearing, and no matter what state she is in.

    Look at these boys. They were not ASHAMED of what they did. It's a culture which allows men to do that to a woman without feeling ashamed of themselves that contributes to rape. This never would have happened if they had been taught that trying to shoved your dick in an unconscious girl's mouth, taking off her clothes, fingering her, and ejaculating on her is a shameful thing for them to do. Instead, they were taught that they have a free license do what they want, to whomever they want (especially if they are too incapacitated to remember your assault) because they are good at sports. That. Is. Rape. Culture.

    This case was made into a big deal precisely because this kind of thing happens all the time, is tolerated all the time, goes unpunished all the time, and that plenty of young men think it is a perfectly acceptable thing to do, document, and brag about right up until the point at which they actually suffer consequences.
    "Public office is not a morally superior perch from which you are entitled to arrogantly sit in judgement of those who placed you there." -Amy Hunter

  3. #163
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Canada, Costa Rica
    Last Seen
    05-16-16 @ 09:45 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    31,645

    Re: Steubenville High School football players found guilty of raping 16-year-old girl

    Quote Originally Posted by Dustmop View Post
    ...yes, because, you know, humans have the intellectual and moral capacity of wild predatory animals.

    Rape culture is why the people testifying in this case didn't think it was rape because the girl was unconscious.
    Rape culture is why these boys joked with each other about the "dead girl" being "so raped" and didn't think there would be any consequences.
    Rape culture is why people see rape as being a less violent crime if the victim is too weak, incapacitated, or terrified to fight back.
    Rape culture is why the victim in this case is being harassed on twitter and getting death threats.

    Education to combat rape culture isn't JUST telling men not to rape women. It's teaching men to respect women's bodies. It's teaching them that the rule isn't "no means no"; the rule is "only consent given when NOT incapacitated means yes, and that person reserves the right and any time to retract that consent". It's teaching men that women are not a conquest to be taken and bragged about, that men are fully capable of controlling their actions no matter what a woman looks like, no matter what she is wearing, and no matter what state she is in.

    Look at these boys. They were not ASHAMED of what they did. It's a culture which allows men to do that to a woman without feeling ashamed of themselves that contributes to rape. This never would have happened if they had been taught that trying to shoved your dick in an unconscious girl's mouth, taking off her clothes, fingering her, and ejaculating on her is a shameful thing for them to do. Instead, they were taught that they have a free license do what they want, to whomever they want (especially if they are too incapacitated to remember your assault) because they are good at sports. That. Is. Rape. Culture.

    This case was made into a big deal precisely because this kind of thing happens all the time, is tolerated all the time, goes unpunished all the time, and that plenty of young men think it is a perfectly acceptable thing to do, document, and brag about right up until the point at which they actually suffer consequences.
    Good post but I would quibble with your claim that "It's a culture which allows men to do that to a woman without feeling ashamed of themselves that contributes to rape"..

    I'm a man and feel as strongly about rape as any woman would do, and believe that the great majority of men feel the same way.. It's as unfair to lump all men together as it is to lump all women together.

  4. #164
    Heavy Hitter


    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Last Seen
    @
    Lean
    Centrist
    Posts
    63,660

    Re: Steubenville High School football players found guilty of raping 16-year-old girl

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    If my kids found themselves in a situation where they witnessed something like this and didn't stop it, or get their ass kicked trying to stop it, they would get one hell of a message when I got my hands on them.
    I was totally disgusted by that college student joking about how messed up that girl was while his friends were molesting her. THe only upside to it is him making a video of his rant is what broke this case wide open. I understand that he was one of the key witnesses against the defendants.

  5. #165
    Professor
    Mathematician's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Last Seen
    09-22-17 @ 09:35 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian - Right
    Posts
    2,147

    Re: Steubenville High School football players found guilty of raping 16-year-old girl

    Quote Originally Posted by Dustmop View Post
    ...yes, because, you know, humans have the intellectual and moral capacity of wild predatory animals.

    Rape culture is why the people testifying in this case didn't think it was rape because the girl was unconscious.
    Rape culture is why these boys joked with each other about the "dead girl" being "so raped" and didn't think there would be any consequences.
    Rape culture is why people see rape as being a less violent crime if the victim is too weak, incapacitated, or terrified to fight back.
    Rape culture is why the victim in this case is being harassed on twitter and getting death threats.

