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Thread: Obama Wants Research to Wean Vehicles off Oil.....

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    Re: Obama Wants Research to Wean Vehicles off Oil.....

    Quote Originally Posted by Helix View Post
    i'm not arguing that the transition from oil could have been accomplished instantly. i'm saying that if we had started seriously addressing it back then, we'd probably have a different transportation energy model by now.
    Agreed, and there were many who said the same back in the 70s. But then the price of oil went down again and the cost of these alternatives was too great in contrast. That comparison is no different now.

    And let's not forget the known human element. Remember that joke where the punchline is, "can I keep doing it until I just need glasses then?". It's like that.

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    Re: Obama Wants Research to Wean Vehicles off Oil.....

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    I know we have, which makes me wonder why you keep harping, "if only we had been working on it years ago, we wouldn't be using petro-fuels anymore".

    If alternative energy worked, the oil companies would be all over it by now.
    Alternative energy (or at least SOME) "works", just not economically when oil is so far undervalued. Show me $200 a barrel and I will show you 300,000,000 more Americans who will become alternative energy converts, and thousands of businesses that are participating in that market - all without ANY need for government to stick it bumbling nose into the marketplace.

    Oil companies ARE indeed becoming energy companies, both in the US and internationally, precisely because they DO see a future for alternatives. Sad part is, Big Oil is just as much of a whore as anyone else, and they will go where the free ride is as well (i.e. significant involvement in idiotic ethanol crap and as well heavily subsidized wind energy projects - BTW one of the things ENRON did very deeply, as well as nuclear).

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    Re: Obama Wants Research to Wean Vehicles off Oil.....

    Quote Originally Posted by clownboy View Post
    Are you seriously proposing ending the write off for capitol improvements and site construction from all businesses? Or are you intending to target just one?
    You haven't been paying attention. Oil companies get more written off than regular businesses through additional tax breaks provided in 1916 and 1926.
    Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. ~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

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    Re: Obama Wants Research to Wean Vehicles off Oil.....

    Quote Originally Posted by clownboy View Post
    And increase our need for other far more limited supply non-renewables. TANSTAAFL.

    Pfft! All elements are limited!



    As have the subsidies on them also increased. Again the lower cost to you is not due to lower manufacturing costs but a higher government subsidy.
    You didn't pay attention. The price went down, without tax credits.


    Miniscule effect due to the weaknesses I have mentioned in our electrical system (transmission and storage).
    An ever increasing effect.



    Actually, government figures I've see range from 42-47%, but that's just a quibble. No matter, you're still trading in real time today a shrinking non-renewable resource with a non-renewable resource that is in vastly smaller supply
    I never said it would be done overnight! And the more breakthrough discoveries, the quicker the transition away from expensive and damaging fossil fuels.
    Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. ~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

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    Re: Obama Wants Research to Wean Vehicles off Oil.....

    Quote Originally Posted by Helix View Post
    yes. i was born in the mid 70s.



    not until about 1982, when the school let me borrow a TRS80.



    i'm not arguing that the transition from oil could have been accomplished instantly. i'm saying that if we had started seriously addressing it back then, we'd probably have a different transportation energy model by now.
    There is truly no desire to get off of oil - this whole "we need to get off of oil" is nothing more than smoke and mirrors. Maybe you and 30,000,000 other voters want to get off of oil - however you're a voter and you will vote for anyone that panders to your desires and politicians know that so they will tell you what you want to hear. Hell, they will throw taxpayer money at the issue so they can pander to you and then claim they created jobs and then tell those employed by their farce they're lucky and they need to vote to keep the money flowing from the taxpayer to employ him/her...

    There is no oil shortage, AGW doesn't exist but politicians need both to exist so they can pretend to "save the day" (get themselves reelected to their cushy jobs)...

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    Re: Obama Wants Research to Wean Vehicles off Oil.....

    Quote Originally Posted by Cephus View Post
    We're not, but that has nothing to do with the Constitution, does it? We can pass laws and hold people accountable to those laws entirely without the Constitution, nations have been doing that since the dawn of human civilization.
    The constitution IS the law which were supposed to hold people account to. So YET AGAIN, if youre saying it doesnt matter, then how are we supposed to hold them accountable?

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    Re: Obama Wants Research to Wean Vehicles off Oil.....

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    If alternative energy worked, the oil companies would be all over it by now.
    Try again!

    If alternative energy provided short-term profitability, oil companies would be all over it by now. This a major motivation behind mothballing promising research.
    It is not very unreasonable that the rich should contribute to the public expense, not only in proportion to their revenue, but something more than in that proportion.
    "Wealth of Nations," Book V, Chapter II, Part II, Article I, pg.911

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    Re: Obama Wants Research to Wean Vehicles off Oil.....

    A car in motion generates way more energy than what a basic car battery can hold. Why not have bigger batteries or multiple batteries to capture the extra juice? Not to mention you could put "pin wheels" on the inside of a cars grill that would spin via air creating even more energy.. The heat generated by an engine could also be used.

    I suppose my point is that a vehicle generates so much energy but the typical vehicle only recycles 10% of the energy it creates.

    One shouldn't have to plug their car into a wall outlet - that is just stupid and unnecessary.

    There is no such thing as "free energy" however in theory a car could recycle it's energy....

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    Re: Obama Wants Research to Wean Vehicles off Oil.....

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr.Nick View Post
    A car in motion generates way more energy than what a basic car battery can hold. Why not have bigger batteries or multiple batteries to capture the extra juice? Not to mention you could put "pin wheels" on the inside of a cars grill that would spin via air creating even more energy.. The heat generated by an engine could also be used.

    I suppose my point is that a vehicle generates so much energy but the typical vehicle only recycles 10% of the energy it creates.

    One shouldn't have to plug their car into a wall outlet - that is just stupid and unnecessary.

    There is no such thing as "free energy" however in theory a car could recycle it's energy....

    Many new vehicles are now routing energy that would be lost back into the batteries. One example currently being utilized is the energy produced from braking. More research means more possibilities in that area.
    Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. ~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

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    Re: Obama Wants Research to Wean Vehicles off Oil.....

    Quote Originally Posted by Kushinator View Post
    Try again!

    If alternative energy provided short-term profitability, oil companies would be all over it by now. This a major motivation behind mothballing promising research.
    Enter the conspiracy theory.
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

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