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Thread: Food-stamp use doubles

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    Re: Food-stamp use doubles

    Quote Originally Posted by iliveonramen View Post
    Sure...and what's the conservative answer to your statement? Let them make 5 dollars an hour and try and survive on that?
    People can probably survive on that if they are very cautious with their budgeting, but the idea is to work your way up from a $5 an hour job to one with more value. In order to do that some ambition is required, along with some education and vision.

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    Re: Food-stamp use doubles

    Quote Originally Posted by Grant View Post
    People can probably survive on that if they are very cautious with their budgeting, but the idea is to work your way up from a $5 an hour job to one with more value. In order to do that some ambition is required, along with some education and vision.
    I'm sure that's what poor folk need, the knowledge on how to budget less than 900 bucks a month and the typical platitudes on how to better themsleves.
    “Capitalism is the astounding belief that the most wickedest of men will do the most wickedest of things for the greatest good of everyone.” John Maynard Keynes

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    Re: Food-stamp use doubles

    Quote Originally Posted by iliveonramen View Post
    I'm sure that's what poor folk need, the knowledge on how to budget less than 900 bucks a month and the typical platitudes on how to better themsleves.
    Nope. They "need" to be able to live a (lower?) middle class lifestyle on any full time employment, but generally must have minor children to "qualify". This is what we are constantly told by the left is "fair". They "need" to be able to buy medical care insurance for the "fair" price of 2% to 4% of their income and to spend no more than 33% of that income on "housing" expenses. Most of our income based social programs seek to turn ANY wage into a living wage - so long as dependents are involved.
    “The reasonable man adapts himself to the world: the unreasonable one persists to adapt the world to himself.
    Therefore all progress depends on the unreasonable man.” ― George Bernard Shaw, Man and Superman

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    Re: Food-stamp use doubles

    Quote Originally Posted by Grant View Post
    Those 'poor' are actually getting better off every because they have foreign investment. It is the locals who generally exploit the poor, not the multinationals.
    All these people in third world countries would much rather work for Volvo, Nike, GE, etc. then in one of the sweat shops in their neighborhoods where conditions are really primitive.
    Those people want to be working there because they have no other alternatives. You can make $0.10 at one sweat shop and $0.20 at another. Yes, the $0.20 an hour is better than the $0.10 but that doesn't make it good nor does it make it right.

    Now with the collapse of communism, and more free enterprise, Europe's recovery etc, there is far more competition then there used to be. Just being American and expecting success because of a circumstance of birth no longer applies. Americans, like everyone else, have to compete , educate themselves and work hard, something they once did better than anyone else anywhere.
    Please explain to me how one "competes" with slave shop wages and labor in other countries. Are you suggesting that in order to maintain employment that American workers should be working under the same conditions?

    Rather than erecting barriers they can, like everyone else, educate themselves, work harder, and meet the competition head on. This doesn't seem to be a satisfactory idea to many who would prefer shortcuts, but that has always been the only way.
    You really believe that Americans should lower themselves to horrors taking place around the world rather than support the values we fought for?
    “Most people do not listen with the intent to understand; they listen with the intent to reply.”
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    Re: Food-stamp use doubles

    Quote Originally Posted by iliveonramen View Post
    I'm sure that's what poor folk need, the knowledge on how to budget less than 900 bucks a month and the typical platitudes on how to better themsleves.
    You don't agree budgeting is important?

    Which 'platitudes' do you follow?

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    Re: Food-stamp use doubles

    Quote Originally Posted by muciti View Post
    Those people want to be working there because they have no other alternatives. You can make $0.10 at one sweat shop and $0.20 at another. Yes, the $0.20 an hour is better than the $0.10 but that doesn't make it good nor does it make it right.
    Unfortunately neither you or I can decide what is good and right in this world as far as a persons value is concerned. Whenever we hire someone we are hiring them in the expectation that we will profit from their labors, thought not necessarily in financial sense. If that profit, or satisfaction, isn't there than we will simply not hire them. You'd probably react the same way if someone said they wanted you to pay them more than you felt they were worth. Therefore its not a matter of good or bad but of value.