    Education to combat rape culture isn't JUST telling men not to rape women. It's teaching men to respect women's bodies. It's teaching them that the rule isn't "no means no"; the rule is "only consent given when NOT incapacitated means yes, and that person reserves the right and any time to retract that consent". It's teaching men that women are not a conquest to be taken and bragged about, that men are fully capable of controlling their actions no matter what a woman looks like, no matter what she is wearing, and no matter what state she is in.

    Look at these boys. They were not ASHAMED of what they did. It's a culture which allows men to do that to a woman without feeling ashamed of themselves that contributes to rape. This never would have happened if they had been taught that trying to shoved your dick in an unconscious girl's mouth, taking off her clothes, fingering her, and ejaculating on her is a shameful thing for them to do. Instead, they were taught that they have a free license do what they want, to whomever they want (especially if they are too incapacitated to remember your assault) because they are good at sports. That. Is. Rape. Culture.

    This case was made into a big deal precisely because this kind of thing happens all the time, is tolerated all the time, goes unpunished all the time, and that plenty of young men think it is a perfectly acceptable thing to do, document, and brag about right up until the point at which they actually suffer consequences.
    You're preaching to the choir. My point was that even a lion raised in captivity and handled with care can't be guaranteed to not attack those who care for it. Analogously, a kid raised to have the best morals can go wrong by negative influence of poorly raised kids, or even stupid curiousity.

    Best of luck to the liberals who want to try to blame "rape culture" while simultaneously supporting freedom of the "rap culture" where people sing about their *itches, hoes and baby mamma. They complain this crap is tolerated and then try to paint Treyvon Martin as a good kid. Nice mixed messages you send.
    Last edited by Mathematician; 03-18-13 at 08:57 PM.
    "With me everything turns into mathematics."
    "It is not enough to have a good mind. The main thing is to use it well."
    "It is truth very certain that, when it is not in one's power to determine what is true, we ought to follow what is more probable." -- Rene Descartes

  6. #166
    Rogue Graffias's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Location
    Midwest U.S
    Last Seen
    08-26-15 @ 07:34 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Socialist
    Posts
    924

    Re: Steubenville High School football players found guilty of raping 16-year-old girl

    Quote Originally Posted by Dustmop View Post
    ...yes, because, you know, humans have the intellectual and moral capacity of wild predatory animals.

    Rape culture is why the people testifying in this case didn't think it was rape because the girl was unconscious.
    Rape culture is why these boys joked with each other about the "dead girl" being "so raped" and didn't think there would be any consequences.
    Rape culture is why people see rape as being a less violent crime if the victim is too weak, incapacitated, or terrified to fight back.
    Rape culture is why the victim in this case is being harassed on twitter and getting death threats.

    Education to combat rape culture isn't JUST telling men not to rape women. It's teaching men to respect women's bodies. It's teaching them that the rule isn't "no means no"; the rule is "only consent given when NOT incapacitated means yes, and that person reserves the right and any time to retract that consent". It's teaching men that women are not a conquest to be taken and bragged about, that men are fully capable of controlling their actions no matter what a woman looks like, no matter what she is wearing, and no matter what state she is in.

    Look at these boys. They were not ASHAMED of what they did. It's a culture which allows men to do that to a woman without feeling ashamed of themselves that contributes to rape. This never would have happened if they had been taught that trying to shoved your dick in an unconscious girl's mouth, taking off her clothes, fingering her, and ejaculating on her is a shameful thing for them to do. Instead, they were taught that they have a free license do what they want, to whomever they want (especially if they are too incapacitated to remember your assault) because they are good at sports. That. Is. Rape. Culture.

    This case was made into a big deal precisely because this kind of thing happens all the time, is tolerated all the time, goes unpunished all the time, and that plenty of young men think it is a perfectly acceptable thing to do, document, and brag about right up until the point at which they actually suffer consequences.
    Not evidence of rape culture. These kids are dumb jerks who believed they can do whatever they want because they're local sports stars. I had to deal with the same kinds of arseholes in high school who loved to torment the "nerds". You still have not produced proof that we live in a culture that gives tacit approval to rapists. That some punk athletes think it's ok to rape women, as well as pick on other people they perceive as weak or inferior, is not an example of rape culture; it's an example of jock culture.
    AN AUTHORITARIAN SOCIALIST OPPOSED TO GLOBALISM, ZIONISM, AND FEMINISM, AND IN FAVOR OF SOVEREIGN NATIONS, A PALESTINIAN STATE, AND MEN'S RIGHTS!

