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Thread: Food-stamp use doubles

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    Re: Food-stamp use doubles

    Quote Originally Posted by Deuce View Post
    So what counts as a handout in your mind and what percentage of people receiving it vote solely based on that handout?
    Low income based "entitlements" count as handouts and I would guess that at least 60%, of those getting them, like them enough to vote to get them continued (increased?) even if that candidate is not "perfect" on other issues.
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    Re: Food-stamp use doubles

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Invisible View Post
    False. This was done in Florida (Florida to test all welfare recipients for drugs | Reuters) and it was not only a complete and total failure (Just as We Suspected: Florida Saved Nothing by Drug Testing Welfare Applicants) but it also cost the state more money than it saved. (Florida drug testing welfare recipients costs more than it saves)
    I said the numbers in welfare will drop and it did and the reasons it cost so damn much was probaly because they did not take into acount how many people got sober enough to pass , besides its not always about money its about identify peopole with problems ( sorry it took me so long to respond i have a hamster to feed )

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    Re: Food-stamp use doubles

    Quote Originally Posted by Un biased View Post
    I said the numbers in welfare will drop and it did and the reasons it cost so damn much was probaly because they did not take into acount how many people got sober enough to pass , besides its not always about money its about identify peopole with problems ( sorry it took me so long to respond i have a hamster to feed )
    Actually, no, the reason why it cost so much was because "the Florida law requires that applicants who pass the test be reimbursed for the cost, an average of $30, the cost to the state was $118,140. This is more than would have been paid out in benefits to the people who failed the test, Mr. Newton said. As a result, the testing cost the government an extra $45,780, he said." (http://www.nytimes.com/2012/04/18/us...ests.html?_r=0)

    The numbers did not go down at all. From that same NYT article, "An internal document about Temporary Assistance for Needy Families, or TANF, caseloads stated that the drug testing policy, at least from July through September, did not lead to fewer cases."

    In addition to this "Central Florida's WFTV found that out of the 40 families that have been tested since the law went into effect on July 1, only two have tested positive for drugs, and one of those cases is going through the appeal process" (Florida Finds That Not All Welfare Recipients Are Drug-Addled Pillbillies - Hit & Run : Reason.com) and 98% of welfare applicants passed the drug tests. (98 Percent of Welfare Applicants Pass Drug Test)

    So no, absolutely nothing changed about the number of people on welfare when they were tested for drugs.


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    Re: Food-stamp use doubles

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Invisible View Post
    Actually, no, the reason why it cost so much was because "the Florida law requires that applicants who pass the test be reimbursed for the cost, an average of $30, the cost to the state was $118,140. This is more than would have been paid out in benefits to the people who failed the test, Mr. Newton said. As a result, the testing cost the government an extra $45,780, he said." (http://www.nytimes.com/2012/04/18/us...ests.html?_r=0)

    The numbers did not go down at all. From that same NYT article, "An internal document about Temporary Assistance for Needy Families, or TANF, caseloads stated that the drug testing policy, at least from July through September, did not lead to fewer cases."

    In addition to this "Central Florida's WFTV found that out of the 40 families that have been tested since the law went into effect on July 1, only two have tested positive for drugs, and one of those cases is going through the appeal process" (Florida Finds That Not All Welfare Recipients Are Drug-Addled Pillbillies - Hit & Run : Reason.com) and 98% of welfare applicants passed the drug tests. (98 Percent of Welfare Applicants Pass Drug Test)

    So no, absolutely nothing changed about the number of people on welfare when they were tested for drugs.


    BTW, hamsters are awesome!
    Wow! They tested 40 whole families? Is there any reason to believe that a sample so small would be significant in any way?
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    Re: Food-stamp use doubles

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    Wow! They tested 40 whole families? Is there any reason to believe that a sample so small would be significant in any way?
    Please look at the other information which shows that most families passed the drug test rather than ignoring it.
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    Re: Food-stamp use doubles

    Quote Originally Posted by ttwtt78640 View Post
    Low income based "entitlements" count as handouts and I would guess that at least 60%, of those getting them, like them enough to vote to get them continued (increased?) even if that candidate is not "perfect" on other issues.
    Specify. Because you'd have to compare that to actual attempts to cut those programs by the GOP.

    And why 60%?
    He touched her over her bra and underpants, she says, and guided her hand to touch him over his underwear
    Quote Originally Posted by Lutherf View Post
    We’ll say what? Something like “nothing happened” ... Yeah, we might say something like that.

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    Re: Food-stamp use doubles

    Quote Originally Posted by Deuce View Post
    Specify. Because you'd have to compare that to actual attempts to cut those programs by the GOP.

    And why 60%?
    Specify what? Do you not understand what is considered a "low income based" entitlement? What was Welfare/Medicaid reform?

    The 60% was simply a SWAG based on those really seeking better work opportunities and not actually prefering the "gov't help" as a replacement for a better paying job.
    “The reasonable man adapts himself to the world: the unreasonable one persists to adapt the world to himself.
    Therefore all progress depends on the unreasonable man.” ― George Bernard Shaw, Man and Superman

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    Re: Food-stamp use doubles

    Quote Originally Posted by ttwtt78640 View Post
    Specify what? Do you not understand what is considered a "low income based" entitlement? What was Welfare/Medicaid reform?

    The 60% was simply a SWAG based on those really seeking better work opportunities and not actually prefering the "gov't help" as a replacement for a better paying job.
    Lack of specification makes quantification impossible.
    He touched her over her bra and underpants, she says, and guided her hand to touch him over his underwear
    Quote Originally Posted by Lutherf View Post
    We’ll say what? Something like “nothing happened” ... Yeah, we might say something like that.

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    Re: Food-stamp use doubles

    Quote Originally Posted by Deuce View Post
    Lack of specification makes quantification impossible.
    Here are some specifics on "wefare" (in all of its many forms) costs:

    http://www.cato.org/sites/cato.org/f.../pdf/PA694.pdf

    Study: $15 trillion in welfare spending has had little impact since 1964 | Deseret News

    Growth of Welfare Entitlements: Principles of Reform and the Next Steps
    “The reasonable man adapts himself to the world: the unreasonable one persists to adapt the world to himself.
    Therefore all progress depends on the unreasonable man.” ― George Bernard Shaw, Man and Superman

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    Re: Food-stamp use doubles

    Welfare entitlements is an oxymoron.

    No one is entitled to benefit from the work of others.

    Entitlements are money that has been paid by the individual that is now entitled to receive something back. Social Security retirement is an entitlement, as the individual getting the benefits has paid for it and is entitled to it.

    Government largesse to people who haven't paid for it is not an entitlement. It is a dole.

    It is not even charity, really, as charity is given freely from one's own resources with the intent to help a fellow human being who has fallen on hard times. Government is not giving, but taking from one person and redistributing it to another.

    Yet, the government spent over a trillion dollars last year not on entitlements, but on means tested welfare. If we have a hundred million taxpayers, which should be pretty close, a trillion dollars is ten thousand dollars each.

    So, give me my ten grand back and let me give it to charity. I'm certain I could do a lot more good with it than the government can.
    "Donald Trump is a phony, a fraud... [he's] playing the American public for suckers." Mitt Romney

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