    Please explain to me how one "competes" with slave shop wages and labor in other countries. Are you suggesting that in order to maintain employment that American workers should be working under the same conditions?
    Not at all. You compete by having a better educated and motivated work force. The better treatment a person receives the more likely they are to respond with benefits to the employer. Most successful employers know and understand that. It is counterproductive to mistreat good employees.

    You really believe that Americans should lower themselves to horrors taking place around the world rather than support the values we fought for?
    No.

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    Re: Food-stamp use doubles

    Quote Originally Posted by Grant View Post
    You don't agree budgeting is important?

    Which 'platitudes' do you follow?
    I'm not saying it's not important I don't think that's the issue with folks in poverty. Even if you're eeking out a living and budgeting perfectly you have zero lattitude for stuff life inevitably throws at you. Your radiator goes out, a pipe busts, you get injured or sick whatever. When you're treading water things like that drown you.

    Well I generally follow the idea of helping thy neighbor.
    “Capitalism is the astounding belief that the most wickedest of men will do the most wickedest of things for the greatest good of everyone.” John Maynard Keynes

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    Re: Food-stamp use doubles

    Quote Originally Posted by ttwtt78640 View Post
    Nope. They "need" to be able to live a (lower?) middle class lifestyle on any full time employment, but generally must have minor children to "qualify". This is what we are constantly told by the left is "fair". They "need" to be able to buy medical care insurance for the "fair" price of 2% to 4% of their income and to spend no more than 33% of that income on "housing" expenses. Most of our income based social programs seek to turn ANY wage into a living wage - so long as dependents are involved.
    It's not that you need minor children to qualify it's just that the number of dependents you have is taken into consideration. Raising yourself on 14,000 a year is drastically different than raising yourself and a depedent on the same salary don't you agree?

    Ultimately...what do you advocate ttwtt? No minimum wage (force employees to pay livable wage) and no assistance? I could see being for one and not the other, no minimum wage but government assistance to balance out or minimum wage that's a livable wage but no assistance. Having neither though?
    “Capitalism is the astounding belief that the most wickedest of men will do the most wickedest of things for the greatest good of everyone.” John Maynard Keynes

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    Re: Food-stamp use doubles

    Quote Originally Posted by iliveonramen View Post
    I'm not saying it's not important I don't think that's the issue with folks in poverty. Even if you're eeking out a living and budgeting perfectly you have zero lattitude for stuff life inevitably throws at you. Your radiator goes out, a pipe busts, you get injured or sick whatever. When you're treading water things like that drown you.

    Well I generally follow the idea of helping thy neighbor.
    Good for you. It's a good philosophy and certainly not a platitude.

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    Re: Food-stamp use doubles

    I'm sure this has been mentioned (and ignored by partisans), but this is normal in the wake of a major recession. Welfare rolls and recipients are going to continue to go up as long as we cling to the trickle down fantasy. For 3 decades, wealth and money have been moving to upper income brackets and then moved out of the country. With the gutting of the manufacturing sector, moving assembly lines overseas, 10%-20% unemployment is to be expected. Why would companies hire here, when they can find labor for pennies elsewhere?

    Standard wholesale markup is 40%, iPhone 5 is selling for a 50% wholesale markup in China, but Apple makes a killing over here. American consumers pay for the lavish Apple offices, VP bonuses and salaries. Americans get paid less and overcharged more.

    Redistribution has to stop being a bad word. RW pundits have done a terrific job of associating taxes & government spending with communism and marxism. Like building/retrofitting a bridge or building is "marxist". A bridge that will speed up the flow of goods and consumption. Is paying your credit card bill Marxist? Then why is raising taxes on the wealthy to pay down the debt incurred through two unfunded wars and an unfunded medicare expansion? The Koch brothers don't want to pay for safety nets maintain a standard of living for their customer base.

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