  7. #167
    Banned
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Location
    Chicago
    Last Seen
    10-30-14 @ 12:38 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian
    Posts
    7,908

    Re: Steubenville High School football players found guilty of raping 16-year-old girl

    Quote Originally Posted by tessaesque View Post
    Actually, most states have an agreement regarding the sexual offense registry. If you move to Texas from a state in which you were on the registry, you must also register with Texas. Michigan did/does the same thing. Moving from Texas to Kentucky, Tennessee, Colorado, Ohio, Michigan, Florida, and Alabama (just the ones I've seen first hand) requires re-registering in that state.

    I think you're speaking on something you might not fully understand. I get the frustration w/the sentence, but assuming something that isn't legally possible will happen to justify your anger just doesn't move the discussion forward all that much.
    I know criminal law, we are NOT talking about adults and these kids were NEVER tried as adults...

    What do people NOT get about that?

  8. #168
    Professor
    Mathematician's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Last Seen
    09-22-17 @ 09:35 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian - Right
    Posts
    2,147

    Re: Steubenville High School football players found guilty of raping 16-year-old girl

    Quote Originally Posted by Graffias View Post
    Not evidence of rape culture. These kids are dumb jerks who believed they can do whatever they want because they're local sports stars. I had to deal with the same kinds of arseholes in high school who loved to torment the "nerds". You still have not produced proof that we live in a culture that gives tacit approval to rapists. That some punk athletes think it's ok to rape women, as well as pick on other people they perceive as weak or inferior, is not an example of rape culture; it's an example of jock culture.
    I agree that society tends to overvalue athletes, including students, and let performance on the field shadow performance off the field. As I mentioned, "rap culture" is something liberals won't attack that quite commonly teaches the anti-morals, especially attitude towards women. Speaking of jerks, many women feed their behavior by choosing to date them over gentlemen.
    "With me everything turns into mathematics."
    "It is not enough to have a good mind. The main thing is to use it well."
    "It is truth very certain that, when it is not in one's power to determine what is true, we ought to follow what is more probable." -- Rene Descartes

  9. #169
    User Dustmop's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Location
    New Mexico
    Last Seen
    08-13-17 @ 05:26 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Very Liberal
    Posts
    128

    Re: Steubenville High School football players found guilty of raping 16-year-old girl

    Quote Originally Posted by Graffias View Post
    Not evidence of rape culture. These kids are dumb jerks who believed they can do whatever they want because they're local sports stars. I had to deal with the same kinds of arseholes in high school who loved to torment the "nerds". You still have not produced proof that we live in a culture that gives tacit approval to rapists. That some punk athletes think it's ok to rape women, as well as pick on other people they perceive as weak or inferior, is not an example of rape culture; it's an example of jock culture.
    I think national media outlets focusing on the pain and suffering of the rapists is an example rape culture.
    I think people (who are not even part of sports culture) who are calling the victim a slut and saying she was asking for it is an example of rape culture.
    The witness who saw them raping the unconscious girl and just left because it 'didn't look like rape' has nothing to do with sports culture, and everything to do with the belief in our culture that the only kind of rape is when you attack a woman, force her down, and take her against her will while she is screaming and fighting. I think that is also evidence of rape culture. I absolutely think they were overly arrogant about their immunity because of their sports program. But that is not all that was at play here.

    Here are some other examples:

    Heartbreaking: 7th Grade Girl Raped Twice, Blamed and Punished By School Officials Both Times | Alternet
    7th grade girl in Springfield, MO reported being raped. No one believed her, she was forced to write an apology letter and deliver it to the boy who raped her. She was also expelled for the rest of the year. And was raped by the same boy again the following year. And before anyone calls her a liar as well, the boy plead guilty the second time, and the rape kit proved he did it.

    Why rapists in military get away with it - CNN.com
    Here’s an article about rape in our military. Interesting statistics, and cases like a CO telling a Marine who was raped that she shouldn’t get a rape kit done, superior officers using their authority to make women have sex with them, and superior officers telling women to essentially get over it when they are raped.

    Do I need to say anything more than, “all of the people who protected Sandusky”?

    How about congress nearly refusing to pass the Violence Against Women Act?

    How about all of the statements on this thread and others about this case talking about how these boys are going to “get it” in jail. Drop the soap jokes, anyone? When was the last time you heard about a prison rape case going to court? Just because someone goes to jail does not mean it is legal or morally acceptable to rape them.

    States treat spousal rape differently, but the extreme case is South Carolina, where spousal rape is only considered a crime if it is accomplished through aggravated force, and women have only 30 days to report such rapes.

    That whole Todd Akin “legitimate rape” business.

    When I say we have a rape culture here, I do not mean that across the board we uniformly tolerate and excuse rape, and I sure as heck don't mean that most men are rapists. What I mean is this. Victims are still commonly blamed here and many women don't report rape because they don't want to be "raped again" by the media. This girl was violated, and now she's getting threatened, being told she's a slut, and that she was asking for it. We have a culture that is permissive of prison rape. We have a culture in which a heck of a lot of people think men can't be raped, or that a woman can't rape a man. We have a rape problem in the military, where the behavior is sometimes tolerated and victims are shamed. And we also have people covering up for jocks and priests when they rape.
    "Public office is not a morally superior perch from which you are entitled to arrogantly sit in judgement of those who placed you there." -Amy Hunter

  10. #170
    Rogue Graffias's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Location
    Midwest U.S
    Last Seen
    08-26-15 @ 07:34 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Socialist
    Posts
    924

    Re: Steubenville High School football players found guilty of raping 16-year-old girl

    Quote Originally Posted by Dustmop View Post
    I think national media outlets focusing on the pain and suffering of the rapists is an example rape culture.
    CNN is the only media outlet I've heard of that focused any attention on the rapists' suffering. If you ask me, it's appropriate this is mentioned, because while this girl may eventually move on with her life, these guys will find it difficult or impossible to find work or housing because of their criminal past. It wouldn't surprise me if they're living under a bridge or eating out of garbage cans in ten years, as many sex offenders do. If these guys had beaten some scrawny male student instead of raped a female student, they might have still gone to prison for a year, but they would have avoided the sex offender registry which is going to make life a living hell for them once they are released from prison.


    I think people (who are not even part of sports culture) who are calling the victim a slut and saying she was asking for it is an example of rape culture.
    The witness who saw them raping the unconscious girl and just left because it 'didn't look like rape' has nothing to do with sports culture, and everything to do with the belief in our culture that the only kind of rape is when you attack a woman, force her down, and take her against her will while she is screaming and fighting. I think that is also evidence of rape culture.
    No, it's evidence of ignorance, not rape culture.


    Why rapists in military get away with it - CNN.com
    Here’s an article about rape in our military. Interesting statistics, and cases like a CO telling a Marine who was raped that she shouldn’t get a rape kit done, superior officers using their authority to make women have sex with them, and superior officers telling women to essentially get over it when they are raped.
    I agree the military has a rape problem, but I think it's a stretch to call it "rape culture", since not everyone in the military supports rape.


    How about congress nearly refusing to pass the Violence Against Women Act?
    There already are laws on the books to prevent violence against women.

    How about all of the statements on this thread and others about this case talking about how these boys are going to “get it” in jail. Drop the soap jokes, anyone? When was the last time you heard about a prison rape case going to court? Just because someone goes to jail does not mean it is legal or morally acceptable to rape them.
    I agree.

    States treat spousal rape differently, but the extreme case is South Carolina, where spousal rape is only considered a crime if it is accomplished through aggravated force, and women have only 30 days to report such rapes.
    30 days seems reasonable to me. That prevents a lot of vindictive women from suddenly reporting false rapes after the marriage goes sour. As far as "aggravated force", that pretty much describes all rape except the passed out drunk kind. And honestly, how common do you honestly think it is for a husband to rape his wife while she's passed out? Many women wouldn't even consider that rape. The lack of consent doesn't always mean it's forced sex.

    That whole Todd Akin “legitimate rape” business.
    The "legitimate rape" statement is a term used in reference to false rape allegations. Rape has the highest false allegation rate of any crime. Akin was trying to differentiate between real rapes and women who claimed they were raped, but were not.
    AN AUTHORITARIAN SOCIALIST OPPOSED TO GLOBALISM, ZIONISM, AND FEMINISM, AND IN FAVOR OF SOVEREIGN NATIONS, A PALESTINIAN STATE, AND MEN'S RIGHTS!

Page 17 of 25 FirstFirst ... 71516171819 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •