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Thread: NY judge halts Bloomberg ban on large sugary drinks

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    Re: NY judge halts Bloomberg ban on large sugary drinks

    Quote Originally Posted by RedAkston View Post
    How does it do that? It was a state judge that shot this down, not a federal judge.
    Once Obamacare is fully implemented the State will have control of what you eat and drink with the argument that you are a health risk and thus a cost to the State. There are millions of Bloomberg types in this world who want to manage other people's lives, and Obama care has provided a great opportunity for them.

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    Re: NY judge halts Bloomberg ban on large sugary drinks

    NY judge halts Bloomberg ban on large sugary drinks
    Bloomberg, what a jack ass. He should pay more attention to running the city rather than trying to tell other people how to live...But like most statists, he just can't help himself....No wonder people are fleeing the NE.
    Americans are so enamored of equality that they would rather be equal in slavery than unequal in freedom.

    Alexis de Tocqueville

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    Re: NY judge halts Bloomberg ban on large sugary drinks

    Quote Originally Posted by sangha View Post
    Just curious: How many people here ever drink 32oz's of soda at one sitting?
    I do. And Im obese. My problem, no one elses. And its because I get far more calories from fried chicken and cookies, with no excercise. Soda is the least of my problems.
    Last edited by jonny5; 03-12-13 at 11:53 AM.

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    Re: NY judge halts Bloomberg ban on large sugary drinks

    Quote Originally Posted by laska View Post
    And obesity, cancer, diabetes, high health care costs run rampant. Take Tongan people, on the islands that are on traditional whole food diet the best athletes come from and there is no trace of cancer, diabetes, etc. The islands that have adopted the western diet have high rates of these diseases. Wise government would protect freedom and stop the for profit food and beverage industries from addicting people on sugar highs to maximize profits and slowly killing people. They kill far more people than we lose in wars like WWii and Vietnam. So I say kudos to Bloomberg.
    People should be free to kill themselves. Telling them they cant is the opposite of freedom.

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    Re: NY judge halts Bloomberg ban on large sugary drinks

    Quote Originally Posted by TheNextEra View Post
    I know this isn't Bloomberg's reasoning behind doing this, however, the counter of not having a soda ban (Or any food ban for that manner) should be that obese people should pay higher insurance premiums for their "big boy" choices when their obescity starts to cause illnesses and diseases that need to be covered by medical costs.

    If people are going to make bad choices on their health, other healthy people shouldn't be stuck with their bill and be charged at the same rate.

    Again, just in case anyone is getting confused with what I'm saying, I don't want government intervention on food and drink. I just think that people should be responsible for their decisions as well.
    What happened to that great American principle of equality under the law? Why stop at obese people? Besides, don't obese people, those who smoke, those who participate in risky activity, etc. already pay higher health insurance premiums based on their lifestyle choices? And since when in America are other people paying for a person's healthcare services? Do you think doing a knee replacement operation on an obese person costs more than a knee replacement operation on a fit jogger who blows out his/her knee? Why not charge more for operations on athletes since they're far more likely to break something than the average person.

    There are very few people alive who won't avoid the purchase of healthcare services as much as they possibly can. People don't consume certain foods/beverages because they want to screw the healthcare system. Mostly, they consume them because they taste good and they cost less than many healthy choices.

    This bylaw was struck down for the simple reason that it treated the same product differently in two different settings. You could buy a bottled beverage in the local grocery store but you couldn't buy the same product, the same size, next door at the McDonalds. It was also struck down because it was created by an unelected body that was not accountable to the public - the Bloomberg appointed health board.

    I find it remarkable that some people in a free society think it's okay to have a single person or a small group of people dictate to over 8 million people in metropolitan New York what size softdrink they can purchase.

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    Re: NY judge halts Bloomberg ban on large sugary drinks

    Quote Originally Posted by CanadaJohn View Post
    What happened to that great American principle of equality under the law? Why stop at obese people? Besides, don't obese people, those who smoke, those who participate in risky activity, etc. already pay higher health insurance premiums based on their lifestyle choices?
    Smokers do, but in many cases higher risk people that are Obsese, or those who partisicpate in risky activities DON'T pay more and that is the issue.

    Quote Originally Posted by CanadaJohn View Post
    And since when in America are other people paying for a person's healthcare services? Do you think doing a knee replacement operation on an obese person costs more than a knee replacement operation on a fit jogger who blows out his/her knee? Why not charge more for operations on athletes since they're far more likely to break something than the average person.
    I was mainly refering to things like Diabetis, liver damage, etc. But yes, knee replacements could be included in that as well.

    Quote Originally Posted by CanadaJohn View Post
    There are very few people alive who won't avoid the purchase of healthcare services as much as they possibly can. People don't consume certain foods/beverages because they want to screw the healthcare system. Mostly, they consume them because they taste good and they cost less than many healthy choices.
    If obescity is not included, why have smokers pay more than?

    Quote Originally Posted by CanadaJohn View Post
    This bylaw was struck down for the simple reason that it treated the same product differently in two different settings. You could buy a bottled beverage in the local grocery store but you couldn't buy the same product, the same size, next door at the McDonalds. It was also struck down because it was created by an unelected body that was not accountable to the public - the Bloomberg appointed health board.
    Like I said, I don't buy Bloomberg's reasoning nor do I buy into having the government do that. However, I do think there are risky behaviors that should charge more than those that aren't doing those risky behaviors.

    Quote Originally Posted by CanadaJohn View Post
    I find it remarkable that some people in a free society think it's okay to have a single person or a small group of people dictate to over 8 million people in metropolitan New York what size softdrink they can purchase.
    I don't think it's okay for government to decide that.

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    Re: NY judge halts Bloomberg ban on large sugary drinks

    Any free society must have rule of law. A lot of my political philosophy derives from understanding existence requires opposing forces in all things and laws that organize creations. In a broud spiritual/physical sense that means if there is light there must be darkness and laws organize each. Obedience to laws that organize light bring blessings and freedom, obedience to laws that organize darkness brings misery and slavery. So if there is good health of the body then there is bad health, laws pertaining to each, freedom is obedience to healthy nutritional laws, you avoid disease, have ability to live live like you want and not be enslaved by sickness and disease. The purpose of government is to protect freedom. Laws should mirror the laws found in nature of, speaking broadly, that of light, anything good. Shuld companies be able to have the "freedom" of massively polluting the environment or should laws be against it to protect the real freedom of everyone having clean air to breathe and pure water to drink. Obviously a no brainer real freedom here requires laws that restrict the negative actions of the polluting companies. The food and beverage industry knowingly designs foods that takes out key nutrients in order to keep the feeling full mechanism of the body out of the way and loads it with corn syrup and sugar so kids and everyone else get addicted to the sugar highs. This drastically increases demand and profits. We know these processed foods cause high rates of all kinds of diseases such as heart disease, cancer, diabetes, etc. Weakens the people of the nation. For example cancer, I have read where some doctors think pretty much most healthy people produce cancer cells but that the immune system in a healthy person destroys them before they spread. But sugar causes the immune system to sleep for up to 8 hours. So a diet high in sugar causes a weaker immune system. So we let these companies get pretty much all of our kids addicted for life to these products and lessen their freedom throughout life with weaker bodies and millions of people suffer horrible painful deaths from all the diseases from the diet. So yes, I would like to have government pass laws that turn the entire food and beverage industry to whole foods and water/natural juices. People will have the freedom of course to buy whatever whole foods they want, and they can create anything unhealthy they want in their own kitchens. load up on the lard, grease, whatever. But businesses should not be able to sell these things.

    If you are against regulation of the food and beverage industries do you think they should be allowed to put anything in the food, cocaine, rat poison, etc? Are you against rules of behavior at your job, I mean that is restricting your "freedom". Do you have a problem with laws of gravity" It restricts your freedom from jumping off a cliff.

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    Re: NY judge halts Bloomberg ban on large sugary drinks

    Quote Originally Posted by jonny5 View Post
    People should be free to kill themselves. Telling them they cant is the opposite of freedom.
    Maybe but can you have the freedom to kill others. Food and beverage industry sells to kids their addictive and harmful products. Also healthy people pay for a lot of health care costs of people making bad nutritional choices.

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    Re: NY judge halts Bloomberg ban on large sugary drinks

    I actually think life is a gift. We didn't create it so suicide is wrong. and should be illegal also. I'd be a big hit at Libertarian rallies. Freedom to do anything and everything we want YEAH!!! Too bad there must be cause and effect. Boo!

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    Re: NY judge halts Bloomberg ban on large sugary drinks

    Quote Originally Posted by laska View Post
    If you are against regulation of the food and beverage industries do you think they should be allowed to put anything in the food, cocaine, rat poison, etc? Are you against rules of behavior at your job, I mean that is restricting your "freedom". Do you have a problem with laws of gravity" It restricts your freedom from jumping off a cliff.
    Your argument is not related to the issue at hand. This is not a case about regulating the food and beverage industry since the bylaw did not ban the sale of the product, it only banned the sale of the product in certain sizes at certain locations. Under the bylaw, I could walk into McDonalds and buy four 10 ounce Cokes but I couldn't buy one 40 ounce Coke. Likewise, I could walk into the local grocery store and buy a family size bottle of Coke but I couldn't buy the 40 ounce cup next door at McDonalds.

    It would be an entirely different discussion if, like with smoking, it was determined that the product itself is inherently unhealthy and its sale should be regulated in all locations equally. With smoking, as an example, you can't freely buy 20 cigarettes individually yet not purchase a package of 20 cigarettes because if you smoke all 20 you do more harm to yourself than if you smoke just one.

    I may be far more in line with your position if you were to be in favor of banning certain levels of sugar from all products - but then you'd have the good folks in Louisiana after you - I'm strongly opposed to any attempt to limit consumption of a legal product.

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