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Thread: Food-stamp use doubles

  1. #411
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    Re: Food-stamp use doubles

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    Who said anything about removal of programs? We in this country are a generous people. We want to help those less fortunate than ourselves, and do. But what is wrong with saying that there is a limit to that aid, and those who are able need to do what is necessary to get off the program?



    You can call a sponge a Buick, but it's not....It's a sponge.



    If so great why don't we see poverty at single digits then...I mean we have poured Trillions into it...



    Yeah? Where is it?



    Funny that we don't hear as much about that as we do the food stamp ads on the radio....Why do you suppose that is?



    The healthcare industry is 1/6th of the nations GDP. You are arguing for a government based, centralized system....That is nationalization of the system friend...Like it or not.



    That's nonsense...A little less Star Trek, and a little more real world would help here... We have real world examples of what you want, and it looks dismal.



    It isn't those of us against Obamacare that are ignoring what the rest of the worlds nationalized universal care systems are doing, that would by your side trying to feed us a steaming pile and telling us it is chocolate ice cream.



    Reigning in lawyers, and people looking to scam the system for that lotto payday because they had a headache after surgery is what is driving costs...Fix the Tort system....Obamacare doesn't touch that, why?



    We are individuals in this country...You know who else called the blue collar guy, "workers", and divided people into classes don't you?.....That's right, communists....
    You're breakup is distracting and largely incoherent. You seem to be using it to make quips, but not points, so I'm unsure how to proceed.

    However, all the things you listed from sponges (proving my point about demonizing) to lawyers are factually inaccurate. Reining in lawyers through tort reform has been tried in states and failed. All the dancing continues to fail because profit demands profit. As a service that places the one in need at a distinct disadvantage, the market simply can't be used like a market. This why were one of the few market models left.

    And before you go into costs, we pay more than countries with universal health care.

    Also, no one suggests there are no limits. But before I start on the poor and he working class, I'd address other issues and consider other solutions. Fighting fewer needless wars, appeasing business that is only going to out source anyway, and giving money to private business, private schools, and private lending nstitutions.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

  2. #412
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    Re: Food-stamp use doubles

    Quote Originally Posted by Grant View Post
    Given that the the measurements of what constitutes poverty has changed over time, often for political ends, do you have any stats on the 1950's? It seems during that period that a working husband could sufficiently provide for a wife and two children, which is far more difficult in the working class of today.

    http://www.fas.org/sgp/crs/misc/RL33069.pdf
    Comparing the 1950s and the 2010s is a bit problematic.

    Yes, a man could go to work in manufacturing and make enough money to support a wife and family, and could do it without a college degree, even without a high school diploma.

    The family would have a house to live in, food on the table, and a car to drive.

    They wouldn't have a big screen TV. or probably any TV. They would have a radio, or maybe two. They wouldn't have a computer, video games, cell phones, or an automatic washer and dryer. They wouldn't have health insurance, but still could afford basic care. MRI machines, CAT scans, most medicines, transplants, and most vaccinations were still in the future. Polio was a huge worry until the Salk Vaccine in the late '50s.

    All those things cost money.

    Moreover, should the bread winner die or become incapacitated, the family was in real trouble. Few employers would hire a woman, after all, as a penis was the prime requirement for a job that paid a living wage, and there was little in the way of assistance to widows and orphans.

    The world has changed. In some ways, it's a lot better, in others a lot worse, but it is much different today.
    "Donald Trump is a phony, a fraud... [he's] playing the American public for suckers." Mitt Romney

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    Re: Food-stamp use doubles

    Quote Originally Posted by Dittohead not! View Post
    Comparing the 1950s and the 2010s is a bit problematic.

    Yes, a man could go to work in manufacturing and make enough money to support a wife and family, and could do it without a college degree, even without a high school diploma.

    The family would have a house to live in, food on the table, and a car to drive.

    They wouldn't have a big screen TV. or probably any TV. They would have a radio, or maybe two. They wouldn't have a computer, video games, cell phones, or an automatic washer and dryer. They wouldn't have health insurance, but still could afford basic care. MRI machines, CAT scans, most medicines, transplants, and most vaccinations were still in the future. Polio was a huge worry until the Salk Vaccine in the late '50s.

    All those things cost money.

    Moreover, should the bread winner die or become incapacitated, the family was in real trouble. Few employers would hire a woman, after all, as a penis was the prime requirement for a job that paid a living wage, and there was little in the way of assistance to widows and orphans.

    The world has changed. In some ways, it's a lot better, in others a lot worse, but it is much different today.
    It seems America was a happier place then and the high tech gadgets weren't missed, largely because they were only created of in science fiction. We really don't miss the things others will take for granted in 60 years time because we have no idea what they might be.

    Not a perfect world by any means but there was confidence and hope, two characteristics which seem to be lacking now.

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    Re: Food-stamp use doubles

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    It may be the only path, smartest or not. I would argue however that in the long term, it is very dumb to hurt the worker too much. Very dumb.
    And of course it's just as stupid to demonize businesses or take advantage of them. Otherwise they will just shut down or leave, thereby hurting everyone.

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    Re: Food-stamp use doubles

    Quote Originally Posted by Grant View Post
    It seems America was a happier place then and the high tech gadgets weren't missed, largely because they were only created of in science fiction. We really don't miss the things others will take for granted in 60 years time because we have no idea what they might be.

    Not a perfect world by any means but there was confidence and hope, two characteristics which seem to be lacking now.
    Definitely not a perfect world, but yes, there was confidence and hope, and a belief that America was the greatest country on Earth.

    And a functioning government that managed to build the interstate highway system and help rebuild both our allies and former enemies from WWII, and without incurring a debt we couldn't pay.

    That last would be nice to have back.

    I'd like to keep the technological progress made since then, too.

    You can just take the racism and sexism of that era out to the trash, however. That we don't need.
    "Donald Trump is a phony, a fraud... [he's] playing the American public for suckers." Mitt Romney

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    Re: Food-stamp use doubles

    Quote Originally Posted by Dittohead not! View Post
    Definitely not a perfect world, but yes, there was confidence and hope, and a belief that America was the greatest country on Earth.

    And a functioning government that managed to build the interstate highway system and help rebuild both our allies and former enemies from WWII, and without incurring a debt we couldn't pay.

    That last would be nice to have back.

    I'd like to keep the technological progress made since then, too.

    You can just take the racism and sexism of that era out to the trash, however. That we don't need.
    Both are still around but the sexism was different then, Both men and women were seriously expected to follow social obligations. Women were treated like 'ladies', a quaint term now, and there is a great deal more sexism directed against men now then there was then. I think we just ignore it and shrug it off, but it is certainly there.

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    Re: Food-stamp use doubles

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    No, it isn't. Mostly people accept your view
    of it without ever questioning,
    kind of a group think drenched in nationalism. But we're neither cheap nor cost effective. And it really doesn't serve patients well either, for the reasons I already noted.
    When my mother was a practicing nurse in Houston ( Herman ) people from all around the world traveled here to get their life saving healthcare.

    Most notably from Saudi, UK and Canada. I suppose they had the means to make a choice.

    HealthCare as a right leaves no room for innovation or competition and eventually leads to a system of marginal care .

    Far be it from me that I would want my physician to be driven but things other than a paycheck and the Hypocratic Oath.

    They're people too apparently. Plus not one of you Socialised Healthcare advocates have been able to give a decent and specific account of how it could be payed for.

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    Re: Food-stamp use doubles

    Quote Originally Posted by Fenton View Post
    When my mother was a practicing nurse in Houston ( Herman ) people from all around the world traveled here to get their life saving healthcare.

    Most notably from Saudi, UK and Canada. I suppose they had the means to make a choice.

    HealthCare as a right leaves no room for innovation or competition and eventually leads to a system of marginal care .

    Far be it from me that I would want my physician to be driven but things other than a paycheck and the Hypocratic Oath.

    They're people too apparently. Plus not one of you Socialised Healthcare advocates have been able to give a decent and specific account of how it could be payed for.
    Watch the bureaucracy grow as well. Only Walmart, the Indian railway and the Chinese military have more employees than Britain's NHS. The US can easily overtake them, and will. Whoever thought a bureaucracy could solve a health problem should have their heads examined which, under Obamacare, might soon be impossible.

  9. #419
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    Re: Food-stamp use doubles

    I bet the population of blacks in the U.S has also doubled!!! More than likely, I will hear that in some sort of incompetent and illusory speech from a paranoid racist by the end of this week.
    Either I'm right or you're wrong.

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    Re: Food-stamp use doubles

    Quote Originally Posted by Grant View Post
    Watch the bureaucracy grow as well. Only Walmart, the Indian railway and the Chinese military have more employees than Britain's NHS. The US can easily overtake them, and will. Whoever thought a bureaucracy could solve a health problem should have their heads examined which, under Obamacare, might soon be impossible.
    If you think Britain's NHS is cumbersome and inefficient, remember that our own health care system, even before "Obamacare", is more costly still.
    "Donald Trump is a phony, a fraud... [he's] playing the American public for suckers." Mitt Romney

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