Page 1 of 12 12311 ... LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 112

Thread: How a U.S. Citizen Came to Be in America’s Cross Hairs

  1. #1
    Curmudgeon


    LowDown's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Location
    Houston
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 05:24 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian
    Posts
    11,541
    Blog Entries
    11

    How a U.S. Citizen Came to Be in America’s Cross Hairs

    How a US Citizen Came to Be in America's Cross Hairs

    It was the culmination of years of painstaking intelligence work, intense deliberation by lawyers working for President Obama and turf fights between the Pentagon and the C.I.A., whose parallel drone wars converged on the killing grounds of Yemen. For what was apparently the first time since the Civil War, the United States government had carried out the deliberate killing of an American citizen as a wartime enemy and without a trial.
    This lengthy apologia for Obama's drone strike on Anwar al-Awlaki, his 16 year old son, and another American of marginal importance in Yemen is supposed to impress us with how meticulous the administration was about the legal issues surrounding the kill.

    We learn that two lawyers who wrote "the definitive" critique of Bush's assertion of presidential wartime powers miraculously were able to find a way to justify the Obama administrations' actions with regard to Anwar-al-Awlaki. Well of course they were. They found a way to have their cake and eat it, too, saying that what Bush did, or rather how Bush's administration justified what was being done, was not legally correct and their justification for what Obama did was legally correct. A fine pair of cynical partisan lawyers they. I'm sure al-Awlaki is relieved to learn that his death was not the result of the President claiming too much authority but rather was the result of legal hair splitting over how much of an imminent threat to the US he, al-Awlaki, really was.

    This article in the New York Times, linked above, also, I think, is supposed to impress us about how much of a one off thing al-Awlaki's assassination was and that this administration wouldn't consider killing American's anywhere without going through a painful and lengthy legal process. However, I come away with the impression that the administration's lawyers will find a way to justify whatever the President wants to do regardless of what it is even if it directly contradicts what those lawyers have written and opined in the past.

    So, hypocritical as it might seem, they found their legal pretext to nail al-Awlaki, but not the other two. Not al-Awlaki's son or the guy whose sins against America amounted to publishing a blog. The latter two were taken out as collateral damage, a reminder that what we are talking about is war, a blunt instrument and one not well suited to legal niceties.

    Failing to draw a hard line between war powers and civilian legalities does damage to both.

    "The urge to save humanity is almost always a false front for the urge to rule." --HL Mencken

  2. #2
    Sometimes wrong

    ttwtt78640's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2012
    Location
    Uhland, Texas
    Last Seen
    Today @ 12:18 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian
    Posts
    34,552

    Re: How a U.S. Citizen Came to Be in America’s Cross Hairs

    I prefer this zapping method to the "show trial" alternative used for UBL's son-in-law, or the GITMO "detainees". Yanking a Jihad "warrior" out of a foreign land, charging him with "cheerlleading" for the 9/11/2001 attacks and supplying him with US tax funded defense council is insane. The number of Muslim morons that cheered the 9/11 attacks is nearly endless, yet we pick only a select few for "special" treatment, some linger in GITMO, some in other jail cells, yet all at massive expense to US taxpayers.

    Bin Laden son-in-law pleads not guilty, lawmakers blast move to use civilian courts | FM News Weekly
    “The reasonable man adapts himself to the world: the unreasonable one persists to adapt the world to himself.
    Therefore all progress depends on the unreasonable man.” ― George Bernard Shaw, Man and Superman

  3. #3
    Sage
    VanceMack's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Last Seen
    Today @ 02:10 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    54,618

    Re: How a U.S. Citizen Came to Be in America’s Cross Hairs

    Targeting terrorists in foreign lands require some extreme measures. If they were hiding out in Michigan...then they would have been entitled to protections of the Constitution and subject to the law of the land. By becoming a terrorist and hiding out in foreign lands...well...all I can say is "Nice shootin' Tex." Obama should ABSOLUTELY continue to target terrorists at home and abroad. The rules change based on the playing field. Would you have been aghast had a republican president aggressively targeted terrorists in other lands, regardless of nationality?

  4. #4
    Advisor TML's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    Texas
    Last Seen
    09-23-15 @ 09:45 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Other
    Posts
    520

    Re: How a U.S. Citizen Came to Be in America’s Cross Hairs

    Quote Originally Posted by LowDown View Post
    The latter two were taken out as collateral damage, a reminder that what we are talking about is war, a blunt instrument and one not well suited to legal niceties.

    Failing to draw a hard line between war powers and civilian legalities does damage to both.
    Failing to clearly define the enemy is equally damaging. Who, exactly, are we at war against? Iran? Iraq? Afghanistan? Pakistan? Libya? Syria? Mali? Yemen? Palestine? Lebanon? Egypt? The "terrorist"? The Islamist "extremist"? A religion called Islam? The Taliban (who we trained and armed)? Al-Qaida (who we trained as well, and seem to be as elusive and vaguely wide spread as "terrorism")?

    Exactly who are we at war with?

  5. #5
    Banned
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Location
    Chicago
    Last Seen
    10-30-14 @ 12:38 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian
    Posts
    7,908

    Re: How a U.S. Citizen Came to Be in America’s Cross Hairs

    The real problem here is what is defined as a "terrorist" considering the word is so subjective.

    Is someone that defends their civil liberties a "terrorist?"

    Is killing government officials who come to confiscate your guns a terrorist action or patriotism??? Waco and Ruby Ridge are good examples and certainly precedent.

    Is someone that says "no" to the government an enemy combatant, hence authorizing drone strikes on their compound or home?

  6. #6
    Banned
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Location
    Chicago
    Last Seen
    10-30-14 @ 12:38 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian
    Posts
    7,908

    Re: How a U.S. Citizen Came to Be in America’s Cross Hairs

    Quote Originally Posted by TML View Post
    Failing to clearly define the enemy is equally damaging. Who, exactly, are we at war against? Iran? Iraq? Afghanistan? Pakistan? Libya? Syria? Mali? Yemen? Palestine? Lebanon? Egypt? The "terrorist"? The Islamist "extremist"? A religion called Islam? The Taliban (who we trained and armed)? Al-Qaida (who we trained as well, and seem to be as elusive and vaguely wide spread as "terrorism")?

    Exactly who are we at war with?
    I think our present government is at war with anyone (including US citizens) that say "no" to their loony demands.

  7. #7
    long standing member
    justabubba's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Last Seen
    Today @ 12:55 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    36,129

    Re: How a U.S. Citizen Came to Be in America’s Cross Hairs

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr.Nick View Post
    I think our present government is at war with anyone (including US citizens) that say "no" to their loony demands.
    so, you agree that this target was viewed as the 'enemy' of our nation
    making him a legitimate military target, no matter his birth heritage
    we are negotiating about dividing a pizza and in the meantime israel is eating it
    once you're over the hill you begin to pick up speed

  8. #8
    King Conspiratard
    Dr. Chuckles's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Last Seen
    02-13-14 @ 03:04 PM
    Lean
    Slightly Conservative
    Posts
    12,895

    Re: How a U.S. Citizen Came to Be in America’s Cross Hairs

    I can't help to think most republican opposition to the program is the same as most of the new found support for it among democrats: idiots playing team politics.

    Sad that even an issue such as this becomes nothing more than fodder for political grievences

  9. #9
    Curmudgeon


    LowDown's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Location
    Houston
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 05:24 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian
    Posts
    11,541
    Blog Entries
    11

    Re: How a U.S. Citizen Came to Be in America’s Cross Hairs

    Quote Originally Posted by TML View Post
    Failing to clearly define the enemy is equally damaging. Who, exactly, are we at war against? Iran? Iraq? Afghanistan? Pakistan? Libya? Syria? Mali? Yemen? Palestine? Lebanon? Egypt? The "terrorist"? The Islamist "extremist"? A religion called Islam? The Taliban (who we trained and armed)? Al-Qaida (who we trained as well, and seem to be as elusive and vaguely wide spread as "terrorism")?

    Exactly who are we at war with?
    That's for the Commander in Chief to determine.

    "The urge to save humanity is almost always a false front for the urge to rule." --HL Mencken

  10. #10
    Advisor TML's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    Texas
    Last Seen
    09-23-15 @ 09:45 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Other
    Posts
    520

    Re: How a U.S. Citizen Came to Be in America’s Cross Hairs

    Quote Originally Posted by LowDown View Post
    That's for the Commander in Chief to determine.
    Wrong... Article 1 Section 8 provides Congress the power to declare war, which would include defining our enemy, not the whims of a single man.

Page 1 of 12 12311 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •